The Criterion Collection

[Abdrewes]

Thanks sc1957,
I've only seen The Kid Brother, but I'm very curious to check these out.

[Mansinthe]

just seen sansho the baliff. it was a good movie. but i kinda did expect a little more. it was good though. but " became one of cinema’s greatest masterpieces," seems a little bit overrated?


looks like the criterion release does not have the movie Gion Bayashi
like the eureka one does. will take a look at that movie in the next few days.

[Abdrewes]

Originally Posted by Mansinthe

just seen sansho the baliff. it was a good movie. but i kinda did expect a little more. it was good though. but " became one of cinema’s greatest masterpieces," seems a little bit overrated?


looks like the criterion release does not have the movie Gion Bayashi
like the eureka one does. will take a look at that movie in the next few days.

What exactly didn't work for you?

[Mansinthe]

the movie was good, the story was fine but i would loved to see more about the political background with all this slave trade buisness , the bandits.
same for the sister that she just killed herself , so they would not be able to tortrure her, did they even look for here after her brother was gone? maybe i did miss that. i mean the baliff.. he did not even bother to find out how zushio got to be the governer.

well i think i might watch it again sooner or later

[Abdrewes]

Originally Posted by Mansinthe

the movie was good, the story was fine but i would loved to see more about the political background with all this slave trade buisness , the bandits.
same for the sister that she just killed herself , so they would not be able to tortrure her, did they even look for here after her brother was gone? maybe i did miss that. i mean the baliff.. he did not even bother to find out how zushio got to be the governer.

well i think i might watch it again sooner or later

Okay, I see what you mean about the slave trading business.

As for his sister, none of that was actually seen right? It was only revealed to him later. It's been awhile since I've seen it, but I remember that scene being impactful.

[Mansinthe]

well "we" did see it. she told the old woman that if shes dead nobody will be able to torture her. and later you see her go into the lake an drown herself. well that was an "impact"

zushio finds out later while he is trying to get her from the baliffs house. but i think sansho the baliff did actually never look for her or question her after they did not find her to torture her.


the burmese harp or ballad of narayama had an bigger effect on me.

[Abdrewes]

Originally Posted by Mansinthe

well "we" did see it. she told the old woman that if shes dead nobody will be able to torture her. and later you see her go into the lake an drown herself. well that was an "impact"

zushio finds out later while he is trying to get her from the baliffs house. but i think sansho the baliff did actually never look for her or question her after they did not find her to torture her.


the burmese harp or ballad of narayama had an bigger effect on me.

Thanks for clearing that up

Have you seen Harakiri? That film is nothing if not devastating.

[Mansinthe]

so far i have only seen the remake by taskeshi miike. awesome movie but lets say the first 20 mins of the movie are incredible hard to watch ! the whole movie is sad too.

i got the Masters of cinema release of the 1962 version. but still have to watch that. im collecting right now all this old classics from MoC/criterion/bfi and will watch one after another when im in mood for them.
at least with these movies the prices dont drop insane like with all the "new" stuff.

[Abdrewes]

Originally Posted by Mansinthe

so far i have only seen the remake by taskeshi miike. awesome movie but lets say the first 20 mins of the movie are incredible hard to watch ! the whole movie is sad too.

i got the Masters of cinema release of the 1962 version. but still have to watch that. im collecting right now all this old classics from MoC/criterion/bfi and will watch one after another when im in mood for them.
at least with these movies the prices dont drop insane like with all the "new" stuff.

It'll be interesting to hear your take on the original having seen the Miike version first. For me, it ranks up there with Grave of the Fireflies as one of the most effective tragedies I've ever seen.

[Fellini912]

Originally Posted by EricJ

Grandma's Boy is....okay and one of his better-known, but if you have to go for a second Lloyd after Safety, The Freshman is considered his second contribution to silent-movie history. (Lloyd in college, trying to be just like the varsity-hero character in his favorite novels, including going out for the big football game...)

[Show spoiler]Harold LLoyd: The Freshman (1925) Football Short Film - YouTube

Otherwise, the shorts aren't as well-known, except for "Why Worry?" and "Never Surrender", but at least he had a longer sound career than Keaton did.

Thanks for recommendations. Harold Lloyd seems like a forgotten silent movie genius, overshadowed by Chaplin and Keaton. At one point Keaton was greatly overshadowed by Chaplin. I am glad to see him in the forefront when talking about silent movie directors.

I have to commend Kino for making many of these silent films available. To me, they are respected as much as criterion.

Originally Posted by Sherlock_Jr

Do you have any idea is Criterion is releasing a bunch of the Lloyd films, or just Safety Last? The DVD set is pretty extensive, with all his features and shorts, so it kind of stinks if Criterion is going to be releasing one films at a time. I wish on the Chaplin stuff they could've at least spread out his short films and included a few on each disc as an added extra, unless that plan to release them all on one disc someday.

