Archived: Insiders Thread

[Frode]

Thanks for the reply. Blu-ray really doesn't need any more bad PR and Java related uncertainties. I do have one suggestion for BD+ - is it possible to code a disc so that it checks if the player has the recommended firmware revision to play back the content? Kind of a fast pre-loader, with the option of turning off the warning for future playback. Even better would be to do what's done for PS3 games, which is to include the latest firmware required on the disc itself. Would that be possible?

[gandley]

profile 1.1 is this absolutly a finished spec? profile 2 is this also a fully finished spec ? (ie there set in writing and design)

If so is the hold up just waiting for silicon to be ready and then design implementation?

What exactly does profile 2 deliver, there is like zero info on it as far as i can find and no one really wants to let info out.

Any chance of a break down of the full features profile 2 delivers and when is this expected to become mandatory. welcome KJACKS thoughts.

[David Vaughn]

Originally Posted by paidgeek

I have not heard any news about adding WMA lossless...

Paidgeek,

Please pass along the suggestion...I have about 300 CD's stored this way and I would hate to have to convert them to a lossy format.

Thanks,

[dobyblue]

Originally Posted by paidgeek

I would like to better understand your need here. What is the shortcoming of decoding in the player and outputting over HDMI as LPCM?

There is no shortcoming if you believe that we will see DTS-HD Master Audio decoding being able to be acheived.

I just thought that for DTS-HD Master Audio that it might be an easier mission to add the capability to pass it through in bitstream. If it's easier to add decoding of DTS-HD Master Audio in the PS3 itself that that's great news.

If the decoding of DTS-HD MA in the PS3 and output as PCM is feasible, then I implore SCEA to work on this in a firmware upgrade. This would be a huge step for the PS3 to be the only player currently on the market that decodes DTS-HD MA on either format.

Originally Posted by Esox50

paidgeek,

I can think of one "need". I don't want my comments to be construed as "complaining" though. I'm very happy with the 1.8 firmware update for the Ps3, but I have noticed that the "extra" power/crunching needed for this update has caused the fan to run more making my PS3 run much hotter/louder than it did previously. My concern with doing DTS-MA decoding in the player (since we've heard that DTS takes a lot of computational power to decode)...is that the PS3 will run hotter and louder. If it were to run any louder, it might become a problem. I would think just passing the stream out would be "easier" on the PS3 and easier for SCEA to implement, but I'm not an engineer.

In the end, I think both options should be provided for both TrueHD and DTS-MA. Decode in the player OR pass out bitstream to pre-pro via HDMI 1.3 output. At this point in time, I think folks would just be happy to get one or the other though.

This is another good point. DTS-HD MA is very processor intensive, so why not give us the ability to send the signal natively to one of the new receivers with DTS-MA and TrueHD processing, let them deal with it.

[dobyblue]

Originally Posted by paidgeek

We are working closely with Sony BMG, but there procedures for preparing masters are not the same as with film. They work under much more difficult circumstances, so the master quality can be expected to vary more than a film based title.

HI paidgeek,
Do you know if the Dave Matthews Band Live in Central Park concert, which was totally filmed in HD, is being considered for a Blu-ray Sony/BMG release soon?

Also if you do have closer contact with Sony/BMG, can you find out if there are any plans to do some SACD remasters of some of the back catalogues of their biggest artists, like Pearl Jam and Dave Matthews Band, similar to the Genesis and Depeche Mode remasters that have been coming out? SACD support must have been added to the PS3 for a reason and artists like these would definitely bring SACD and high resolution audio to a new breed of consumer.

[Chad Varnadore]

Originally Posted by dobyblue

There is no shortcoming if you believe that we will see DTS-HD Master Audio decoding being able to be acheived.

I just thought that for DTS-HD Master Audio that it might be an easier mission to add the capability to pass it through in bitstream. If it's easier to add decoding of DTS-HD Master Audio in the PS3 itself that that's great news.

If the decoding of DTS-HD MA in the PS3 and output as PCM is feasible, then I implore SCEA to work on this in a firmware upgrade. This would be a huge step for the PS3 to be the only player currently on the market that decodes DTS-HD MA on either format.


This is another good point. DTS-HD MA is very processor intensive, so why not give us the ability to send the signal natively to one of the new receivers with DTS-MA and TrueHD processing, let them deal with it.

There are two versions of HDMI 1.3 (why I haven't a clue). But, it's my understanding that only one supports the passing of advanced audio and the PS3 doesn't contain that version, based on how the manual reads. So for it to support DTS MA, it would have to be decoded internally. But maybe paid can clear that up a little more, as my memory is already foggy on the specifics.

[dialog_gvf]

Originally Posted by David Vaughn

Paidgeek,

Please pass along the suggestion...I have about 300 CD's stored this way and I would hate to have to convert them to a lossy format.

Same here. My entire CD collection is stored and backed up as WMA lossless. I'd vote for support too.

Gary

[blitz6speed]

Originally Posted by dialog_gvf

Same here. My entire CD collection is stored and backed up as WMA lossless. I'd vote for support too.

