The Criterion Collection

[Knaldskalle]

Originally Posted by bwdowiak

What is there to 'hate' about How Green Was My Valley?

I generally like Ford (sometimes a lot), but his Irish movies are... not good. And How Green Was My Valley is a nostalgic treacle waffle with syrup and powdered sugar on top. I found it excruciating to sit through and will never willingly submit to it again.

[pedromvu]

Originally Posted by Knaldskalle

I generally like Ford (sometimes a lot), but his Irish movies are... not good. And How Green Was My Valley is a nostalgic treacle waffle with syrup and powdered sugar on top. I found it excruciating to sit through and will never willingly submit to it again.

So no love for The Quiet Man either?

I find it amazing how we all can mostly agree on certain films sometimes while completely disagreeing in others.

[Knaldskalle]

Originally Posted by pedromvu

So no love for The Quiet Man either?

I find it amazing how we all can mostly agree on certain films sometimes while completely disagreeing in others.

I have a problem with men who think they have the right to drag a woman off a train and beat her in public. And an even bigger problem with a crowd cheering it on. The characters are what Irish are "supposed to be" (i.e. cariatures).

No, I'm afraid Ford's nostalgic feelings for Ireland seriously clouded his judgment when it came to these movies.

[pedromvu]

Originally Posted by Knaldskalle

I have a problem with men who think they have the right to drag a woman off a train and beat her in public. And an even bigger problem with a crowd cheering it on. The characters are what Irish are "supposed to be" (i.e. cariatures).

No, I'm afraid Ford's nostalgic feelings for Ireland seriously clouded his judgment when it came to these movies.

I admit I wasn't expecting the caricature aspect in The Quiet Man (never read beforehand that it was in part considered a Comedy), but in the end after that freaking long fight scene it won me over and even if I too have a problem with what you mention (a problem in the sense of my personal opinion of that behavior not that it is badly done in the movie) I think the tone of the movie justifies it and I really ended up enjoying it.

[Edward J Grug III]

Originally Posted by pedromvu

I admit I wasn't expecting the caricature aspect in The Quiet Man (never read beforehand that it was in part considered a Comedy), but in the end after that freaking long fight scene it won me over and even if I too have a problem with what you mention (a problem in the sense of my personal opinion of that behavior not that it is badly done in the movie) I think the tone of the movie justifies it and I really ended up enjoying it.

Me too.

How Green Was My Valley I appreciate, but don't really enjoy. It's Welsh not Irish though.

[Ausjdm]

Movies you dislike/hate since they are Sunday don't look any further than the Oscar best picture winners:

Just look at this century: so much crap!

Gladiator - better than traffic & crouching tiger???
A Beautiful mind - blek! docu-drama winner what never lol
Chicago - seriously?!
Lord of the rings - better than lost in translation no sir
Million Dollar Baby - I have a soft spot for it
Crash - maybe one of the worst best picture ever! Gay paranoia must of been at its peak back then because Brokeback Mt is way better...
The Departed - never been a fan but it's Marty I can live with it.
No country for old men - ok it gets a pass it's Coen's and Cormac but There will be blood is a modern masterpiece.
Slumdog millionaire - felt like a one trick pony one viewing only film. The Dark Knight should of been the first and only comic book movie to win if they had the guts.
The Hurt locker - I hate Jeremy Renner and I never understood the appeal of it, give me Inglorious Basterds any day.
The Kings Speech - cheesy Hollywoodized docu-drama win check.. Black swan, inception, social network, the fighter, crap I'll take even 127 hours over it!
The Artist- the winning movie no one saw congrats you beat one of the greatest movies put on film The Tree of Life
Argo - I think the last half hour didn't even happen in real life that way and you beat out The Master.... Argo go F$&@ yourself indeed lol

The last two years have had correct choices IMO:
12 Years a Slave & Birdman

[Knaldskalle]

Originally Posted by Ausjdm

Crash - maybe one of the worst best picture ever! Gay paranoia must of been at its peak back then because Brokeback Mt is way better...