I really think they are gauging the criterion buyers on Harold Lloyd. They are releasing one of his most recognizable classics right from the beginning. I really hope, they keep releasing all his works (if possible). Kino released Keaton's major works on individual releases, until the box set (I was surprised that they were not going to release Harold Lloyd's films). About the shorts:

Quote from special features for Safety Last:
Three newly restored Lloyd shorts: Take a Chance (1918), Young Mr. Jazz (1919), and His Royal Slyness (1920), with commentary by Correll and film writer John Bengtson

You right about Chaplin's short films.

Originally Posted by hoytereden

A Fellini film with her I really enjoy is Ginger and Fred. A charming film that doesn't get mentioned often but she and Mastroianni are fun to watch and while I doubt it would ever be a Criterion title it's well worth seeing. Just one of those films that'll have you smiling as it ends and maybe wiping away a as well.

To be honest I have never seen Ginger and Fred. Sounds interesting.

[TJS_Blu]

Originally Posted by Sherlock_Jr

Do you have any idea is Criterion is releasing a bunch of the Lloyd films, or just Safety Last?

Janus films controls theatrical rights for Harold Lloyd films in the US. Criterion can probably release as many as they want. I think most of us assume there will be additional releases that could follow the Chaplin model...slowly.

[SpiderBaby]

Originally Posted by BohemianGraham

I don't see any reason as to why I wouldn't. It's just waiting and hoping that some B&N in New England has it in-store come June. Heck, I'm hoping that all the B&N we usually go to are still open by them.

Marketa Lazarova, you must get it come June as well.

[shortmartin]

Originally Posted by BLOFELD

on the waterfront is probably my favorite criterion to date. i love how you toy with 3 or 4 aspect ratios. how convenient!

I agree, it is one of my favorite movies of all time, and the Criterion package is amazing.

[jrsl76]

Originally Posted by jrsl76

Hey, for anyone still looking for Army of Shadows, Le Cercle Rouge or Chungking Express, I noticed that they had them pulled to a non hold shelf where they typically put OOP titles at one of my local Barnes & Nobles. I was looking to see if they had Mafioso since my faith that my order will be fulfilled is dwindling and noticed they had these in Blu and DVD. I couldn't quite tell, but they also seemed to have maybe Marienbad on DVD.

I could possibly help someone acquire them if anyone's interested.

Heads up for anyone potentially interested. Army Of Shadows is gone on Blu. I grabbed their one copy for another member this morning and I have to keep an eye out for another member who wanted the same title. Also, I have someone who wants the 1 copy they had of Chungking Express on Blu.

So All they still have are 2 copies of Le Cercle Rouge on Blu plus DVDs of a lot of recent OOP Criterions (but not Mafioso or Le Doulos).

[EricJ]

Originally Posted by TJS_Blu

Janus films controls theatrical rights for Harold Lloyd films in the US. Criterion can probably release as many as they want. I think most of us assume there will be additional releases that could follow the Chaplin model...slowly.

Although the Lloyd estate was also unusual in being one of the few silent comics to actually guard over their film rights, and not let them sink into PD like Chaplin's did.
It's been hard getting past them for a proper version of the last DVD release, and while Criterion may have the video rights, the estate's probably being a little more careful about how Criterion's going to handle the franchise starting with this test-flag.

[Sherlock_Jr]

Originally Posted by Fellini912

About the shorts:

Quote from special features for Safety Last:
Three newly restored Lloyd shorts: Take a Chance (1918), Young Mr. Jazz (1919), and His Royal Slyness (1920), with commentary by Correll and film writer John Bengtson

Oh that's cool. Interesting that none of those shorts are on the DVD box set I have.

Originally Posted by TJS_Blu

Janus films controls theatrical rights for Harold Lloyd films in the US. Criterion can probably release as many as they want. I think most of us assume there will be additional releases that could follow the Chaplin model...slowly.

I know rights for films change from time to time (especially older films), but it seems odd that Janus controls the rights now. The previous DVD set was put out by New Line, which is a subsidiary of TimeWarner. I don't know much about the legal stuff but how would Janus wrestle away an entire filmmater's catalog from Time Warner? Or is it more likely that they always owned the rights and TW licensed them to release the DVD set?

Originally Posted by EricJ

Although the Lloyd estate was also unusual in being one of the few silent comics to actually guard over their film rights, and not let them sink into PD like Chaplin's did.
It's been hard getting past them for a proper version of the last DVD release, and while Criterion may have the video rights, the estate's probably being a little more careful about how Criterion's going to handle the franchise starting with this test-flag.

It's interesting that the DVD box claims to be "remastered, restored and rescored", and was endorsed by the Lloyd estate. Did Janus/Criterion do further remastering on these films for HD?

[jrsl76]

With us getting the Chaplins and the now Harold Lloyd, it makes me think that I'd really love for Criterion to get the rights back for The Bank Dick and to upgrade both that and the WC Fields shorts. I don't own and haven't watched the shorts, but The Bank Dick is just so great.

[Fellini912]

I saw a poster (Spicoli) in another thread with this avatar. I laughed the whole evening. Whoever is in the TIE fighter does not stand a chance. Cary Grant is the man.

