The Criterion Collection

[Scottie]

Which version of The Gold Rush do you guys prefer?

I've admittedly never been able to get into the 1942 version as the narration threw me off when I started it. From what I understand, though, it's Chaplin's preferred version.

[WillieMLF]

Originally Posted by ShellOilJunior

I think the packaging screw up might increase the value of the blu-ray set much like the infamous Billy Ripken error card.



They probably won't be releasing The Seventh Seal on UHD after today's news.

How about the Jimmy Crack Corn Cassavetes box?

[Warm Gun]

Originally Posted by AdmiralNoodles

ANYWAY, I've quite a lot of Criterion titles on my DVD Netflix queue. Have two discs at a time Blu-ray disc option and unlimited. The most obvious being Akira Kurosawa on there. Was going to add some Toshiro Mifune, French New Wave, and other randomness. No titles I already own from other companies.

I'm disappointed that Netflix hardly seems to add new Criterion Blu-rays to their collection anymore. Search almost any Criterion release from the last few years and you will find only the DVD or nothing. I don't expect the service to be around much longer. I'll keep renting until it's over.

[yoloswegmaster420]

Originally Posted by Scholer

This has a very recently done 4K HDR remaster, probably not a likely title for Criterion to issue an UHD upgrade for, but the master should be up for grabs for other distributors abroad.



Criterion just minted a ready 4K HDR master, and the other 2 films in the Wajda War Trilogy also had 4K HDR redos.



All of these had very recent in-house 4K HDR remasters at Criterion, and if Criterion ever goes UHD, it would be insane to keep these titles BD only for too long.



Given how long it took for the film to transition to home video despite its initial acclaim, I wouldn’t hold my breath for a 4K re-release. It doesn’t even currently have a 4K master.

Do you have any sources on these titles receiving HDR? I can't seem to find anything saying that they do. I can't even find anything saying that Andrej Wajda's 'A Generation' has received a 4K restoration, let alone a HDR pass being created for it.

[StarDestroyer52]

Originally Posted by Scottie

Which version of The Gold Rush do you guys prefer?

I've admittedly never been able to get into the 1942 version as the narration threw me off when I started it. From what I understand, though, it's Chaplin's preferred version.

I always preferred the 1925 version. Even though the 42 version is Chaplin's preferred version, the narration just aggravates me.

[BluBonnet]

Originally Posted by Warm Gun

I'm disappointed that Netflix hardly seems to add new Criterion Blu-rays to their collection anymore. Search almost any Criterion release from the last few years and you will find only the DVD or nothing. I don't expect the service to be around much longer. I'll keep renting until it's over.

Have you tried the local library? Many are still getting the blu-rays.

[Scholer]

Originally Posted by yoloswegmaster420

Do you have any sources on these titles receiving HDR? I can't seem to find anything saying that they do. I can't even find anything saying that Andrej Wajda's 'A Generation' has received a 4K restoration, let alone a HDR pass being created for it.

Anything Criterion does in 4K post Blood Simple has an HDR pass for DCP delivery. The Apu Trilogy which was done earlier originally didn’t have one, but Lee Kline mentioned that almost all their 4K complete titles (even B&W) were eventually given HDR passes, and that they are transitioning more of those to HDR all the time.

As for the Wajdas, many of his films have had 4K restorations completed in 2014, through the Film Foundation. I don’t have a source with an explicit mention of A Generation’s restoration, but it was one of the 21 titles here:

https://www.artsatl.org/preview-emor...polish-cinema/

The Wajda titles were all overseen by the director and the original DPs where available, but releases of these restorations have been slow. Kanal for instance only showed in the new 4K at Cannes last year. I also think the Japanese release got the new 4K masters for their BD release, but never got verification:

https://www.amazon.co.jp/Polska-Film...=AN1VRQENFRJN5

Edit: Based on translated reviews on Amazon JP, the Japanese release seems to be derive from dated masters.

[Professor Echo]

Originally Posted by StarDestroyer52

I always preferred the 1925 version. Even though the 42 version is Chaplin's preferred version, the narration just aggravates me.

Chaplin was the George Lucas/William Friedkin revisionist goofball of his day. I don't think ANY of Chaplin's "preferred versions" are as good as his originals. That's why I still watch the DVD of THE KID and don't care about the Criterion edition. YMMV.

[Warm Gun]

Originally Posted by BluBonnet

Have you tried the local library? Many are still getting the blu-rays.

I went and checked the biggest public libary sometime last year and found it closed. Haven't checked since the COVID restrictions have lightened. Might on my next bike ride.

[Gacivory]

Originally Posted by Scholer

Anything Criterion does in 4K post Blood Simple has an HDR pass for DCP delivery. The Apu Trilogy which was done earlier originally didn’t have one, but Lee Kline mentioned that almost all their 4K complete titles (even B&W) were eventually given HDR passes, and that they are transitioning more of those to HDR all the time.

As for the Wajdas, many if his films have had 4K restorations completed in 2014, through the Film Foundation. I don’t have a source with an explicit mention of A Generation’s restoration, but it was one of the 21 titles here:

https://www.artsatl.org/preview-emor...polish-cinema/

The Wajda titles were all overseen by the director and the original DPs where available, but releases of these restorations have been slow. Kanal for instance only showed in the new 4K at Cannes last year. I also think the Japanese release got the new 4K masters for their BD release, but never got verification:

https://www.amazon.co.jp/Polska-Film...=AN1VRQENFRJN5

I hope the Wanda films happen. But I will be slightly annoyed because I just bought a few of them from overseas.

