The Criterion Collection

[DLizzle]

Using the Hollis Frampton set as an example of an exciting release is a pretty good indicator that your feelings are just miles away from 99% of other Criterion consumers.

They are a business at the end of the day. Any question of "why did they release x movie over y movie, or put y movie on an Eclipse set instead of blu-ray", can probably be answered with money/economics. Also, they are far from objective and don't pretend to be imo. They obviously have a relationship with Soderbergh that led to the Spaulding Gray titles and Traffic.

[SpiderBaby]

Originally Posted by Yami

I 100% agree. While it's nice to see titles like Harold and Maude that sort of border the line between cinephilia and mainstream, there needs to be some sort of balance. No doubt this will just be disregarded as a self-centred "why won't they release what I want" moan but it just baffles me that Criterion relegate what should be mainline titles to Eclipse.

Originally Posted by DLizzle

Using the Hollis Frampton set as an example of an exciting release is a pretty good indicator that your feelings are just miles away from 99% of other Criterion consumers.

I'm sure this does sound like "why won't they release what I want" but there are 2 people looking at this situation. 1 that sees Chaplin announced and say "Oh boy! I can't wait to watch this!" and the other "How many times do I have to hear about Chaplin again". One person is new to these films, while the other wants something new. Heck, I like Godard, but I get tired of hearing about his films. I would rather discuss BRAZILIAN MARGINAL CINEMA or something. Some people would rather discuss how cool Drive is. So I understand the 2 sides.


The release that kind of ticks me off is the Gorin films. Gorin has done how many features/interviews for other films with Criterion now? alot. They have had these films for a while as well. Years later, they are dumped on Eclipse (btw, I love the Eclipse releases, but not the line itself. The films, not what are done with them).

[oildude]

Originally Posted by SpiderBaby

I never said there is a Daisies Blu-ray, so he might of had things mixed up. I have said there is a Daisies dvd release already out by Second Run and had one in the U.S. with Facets. It deserves a blu-ray, but Criterion's opinion on what gets what is up to them.

Yep, I was mixed up and like I said, I was not sure. It was late night when I posted and as I was thinking of known examples of blu-rays available elsewhere that are DVD-only in the Eclipse series, I remembered reading some discussion here about Daisies being available in Europe. Thanks for clarifying this.

And thanks for pointing out some good recommendations on films. Thanks to you, I have discovered People on Sunday, Jean Vigo, and others. Great relatively unknown films (at least to me) getting high quality releases, and expanding my appreciation of world cinema.

[Yami]

Eclipse titles available elsewhere on Blu-Ray:

Equinox Flower (BFI, UK)
Late Autumn (BFI, UK)
No Regrets for Our Youth (Toho, JP) (Not English Friendly)
One Wonderful Sunday (Toho, JP) (Not English Friendly)
I Live in Fear (Toho, JP) (Not English Friendly)
Osaka Elegy (Artificial Eye, UK)
Sisters of the Gion (Artificial Eye, UK)
Sanshiro Sugata (Toho, JP) (Not English Friendly)
The Most Beautiful (Toho, JP) (Not English Friendly)
Sanshiro Sugata Part II (Toho, JP) (Not English Friendly)
The Men Who Tread on the Tiger's Tail (Toho, JP) (Not English Friendly)

All that I know of at least.

[georgec]

Posted this in the Three Colors thread but wanted to get broader feedback on this.

I received my White disc yesterday, but no email or certificate for $10 like others got. Am I the only one that didn't get the certificate? Is there any chance I can write and request it successfully?

Not to be greedy, but I had to mail in my disc like everyone else who did get a certificate.

[octagon]

Originally Posted by SpiderBaby

I'm sure this does sound like "why won't they release what I want" but there are 2 people looking at this situation. 1 that sees Chaplin announced and say "Oh boy! I can't wait to watch this!" and the other "How many times do I have to hear about Chaplin again". One person is new to these films, while the other wants something new. Heck, I like Godard, but I get tired of hearing about his films. I would rather discuss BRAZILIAN MARGINAL CINEMA or something. Some people would rather discuss how cool Drive is. So I understand the 2 sides.

It sounds a lot like that and I'm not sure anything after the 'but' makes it sound any less so. I'm assuming you intended to draw some clear distinction between the Chaplin/Godard/Drive crowd wanting what they want and the Brazilian Marginal Cinema crowd wanting what they want but I can't say I'm seeing it.

