The Criterion Collection

[octagon]

Originally Posted by iScottie

The other main reason for lack of rewatchability for me is due to knowing the plot. I've seen 12 Angry Men and Rear Window numerous times in my life. I applaud them and consider them to be great films. However, no viewing is ever going to come close to my first viewing of these films. Furthermore, both films are incredibly campy and I already know how the film is going to end. It's hard for me to continue watching something like these two films as my enjoyment for them seems to diminish with each subsequent viewing.

12 Angry Men is incredibly campy? That's an interesting take.

Originally Posted by The Great Owl

It doesn't bother me at all to rewatch movies when I already know the outcome.

Same here. I can't count the number of times I've watched something like The Maltese Falcon or Goodfellas or Star Wars. Sure, the degree to which they can fully engage me can ebb and flow over time but even setting aside the 'notice something new every time' aspect, I enjoy all of the old stuff I noticed all along no matter how many times I see it.

And yeah, suspense can take a bit of a hit after several rewatches but something like the cat and mouse between Anthony Perkins and Martin Balsam in Psycho or between Jimmy Stewart and George C Scott in Anatomy of a Murder is every bit as good now as when I saw it for the first time.

Maybe I don't get amped up the exact same way but I still get amped up.

[mja345]

Wouldn't "12 Angry Men" be the opposite of campy? It's one of the more earnest movies of all-time. When I think of camp, I think of stuff like John Waters' movies or Cannon action movies like "Death Wish 3".

[octagon]

Originally Posted by mja345

Wouldn't "12 Angry Men" be the opposite of campy? It's one of the more earnest movies of all-time. When I think of camp, I think of stuff like John Waters' movies or Cannon action movies like "Death Wish 3".

Agreed. It was definitely earnest and idealistic but it never crossed over into sappier Frank Capra territory.

Which is not necessarily a knock on Capra, mind you. I'm just using that as an example.

[Scottie]

I should clarify that I'm using "campy" in the traditional sense. I'm using it in this instance to describe the action of a film as taking place in one central location.

In the traditional sense, neither film is campy.

[Scottie]

Originally Posted by The Great Owl

It doesn't bother me at all to rewatch movies when I already know the outcome.

I've seen The Shawshank Redemption at least 50 times in my life, and I still get tense during certain scenes in the same way that I did when I saw the film for the first time. I always somehow get caught up in the vibe of a story, even after experiencing it multiple times.

Of course, there are always offbeat films, like Pulp Fiction or Breathless, that I could see hundreds of times and still feel that I have no idea what's going to happen during the next scene.

I, too, have seen The Shawshank Redemption quite a few times. However, this film never gets old for me. As you pointed out, it's easy to get caught up in the vibe of the story.

Similarly, I could watch Breathless numerous times despite knowing the outcome because it's a film that feels like there's something new to experience on every viewing.

For the most part, though, I've seen more cut and dry, A + B = C type of films than anything else. Those are the ones I've grown apart from.

[octagon]

Originally Posted by iScottie

I should clarify that I'm using "campy" in the traditional sense. I'm using it in this instance to describe the action of a film as taking place in one central location.

In the traditional sense, neither film is campy.

If I'm reading this right and you're using campy to mean something more like gimmicky I still can't say I totally agree.

I suppose one could kind of make that case for Rear Window. In something like Rope (which I absolutely love and have rewatched many times) the single location and long takes can come off as a little contrived at times. But with Rear Window the use of a single (increasingly claustrophobic) location seems much more like a legitimate device than a gimmick.

And 12 Angry Men doesn't seem gimmicky at all. Juries deliberate in jury rooms. Twelve strangers being cooped up together under pressure is a big part of the story.

[Popcorn_Bliss]

For me, the thrill is in discovering those films that aren't diminished after one viewing. I made a comment in the "Movies Forum" about how the truly great films are the ones that get better with more viewings, not worse.

For some, maybe that isn't even a possible statement, but as a film lover, I really appreciate movies from a frame by frame or textbook sort of approach. The films that have depth, symbolism, or multiple interpretations are the ones to take note of. They are the ones that last. And they are the ones that have more to analyze than any one, two or even three viewings could ever reveal.

For me, such films include any of the ones I listed in that top ten pages back - films such as La Dolce Vita, Vertigo, Citizen Kane, Mulholland Dr...all of them have a quality that demands multiple viewings, not just one (in my opinion).

It seems to me that not watching any film multiple times because it has lost impact implies that impact was the sole reason you watched it. In my experience, emotion is just the visceral component of any great film. The art or interpretations behind it often takes years to discover! If it's a film meant to last...

[Scottie]

Originally Posted by octagon

If I'm reading this right and you're using campy to mean something more like gimmicky I still can't say I totally agree.