[moviebuffed]

Originally Posted by StarDestroyer52

I always preferred the 1925 version. Even though the 42 version is Chaplin's preferred version, the narration just aggravates me.

I agree with you 100%. It's a 1925 silent film, viewing it as such is the best IMO.

[StarDestroyer52]

Originally Posted by Professor Echo

Chaplin was the George Lucas/William Friedkin revisionist goofball of his day. I don't think ANY of Chaplin's "preferred versions" are as good as his originals. That's why I still watch the DVD of THE KID and don't care about the Criterion edition. YMMV.

Yep, and that's one of the major things that aggravates me with Chaplin's preferred versions.

[RCRochester]

Originally Posted by Scottie

Which version of The Gold Rush do you guys prefer?

I've admittedly never been able to get into the 1942 version as the narration threw me off when I started it. From what I understand, though, it's Chaplin's preferred version.

I'm kind of a purist, so I prefer the original 20s version.

[Rayjg]

He was definitely a tinkerer. He hired Josef von Sternberg to make A Woman of the Sea, didn't like it, and reshot most of it himself. He still wasn't satisfied and never released it. There aren't too many filmmakers who can get away with that, let alone afford to. The only example I can think of is Woody Allen. He tried to stop the release of Manhattan and even offered to buy it. He shot September at least three times with different casts and still wasn't completely satisfied.

[RCRochester]

Originally Posted by Rayjg

He was definitely a tinkerer. He hired Josef von Sternberg to make A Woman of the Sea, didn't like it, and reshot most of it himself. He still wasn't satisfied and never released it. There aren't too many filmmakers who can get away with that, let alone afford to. The only example I can think of is Woody Allen. He tried to stop the release of Manhattan and even offered to buy it. He shot September at least three times with different casts and still wasn't completely satisfied.

Bit of an exaggeration there. He shot September once, scrapped it and filmed it again some different cast members, which was the version released.

[jkoffman]

Originally Posted by WillieMLF

How about the Jimmy Crack Corn Cassavetes box?

I don't even know what this mean, but it made me laugh.

[jkoffman]

Originally Posted by Professor Echo

Chaplin was the George Lucas/William Friedkin revisionist goofball of his day. I don't think ANY of Chaplin's "preferred versions" are as good as his originals. That's why I still watch the DVD of THE KID and don't care about the Criterion edition. YMMV.

Oof. Did not know this about CC's The Kid. I see they included scenes from the original cut, but I wonder why they wouldn't have just included that cut as well? Anyway, DVD is the only place to see the original release of The Kid? Which DVD do you recommend?

[Egbert Souse]

Originally Posted by Professor Echo

Chaplin was the George Lucas/William Friedkin revisionist goofball of his day. I don't think ANY of Chaplin's "preferred versions" are as good as his originals. That's why I still watch the DVD of THE KID and don't care about the Criterion edition. YMMV.

I do think The Kid is better in the shorter cut, but The Gold Rush is vastly superior in the reconstruction of the silent cut. Comparing to Lucas or Friedkin is kind of silly considering Chaplin was mostly working around film elements not existing or in proper shape anymore, plus a motivation to make the films seem easier to watch for presentation.

Perhaps Chaplin even doubted whether the narration worked that well since he didn't do the same for his other films.

Originally Posted by jkoffman

Oof. Did not know this about CC's The Kid. I see they included scenes from the original cut, but I wonder why they wouldn't have just included that cut as well? Anyway, DVD is the only place to see the original release of The Kid? Which DVD do you recommend?

The 2000 Image DVD features a reconstruction of the 1921 cut using the deleted footage, the 1972 reissue version, and a re-edit of that version's score. Just like how The Circus has a modified version of its 1969 reissue cut that simply changes the opening titles to just text and music (sans Chaplin's vocals) and also has some speed correction. An approximation, but by no means original. I would have been curious to see the 16mm print in its entirety that Criterion sourced the original main titles and intertitles from for the supplement

[Professor Echo]

Originally Posted by jkoffman

Oof. Did not know this about CC's The Kid. I see they included scenes from the original cut, but I wonder why they wouldn't have just included that cut as well? Anyway, DVD is the only place to see the original release of The Kid? Which DVD do you recommend?

I find the original cut of THE KID far superior to the edited version and it's too bad that Chaplin was consistently rethinking his efforts. From what I’ve read the excised footage of the film was not restored for the Criterion edition at the request of the Chaplin estate, due to Chaplin’s own wishes that his revised films be the only ones ever presented again. I don’t know how true that is though because Criterion was able to include the earlier version oF THE GOLD RUSH.

The best version of the original, uncut THE KID came out on DVD from Image Entertainment:

[Show spoiler]

Originally Posted by Egbert Souse

Comparing to Lucas or Friedkin is kind of silly considering Chaplin was mostly working around film elements not existing or in proper shape anymore, plus a motivation to make the films seem easier to watch for presentation.

You're putting up a bit of smokescreen here. Lucas and Friedkin felt their revisions were just as necessary as Chaplin did even if their individual "motivation" might be different. The end result is that the director chooses to alter what they previously did, regardless of how you want to qualify it. You can choose to see the comparison as silly, but it doesn't change the fact that all three of guilty of doing the same thing.

[Rayjg]

Originally Posted by RCRochester

Bit of an exaggeration there. He shot September once, scrapped it and filmed it again some different cast members, which was the version released.

I know he changed the lead actor at least three times into filming. Walken started but left very early and then he finished it with a second lead actor before scrapping that footage. A few other actors may have been recast too.