[IronWaffle]

The Criterion Cast points out that supplements have been removed from Harold and Maude's listing.

[IronWaffle]

Originally Posted by georgec

Posted this in the Three Colors thread but wanted to get broader feedback on this.

I received my White disc yesterday, but no email or certificate for $10 like others got. Am I the only one that didn't get the certificate? Is there any chance I can write and request it successfully?

Not to be greedy, but I had to mail in my disc like everyone else who did get a certificate.

Please post the result if you proceed. I wrote three weeks ago to get the ball rolling on my replacement. No response. Wrote again a week later. No response. I don't want to send out the disc into the ethers, not knowing what to expect.

[retablo]

Originally Posted by IronWaffle

The Criterion Cast points out that supplements have been removed from Harold and Maude's listing.

Foe that amount of supplements, the price should drop to $29.9. That's my only problem with Criterion lately... charging $40 for what should be a $30 disc.

[Darkcritic]

Originally Posted by SpiderBaby

Just read CriterionForum today for discussions on this. 2-3 years ago these films would of had mainline releases (most likely dvd only, which is cool, as long as they restored them and gave them the releases they deserve). Today, they don't seem to care.

For every Hollis Frampton set today, we will have 30+ releases that either has a blu-ray in the U.S. (Traffic), is widely available (Chaplin), or something widely known that needs no discovering (Being John Malkovich). People can use the laserdisc days as an example, but after more than a decade of doing great on dvd, having switch back to the "laserdisc ways of releasing" is kind of a kick in the face. Of course they get a bigger crowd (never seen so many people on a Criterion forum/site/page as I do with the Facebook page) by releasing the "big name titles" but who the **** will release that hardly seen masterpiece Limite (Mário Peixoto, 1931, one of my fav films btw) or any other small, "obscure" (not in a bad way people), film from a country (not having to do with Japan, France, America, etc) that needs help being discovered? The fact that most "Criterion fans" seem to not care about that sucks to be honest with you. I guess that is the reason though. Most people are fans of Criterion and whatever they release, and others, like me, are a "fan" of what they release. To me, it's been a little better this year (in terms of the rate of releasing those "gem" releases), because last year sucked out loud.

Originally Posted by Yami

I 100% agree. While it's nice to see titles like Harold and Maude that sort of border the line between cinephilia and mainstream, there needs to be some sort of balance. No doubt this will just be disregarded as a self-centred "why won't they release what I want" moan but it just baffles me that Criterion relegate what should be mainline titles to Eclipse. They're not money-grabbing either because Frampton is hardly going to make the Facebook crowd offer up their wallets. Materials could be an issue but where there's a will (and money) there's a way and judging from the more-than-acceptable releases from Second Run, it wouldn't be too difficult to get selected Czech titles in HD.

Traffic was one bizarre release. It's not like it's much of an upgrade over the existing release like, say, Spartacus would be. Limite, A Page of Madness, Eustache, the Taiwan New Wave, Uchida, O Drakos and many more unavailable titles should be a priority.

Completely agree with both of you. I am not against the more "mainstream" kind of releases, there are lots of people who actually love these films so I am sure not everyone is unhappy, but I think there should be a better balance between this kind of things. Taking the latest announcements as an example, I think the line-up could have been miles better if Criterion managed to balance things out. Keeping Shallow Grave but releasing just one Soderbergh instead of two and adding in its place a release in the same vein as the Hollis Frampton set. This would keep most people excited as there would be something fro everyone. In my opinion, the closest they have gotten to something like that was the April slate. We had the Hollis Frampton set, Alambrista! and Pearls of the Czech New Wave set for those wanting something "new" but also The Organizer, Late Spring and Harold and Maude for those looking for something they already love. I am sure if every month is like that there would be far fewer people unsatisfied. They should not quit what they are doing but instead trying to be more even each month .