There are some real doozies when it comes to "worst best picture". Broadway Melody of 1929. Cimarron (1931). Cavalcade (1933). Going My Way (1944). The Greatest Show on Earth (1952). Gigi (1958). Tom Jones (1963). Oliver! (1968) and Driving Miss Daisy (1988) are among the headscratchers, on top of the ones you mention.

[WonderWeasel]

Originally Posted by The Great Owl

I don't outright hate any movie, but here are my four least favorite movies...

1. Pay It Forward
2. Crash (2004)
3. Rob Zombie's Halloween
4. Transformers: Revenge of the Fallen

Rob Zombie's Halloween is one of two films that I've walked out of the theater on (the other was The Haunting from 1999.) I should have known better than to pay money to see a Zombie film after witnessing the cinematic abortions that are House of 1,000 Corpses and The Devil's Rejects. I don't think his films have any redeeming qualities for me.

[theater dreamer]

I ran with my idea for The Social Network cover, should Criterion acquire film distribution rights.



An obvious nod to The Man Who Fell to Earth, of course. Also, an homage to David Bowie. Like Bowie, Mark Zuckerberg has defied convention. Anyhow, just a fun little idea to do in Photoshop. I'm not happy with how the masking turned out, though. I started the project on my laptop, and eventually moved it to my desktop PC. I need to re-calibrate my monitor, as there are some subtle differences that are driving me nuts.

[pedromvu]

Originally Posted by Ausjdm

Movies you dislike/hate since they are Sunday don't look any further than the Oscar best picture winners:

Just look at this century: so much crap!

Gladiator - better than traffic & crouching tiger???

Funny you mention that, just today I had this discussion about it winning, so we go to see which movies it competed with, I would have choose Traffic, but Crouching Tiger is also pretty damn good, really looking forward to the sequel this friday, hope they don't ruin it.

[mja345]

I always thought it was criminal that "Titanic" beat "LA Confidential". "LA Confidential" is an absolute masterpiece. But "Titanic" had so much momentum at that time. In '89, "Do the Right Thing" wasn't even nominated when it was probably the best film of that year. And to add insult to injury, "Driving Miss Daisy" won.

[Knaldskalle]

Originally Posted by mja345

I always thought it was criminal that "Titanic" beat "LA Confidential". "LA Confidential" is an absolute masterpiece. But "Titanic" had so much momentum at that time. In '89, "Do the Right Thing" wasn't even nominated when it was probably the best film of that year. And to add insult to injury, "Driving Miss Daisy" won.

The Academy is mostly old white men. It shows. That's just one reason I don't bother with them any longer.

[jw007]

Originally Posted by theater dreamer

I ran with my idea for The Social Network cover, should Criterion acquire film distribution rights.



An obvious nod to The Man Who Fell to Earth, of course. Also, an homage to David Bowie. Like Bowie, Mark Zuckerberg has defied convention. Anyhow, just a fun little idea to do in Photoshop. I'm not happy with how the masking turned out, though. I started the project on my laptop, and eventually moved it to my desktop PC. I need to re-calibrate my monitor, as there are some subtle differences that are driving me nuts.

Bill, that's an incredible cover... big props to you. I think its ingenious but would Criterion make a cover / statement like that? I don't know. I think its asking a lot from the general public to understand that reference (which is pretty true too). I'm all for that though....

I am going to get back to your PM soon too... everything about it resonated with me too.