Gary

I have to ask, how often do you guys listen to music at home or work? The only time i hear any music at all is in the car or at a after hour party, i dont remember the last time i sat down at home and listened to music.

[phloyd]

Personally I can't believe they trusted a Microsoft product to back up their music and then expect support outside of Windows Do you think Billy G wants his stuff in the PS3?

[PeterTHX]

Hey, some of us have Windows and like it (typing this on Vista).

WMA lossless is actually pretty cool. It's actually up to Sony whether the PS3 supports it. It does support WMA. Haven't tried lossless.

[Frode]

HDMI 1.3 itself supports passing on advanced audio codecs - there is no "two versions" of it as far as that goes. HDMI is just a transport however, so it's still up to the hardware manufacturer to enable the audio pass through. It *should* be mostly a programming job depending on how they implemented it.

[McBain]

Originally Posted by gandley

profile 1.1 is this absolutly a finished spec? profile 2 is this also a fully finished spec ? (ie there set in writing and design)

If so is the hold up just waiting for silicon to be ready and then design implementation?

What exactly does profile 2 deliver, there is like zero info on it as far as i can find and no one really wants to let info out.

Any chance of a break down of the full features profile 2 delivers and when is this expected to become mandatory. welcome KJACKS thoughts.

See: http://www.emedialive.com/articles/r...leid=11397#iij

[JTK]

Originally Posted by Chad Varnadore

There are two versions of HDMI 1.3 (why I haven't a clue).

Wow, there is?

I fold. Wake me up when HDMI 2.0 comes along.

[David Vaughn]

I use the music for a Zone 2 application for the speakers aroung my pool. There's nothing like going into the backyard with commercial free CD quality music that will play for hours and hours!

[milou6]

Originally Posted by paidgeek

It is under consideration, but can't be guaranteed to be coming.

If the PS3 can't/won't output bitsream and internal decoding is a question mark for the future, then I need another BD player. This is frustrating. Why can't it just output bitsream?

Which players currently output bitsream lossless? Any advice folks?

[Chad Varnadore]

I think Frode is right. It's been awhile, so, I had to do some digging. Like I said my memory's foggy on the subject. There are two 1.3 chips from SI, the 9133 and the 9134. The 9133 supports deep color, while the 9134 supports deep color and advanced audio. The fact that the PS3's manual only mentions deep color in the specs may be where the uncertainty comes from. I think there may also have been some doubt as to the availability of the 9134 chip at launch though. Looking again, the 9133 is only a receiver chip, not something that would be used for a transmitting device. So unless the PS3 uses a proprietary chip, all should be good for passing or internal decoding.

[JTK]

Originally Posted by Chad Varnadore

I think Frode is right. It's been awhile, so, I had to do some digging. Like I said my memory's foggy on the subject. There are two 1.3 chips from SI, the 9133 and the 9134. The 9133 supports deep color, while the 9134 supports deep color and advanced audio. The fact that the PS3's manual only mentions deep color in the specs may be where the uncertainty comes from. I think there may also have been some doubt as to the availability of the 9134 chip at launch though. Looking again, the 9133 is only a receiver chip, not something that would be used for a transmitting device. So unless the PS3 uses a proprietary chip, all should be good for passing or internal decoding.

Thanks for the clarification.

[Frode]

Actually I think the real question here is whether Sony's using a Silicon image chip to begin with. They may be using their own interface chip or a different 3rd party solution which only implements part of the 1.3 spec. There's this one for example:

http://www.analog.com/UploadedFiles/...ts/AD9889B.pdf

I'd have to do a lot more research on the parts out there to be sure, along with reading up on how compressed data is packaged. I'm also not opening up my PS3 to check .

[kjack]

Originally Posted by Frode

HDMI 1.3 itself supports passing on advanced audio codecs - there is no "two versions" of it as far as that goes. HDMI is just a transport however, so it's still up to the hardware manufacturer to enable the audio pass through. It *should* be mostly a programming job depending on how they implemented it.

It's up to what features the HDMI silicon vendors support on different versions of their chips (some support deep color, some advanced audio, some both, etc.). Then on top of that, approrpriate firmware is required to make it work. Sometimes additional hardware is also needed. For example, with the Sil9134, the advanced audio bitstreams need to be packetized a specific way, and meet specific timing, to be passed over I2S to the Sil9134 chip.

BTW, the current HDMI spec is 1.3a. The current compliance test spec is 1.3b. Hence, the confusion in 1.3a vs. 1.3b...

[dobyblue]

Originally Posted by kjack

It's up to what features the HDMI silicon vendors support on different versions of their chips (some support deep color, some advanced audio, some both, etc.). Then on top of that, approrpriate firmware is required to make it work. Sometimes additional hardware is also needed. For example, with the Sil9134, the advanced audio bitstreams need to be packetized a specific way, and meet specific timing, to be passed over I2S to the Sil9134 chip.

BTW, the current HDMI spec is 1.3a. The current compliance test spec is 1.3b. Hence, the confusion in 1.3a vs. 1.3b...

So which version does the PS3 have and will it be possible with a firmware upgrade to allow passing of advanced audio codecs?