I suppose one could kind of make that case for Rear Window. In something like Rope (which I absolutely love and have rewatched many times) the single location and long takes can come off as a little contrived at times. But with Rear Window the use of a single (increasingly claustrophobic) location seems much more like a legitimate device than a gimmick.

And 12 Angry Men doesn't seem gimmicky at all. Juries deliberate in jury rooms. Twelve strangers being cooped up together under pressure is a big part of the story.

I'm not knocking the use of such a device in a film. There are some films that benefit from the use of one set locations, while others use them poorly.

As I've already noted, I find both 12 Angry Men and Rear Window to be great films. I simply find the rewatch factor to be diminished when dealing with these types of films.

[belcherman]

Originally Posted by bwdowiak

I’ve seen Rear Window two times in its entirety with the first time being close to 20 years ago. Hitchcock is one of my favorite directors, but this film has been difficult for me to sit through for a third time. I’ve had a couple false starts with it. It is about as suspenseful as movies come, but when you know what’s going to happen, it really takes a lot out of the viewing experience. Good example.

Boy, how do feel about re-watching Psycho? Seriously, one of the reasons I enjoy re-watching suspense movies is to pick up all the little details I missed the first time because I was engrossed in the plot. Hitchcock films have a lot of those little details.

Of course, I also enjoy re-watching comedies even though I've heard all the jokes before. I can't tell you how many times I've seen Caddyshack. So maybe, don't go by me.

[AaronJ]

Originally Posted by belcherman

Boy, how do feel about re-watching Psycho? Seriously, one of the reasons I enjoy re-watching suspense movies is to pick up all the little details I missed the first time because I was engrossed in the plot. Hitchcock films have a lot of those little details.

Of course, I also enjoy re-watching comedies even though I've heard all the jokes before. I can't tell you how many times I've seen Caddyshack. So maybe, don't go by me.

I've seen Mean Girls about ... I cannot even guess, really. I still laugh out loud. Heck I laugh when someone posts a GIF from that movie, often.

[Ray Jackson]

I've already made the decision to re-buy Kwaidan and The Bitter Tears of Petra Von Kant during the Barnes sale in July.

...and I just sold them yesterday.

I may even buy Kwaidan next month.

The old bookshelf just doesn't look right without it.

So by selling it, I will end up losing money.

What's really sad is that this isn't the first time this has happened.

Thus proving the theory of eternal recurrence is not a theory at all, but rather a cast-iron chain of suffering hanging around the necks of weak and impotent men.

...men like me.

[polsk_aus90]

Originally Posted by Ray Jackson

I've already made the decision to re-buy Kwaidan and The Bitter Tears of Petra Von Kant during the Barnes sale in July.

...and I just sold them yesterday.

I may even buy Kwaidan next month.

The old bookshelf just doesn't look right without it.

So by selling it, I will end up losing money.

What's really sad is that this isn't the first time this has happened.

Thus proving the theory of eternal recurrence is not a theory at all, but rather a cast-iron chain of suffering hanging around the necks of weak and impotent men.

...men like me.

Going by your sig, surely you will be experiencing the exact same thing if/when you sell The Red Shoes?

[AaronJ]

I've never seen Kwaidan.

[Ray Jackson]

Originally Posted by AaronJ

I've never seen Kwaidan.

If you don't buy it next month I'll kill myself.

...whether or not my death means anything to you is another matter.

[Ray Jackson]

Originally Posted by polsk_aus90

Going by your sig, surely you will be experiencing the exact same thing if/when you sell The Red Shoes?

It's been a difficult week for Ray Jackson.

...who possesses an uncanny ability to learn nothing from his mistakes.

[SuperFlyHighGuy]

I've re-rented movies before but I don't know if I've ever re-bought the same disc that I previously sold. Seller's remorse, eh? Hoichi the Earless calling to you?

In regards to Rear Window; I think it's one of the most re-watchable of all of Hitchcock's film. There is so much both on the surface and under it besides the plot - voyeurism, surveillance, paranoia, ego, chauvinism, sexual tension for starters - for the viewer to chew on and explore. Just from the first frames, how Hitchcock is immediately playing with film conventions regarding the viewers place as an observer of the events or participant watching the watcher(s), transfering a certain level of "responsibility", as it were, to the viewer. Amazing stuff, imo.

[polsk_aus90]

Originally Posted by Ray Jackson

It's been a difficult week for Ray Jackson.

...who possesses an uncanny ability to learn nothing from his mistakes.

Much respect.

[AaronJ]

Originally Posted by Ray Jackson

If you don't buy it next month I'll kill myself.

...whether or not my death means anything to you is another matter.

What if I just SAY that I bought it?

[Ray Jackson]

Originally Posted by AaronJ

What if I just SAY that I bought it?

I'll know about it.

...just like I know everything about what you do.

[Show spoiler]

[Arawn]

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