[hoytereden]

Originally Posted by oildude

Shane was a true "thinking man's" western, a mature character drama that transcended the standard western tropes. It is a morality play of the highest order. In that sense, it is one of the groundbreaking films to come out of the 1950s. Shane set the table for a lot of what came after, and is an example of why, as I learn more about them, I love 50s movies. A lot of people less exposed to westerns point to the 1960s as the benchmark, as if the western only really began with Sergio Leone, Clint Eastwood, and Lee Van Cleef. I know because I used to think that way too. And then I discovered Anthony Mann, George Stevens, John Ford, Fred Zinnemann, Delmer Daves, Howard Hawks, and a handful of other directors who were taking the western in new directions in the 1950s. As much as I LOVE spaghetti westerns and many of the hard, gritty, and powerfully moving westerns that came in the 1960s and 1970s - those westerns I grew up watching on TV when I was a kid and on home media into my adulthood - my education only really began later in life when the 1950s took me to school.

Thank you. I could go on and on about why I rank Shane as one of the greatest westerns made but you've written it much better than I ever could.
I'd add another director to the list you made: Budd Boetticher. His collaborations with Randolph Scott produced a terrific group of westerns that were pretty much written off as routine B programmers when they were released. Thankfully, as often is the case with seemingly minor films, they've been reevaluated in the years since they were made and have gained much more critical acclaim.

[The Great Owl]

Originally Posted by WonderWeasel

Rob Zombie's Halloween is one of two films that I've walked out of the theater on (the other was The Haunting from 1999.) I should have known better than to pay money to see a Zombie film after witnessing the cinematic abortions that are House of 1,000 Corpses and The Devil's Rejects. I don't think his films have any redeeming qualities for me.

I personally enjoyed The Devil's Rejects. It was a highly disturbing film with some of the most realistically feral characters whom I've ever seen in a film.

It is partly for this reason why I was so disappointed with Rob Zombie's Halloween. Everything, and I mean everything, about Halloween missed the mark. Even if it were not a remake, and I had no basis to compare it with an original film, it would still be an epic fail as a horror movie. This version of Halloween played out in such a way that the final murder rampage of Myers, which was supposed to be a nail-biting pinnacle of dread, was horribly boring and sleep-inducing. Inexcusable.

[ShellOilJunior]

Originally Posted by Martin_31

Quick, name the movie(s) you hate the most!?!
Inside Llewyn Davis

All-time: A Christmas Story
Recent years: 500 Days of Summer

[RickDee]

Originally Posted by mja345

I always thought it was criminal that "Titanic" beat "LA Confidential". "LA Confidential" is an absolute masterpiece. But "Titanic" had so much momentum at that time. In '89, "Do the Right Thing" wasn't even nominated when it was probably the best film of that year. And to add insult to injury, "Driving Miss Daisy" won.

Something wrong with Driving Miss Daisy?

[RickDee]

Originally Posted by oildude

The ending of Shane is one of the most iconic in film history. Long before I ever saw the movie, I had seen the ending in documentaries and film retrospectives. When I finally saw the movie, the ending is even more powerful. I think many people who have seen the ending do not realize

[Show spoiler]that Shane is mortally wounded and is riding off into the night so the little boy won't see him die.

The first time I saw Shane, I sat unmoving for a few moments when it was over, misty eyed and glad that I was alone to savor the experience. Wow, I thought....this is how you make a movie!

In my opinion, the most important character in the film is not the gunfighter, it is the little boy Joey Starrett (played by Brandon de Wilde, who the year before appeared in The Member of the Wedding). His performance is not annoying; far from it. Director George Stevens got the performance he wanted out of little Brandon, who plays an only child on a working ranch. Stevens shows us the struggles of the boy's small-holding rancher father, played by Van Heflin, to maintain the love and adulation of his own son, to remain the little boy's hero and role model in the presence of the exciting and worldly gunman Shane. The suspense is palpable; no matter what happens, it will not end well because the little boy, in his innocence of the world and in his inability to modulate his excitement over the stranger and his guns, is about to grow up in a most painful way. Without Brandon's "annoying" performance, as some describe it, the moral lessons and the ending of Shane would not be nearly as strongly felt or unforgettable.