[Hawkguy]

Completely agree with SpiderBaby's post/opinion here (won't quote it over again). To me, it doesn't sound like 'why won't they release what I want' at all. It's more a matter of what Criterion meant/produced in their 'DVD era' and the shift they've made now. The 'why won't they release what I want' opinion usually stands out to me from the members that want the more widely-known films, that other studios could be releasing or ones that already have been released elsewhere (the 'facebook' crowd, basically). It's because, comparing their 'DVD era' with what was put out by other studios at the time, clearly Criterion had a more diverse offering that what they put out now, there were more of those 'obscure' titles referenced here, more 'discoveries'. Now, while there's other companies releasing lesser-known works on BD, I doubt any of them put out as much product as consistently as Criterion does. So, to me, it isn't 'greedy' (not that that word was used anywhere) to find disappointment in what's currently being released considering, as SpiderBaby put it, if they don't release any more, or as many, of the more 'obscure' titles that need discovering, we're much less likely to see them at all.

[SpiderBaby]

Originally Posted by octagon

It sounds a lot like that and I'm not sure anything after the 'but' makes it sound any less so. I'm assuming you intended to draw some clear distinction between the Chaplin/Godard/Drive crowd wanting what they want and the Brazilian Marginal Cinema crowd wanting what they want but I can't say I'm seeing it.

it's ok.

[Yami]

Is there some sort of legal hold-up preventing a release of Limite? Recently restored by the World Cinema Foundation, praised to the hills from everyone from Welles to Eisenstein to Bowie and with extras already available in the form of Mario's Sea and Onde a Terra Acaba, I can't understand why Criterion, MoC or Kino haven't released it yet. Of course, there's always a chance they'll do so soon...

[SpiderBaby]

Originally Posted by Yami

Is there some sort of legal hold-up preventing a release of Limite? Recently restored by the World Cinema Foundation, praised to the hills from everyone from Welles to Eisenstein to Bowie and with extras already available in the form of Mario's Sea, I can't understand why Criterion, MoC or Kino haven't released it yet. Of course, there's always a chance they'll do so soon...

Criterion was rumored to release the World Cinema Foundation films seems like 2 years ago. Boxsets are rumored. Don't know what the hold up is, but hoping Limite (which I consider a huge title and one I very much favor) is a separate mainline release and not shoved into a random boxset.

I have e-mailed them about it before. Might try to get on that again.

[SpiderBaby]

Hey TJS_Blu,

Did you ever purchase those Henri Storck films?

[Yami]

I could see a box of the Turkish/Central Asia films (probably Eclipse, knowing Criterion) but Limite and A Brighter Summer Day would surely be standalone mainline titles.

[TJS_Blu]

Originally Posted by SpiderBaby

Hey TJS_Blu,

Did you ever purchase those Henri Storck films?

No. Couldn't figure out any reasonable way to transfer the funds.

[SpiderBaby]

Originally Posted by Yami

I could see a box of the Turkish/Central Asia films (probably Eclipse, knowing Criterion) but Limite and A Brighter Summer Day would surely be standalone mainline titles.

Hopefully.

Ritwik Ghatak is my fav Indian filmmaker so I'm also hoping A River Called Titash gets a mainline release as well.

[SpiderBaby]

Originally Posted by TJS_Blu

No. Couldn't figure out any reasonable way to transfer the funds.

Yeah, that was going to be my next question.

They are region-free though correct?

[octagon]

Originally Posted by CoopFilm

Completely agree with SpiderBaby's post/opinion here (won't quote it over again). To me, it doesn't sound like 'why won't they release what I want' at all. It's more a matter of what Criterion meant/produced in their 'DVD era' and the shift they've made now.

But how much of that shift is simply changing perspectives (ie Kurosawa is so ten years ago) on the part of consumers? The advent of BD obviously made rereleases a priority in ways they weren't before but that does really constitute some major philosophy shift on Criterion's part?

And to be clear, I'm not asking that pointedly. I'm not saying they haven't shifted their priorities. I'm just saying some of the complaints in that regard have a 'this isn't new to me' quality to them.

Originally Posted by CoopFilm

So, to me, it isn't 'greedy' (not that that word was used anywhere) to find disappointment in what's currently being released considering, as SpiderBaby put it, if they don't release any more, or as many, of the more 'obscure' titles that need discovering, we're much less likely to see them at all.

A) I think it is greedy if you define greedy as motivated primarily by self-interest.

B) I have no problem with that. Gordon Gekko was more right than wrong

FTR, I also have no problem with second-guessing Criterion or other wishlists.

Some of their decisions do seem goofy. People do put silly stuff on their wish lists.

Why there's even an ever so slight chance some of the things I want might not be the absolute best use of their resources.

I mean anything's possible...