[SammyJankis]

For those that care, Ebert's last review:

Released less than two years after his “The Tree of Life,” an epic that began with the dinosaurs and peered into an uncertain future, Terrence Malick’s “To the Wonder” is a film that contains only a handful of important characters and a few crucial moments in their lives. Although it uses dialogue, it’s dreamy and half-heard, and essentially this could be a silent film — silent, except for its mostly melancholy music.

The movie stars Ben Affleck and Olga Kurylenko as a couple who fall deeply, tenderly, transcendently in love in France. Malick opens as they visit Mont St. Michel, the cathedral perched on a spire of rock off the French coast, and moves to the banks of the Seine, but really, its landscape is the terrain is these two bodies, and the worshipful ways in which Neil and Marina approach each other. Snatches of dialogue, laughter, shared thoughts, drift past us. Nothing is punched up for dramatic effect.

Marina, a single mother, decides to move with her little daughter, Tatiana, to America with Neil, and the setting suddenly becomes the flatlands of Oklahoma, a land seen here as nearly unpopulated. Oh, there are people here, but we see few of them and engage with only a handful. Again there is the hushed serenity as in France, but differences grow between them, and there is anger now in some of their words. Neil reconnects with Jane (Rachel McAdams), an American girl he was once in love with, and romantic perfection between he and Marina seems to slip away.

In Oklahoma, we meet Father Quintana (Javier Bardem), a priest from Europe, whose church is new and brightly lit. We can almost smell the furniture varnish. His faith has been challenged, and many of his statements are directed toward Jesus Christ, as a sort of former lover. Quintana visits prisoners, the ill, the poor and the illiterate, whose dialogue is half-understood even by themselves.

As all of these relationships intertwine, Malick depicts them with deliberate beauty and painterly care. The mood is often similar to the feelings of the early small-town scenes in “The Tree of Life.” Malick has a repertory of fundamental images he draws upon.

We don’t need to be told Malick’s in an autobiographical vein here; these memories surely belong to the storyteller. In both films, he is absorbed in living and dining rooms, looking out upon neat lawns and neighborhood pastoral peace.

As the film opened, I wondered if I was missing something. As it continued, I realized many films could miss a great deal. Although he uses established stars, Malick employs them in the sense that the French director Robert Bresson intended when he called actors “models.” Ben Affleck here isn’t the star of “Argo” but a man, often silent, intoxicated by love and then by loss. Bardem, as a priest far from home, made me realize as never before the loneliness of the unmarried clergy. Wandering in his empty church in the middle of the day, he is a forlorn figure, crying out in prayer and need to commune with his Jesus.

A more conventional film would have assigned a plot to these characters and made their motivations more clear. Malick, who is surely one of the most romantic and spiritual of filmmakers, appears almost naked here before his audience, a man not able to conceal the depth of his vision.

“Well,” I asked myself, “why not?” Why must a film explain everything? Why must every motivation be spelled out? Aren’t many films fundamentally the same film, with only the specifics changed? Aren’t many of them telling the same story? Seeking perfection, we see what our dreams and hopes might look like. We realize they come as a gift through no power of our own, and if we lose them, isn’t that almost worse than never having had them in the first place?

There will be many who find “To the Wonder” elusive and too effervescent. They’ll be dissatisfied by a film that would rather evoke than supply. I understand that, and I think Terrence Malick does, too. But here he has attempted to reach more deeply than that: to reach beneath the surface, and find the soul in need.

[EricJ]

Originally Posted by SammyJankis

For those that care, Ebert's last review:

Well, that is a better legacy than The Host.

(Although, boy, did we kid him on his blog about being a gullible Malick "Tree-Sap", aka Lifer fanboy...Went just as gushy over Cloud Atlas, too, but think he was deliberately being petulant about rubbing the Artsy Dad-and-Dinosaurs Movie in our faces every chance he got.)

Originally Posted by jrsl76

With us getting the Chaplins and the now Harold Lloyd, it makes me think that I'd really love for Criterion to get the rights back for The Bank Dick and to upgrade both that and the WC Fields shorts. I don't own and haven't watched the shorts, but The Bank Dick is just so great.

That was originally Criterion'ed to recognize The Bank Dick going into the National Film Archive, but Universal got it back later.
Came out in pretty much the same version on Universal's label as part of the two DVD sets, which are reportedly coming back later as one set. No Blu's, though, for It's a Gift or Never/Sucker.

As for the Criterion "6 Fields Shorts" (watch 'em, already!--And don't give me that tripe about "not getting" Fatal Glass of Beer!), the 6 disk seem to be the PD versions Hal Roach fiddled with in the 40's/50's, adding new music and cartoony sound effects where they weren't in the original.
Not much artistic harm done, but not sure whether the Roach versions were done for theatrical reissue or TV broadcast, and if it's the latter, that would explain why it hasn't been back on Blu since.

Originally Posted by Page14

That was great! I look at those old films and think how much more difficult it must have been to compose or come up with a great shot, with the lack of the technology that we have today.

Particularly true of Safety Last, when you consider

[Show spoiler]the ledge and the clock were only one or two stories off the ground at the time, and filming against the view from the Hollywood hills.