Shane was a true "thinking man's" western, a mature character drama that transcended the standard western tropes. It is a morality play of the highest order. In that sense, it is one of the groundbreaking films to come out of the 1950s. Shane set the table for a lot of what came after, and is an example of why, as I learn more about them, I love 50s movies. A lot of people less exposed to westerns point to the 1960s as the benchmark, as if the western only really began with Sergio Leone, Clint Eastwood, and Lee Van Cleef. I know because I used to think that way too. And then I discovered Anthony Mann, George Stevens, John Ford, Fred Zinnemann, Delmer Daves, Howard Hawks, and a handful of other directors who were taking the western in new directions in the 1950s. As much as I LOVE spaghetti westerns and many of the hard, gritty, and powerfully moving westerns that came in the 1960s and 1970s - those westerns I grew up watching on TV when I was a kid and on home media into my adulthood - my education only really began later in life when the 1950s took me to school.

Fortunately for us, Criterion is ready to help with our educations. I encourage all of you to add Delmer Dave's two outstanding 1950s westerns 3:10 to Yuma and Jubal to your "buy" list next sale. These are two first class films, not just excellent westerns. Like Shane, they are moving and memorable films because they use the western as a means of telling us a story about the nature of human endurance, failings, triumphs, and our connections to each other....universal themes that guide us to a better place within ourselves. In that same spirit, stepping back in time a bit before Shane, I also recommend John Ford's Stagecoach and Howard Hawks' Red River.

As an aside, Brandon de Wilde was Oscar nominated for his role in Shane, and deservedly so. His performance is phenomenal for a child. He debuted on Broadway at the age of 7 in The Member of the Wedding and became a nationally known child actor, before appearing in the theatrical version of the play in 1952. He grew up to continue acting in films and on stage, until tragically dying in a car accident in Colorado in 1972 at the age of 30, leaving behind a small son of his own.

You must be speaking for a younger generation because folks my age have always thought of the 40's and 50's and the benchmark era for westerns. In fact it was not until the late 80's and early 90's that spaghetti westerns were even taken seriously. I can remember back in the 70's and 80s when they were still made fun of. Shane is a good film but I would have to say High Noon was the better of the two to come out of that era of Western.

[WonderWeasel]

Originally Posted by The Great Owl

I personally enjoyed The Devil's Rejects. It was a highly disturbing film with some of the most realistically feral characters whom I've ever seen in a film.

It is partly for this reason why I was so disappointed with Rob Zombie's Halloween. Everything, and I mean everything, about Halloween missed the mark. Even if it were not a remake, and I had no basis to compare it with an original film, it would still be an epic fail as a horror movie. This version of Halloween played out in such a way that the final murder rampage of Myers, which was supposed to be a nail-biting pinnacle of dread, was horribly boring and sleep-inducing. Inexcusable.

I could see Rejects and House of 1,000 Corpses having some appeal to fans of exploitation horror, though any semblance of character realism went out the window in both films for me when his wife came on screen. She is just awful lol.

Also, in Halloween, did Danny Trejo seem terribly miscast to you? He seemed almost comically stiff and awkward in that role to me.

[The Great Owl]

Originally Posted by RickDee

Something wrong with Driving Miss Daisy?

Miss Daisy's house in Driving Miss Daisy is located in the Druid Hills neighborhood in Atlanta, and my marathon training group frequently runs by it, since the road (Lullwater Lane) is part of the Georgia Marathon route.

One Saturday morning, one of the pace groups behind us was running by the house. A few elderly runners in the group were pointing at it and talking about Driving Miss Daisy when one of them tripped on the road curb. He broke his arm on the pavement, and also suffered a couple of skull/jaw fractures. Thankfully, he returned the following season and went back to completing marathons.

This is not the fault of the film, of course.

Originally Posted by WonderWeasel

Also, in Halloween, did Danny Trejo seem terribly miscast to you? He seemed almost comically stiff and awkward in that role to me.

If they gave out Olympic medals for miscasting, then Rob Zombie's Halloween would be the clear winner across the board. Every casting choice for that movie was a disaster.