Archived: Ask the Insiders: Judgment Day Edition

[HDJK]

Originally Posted by Agent Cooper

Funny how you drag this into WWII territory - check this out:

"Downfall Of HD-DVD"

(originally posted by bigshynepo at HDD)

Definately the wrong thread for this, but very funny never the less

[Azumi]

hi Max,

Originally Posted by Maxpower1987

So Toshiba has decided to have a few more firesales on players and fund a few sales on discs as well. Big whoop. They did it before and it never helped so why would it this time around?

Do you think that Warner could theoretically "secure" a Blu-ray exclusivity for I Am Legend?

[elwaylite]

Originally Posted by Maxpower1987

So Toshiba has decided to have a few more firesales on players and fund a few sales on discs as well. Big whoop. They did it before and it never helped so why would it this time around?

Exactly. I just feel bad for the suckers wooed by the price.

[patrick99]

Originally Posted by Maxpower1987

So Toshiba has decided to have a few more firesales on players and fund a few sales on discs as well. Big whoop. They did it before and it never helped so why would it this time around?

Can you give us any hint as to when we might hear the next bit of interesting news, Max?

[elwaylite]

We've continuously seen late Jan Feb dropped on here, lets not harass these guys over it.

[Swede]

Originally Posted by Maxpower1987

So Toshiba has decided to have a few more firesales on players and fund a few sales on discs as well. Big whoop. They did it before and it never helped so why would it this time around?

Exactly. There are a few threads on cheap Toshiba's created the last couple of days on deal-sites like slickdeals.net and fatwallet.com already, but even most hd dvd fanboys have realized it's over...

That said, it wouldn't hurt if there were some more blu supporters on those forums, just to make sure *NOONE* gets tricked into buying into a dead format anymore by some of those few, hopeless but very vocal kamikaze DUD supporters

[sjy1969]

Originally Posted by Maxpower1987

So Toshiba has decided to have a few more firesales on players and fund a few sales on discs as well. Big whoop. They did it before and it never helped so why would it this time around?

Although there is nothing in the press release that precludes Uni and Paramount from releasing on Blu-ray, can we infer any change in their position based on this release? Perhaps everyone was just a bit giddy after the Warner announcement, but things have definitely gone a bit quiet after the initial rush of stories.

Also, is it significant at all that this release was put out by Toshiba rather than the HD DVD Promotion Group?

[eat_me_cool]

Originally Posted by phloyd

I believe that Silicon Image have confirmed that the PS3 is not capable of bitstream output of DTS Master Audio. So it will have to be internally decoded for it to be heard.

No, SI have NOT confirmed any such thing. They were asked if the HDMI 1.2 version of the chip supported bitstream. This is not the chip used in the PS3.

According to info posted on SI's web site the PS3 can, by implication, output bitstream.

Please don't believe anything you read on AVS.

[eat_me_cool]

A good explanation here by Ian_S

http://www.avforums.com/forums/showp...7&postcount=25

I'm going to buck the trend and say that I'm not convinced on the PS3 will never do HD bitstream audio front.

Much of the confusion on this point seems to stem from the fact that the PS3 initially had a custom HDMI 1.3 chip made specially for Sony that has no publicly available spec sheet. However, contrary to some mischievious rumours circulated at the time of the PS3's launch, HDMI 1.3a DOES NOT contain any new updates for HD bitstream audio, having been sad and read the spec... The main thing HDMI 1.3a added was the lip-sync control feature.

So, IMO, no-one bar Sony knows if the PS3 can or will ever send HD bitstream audio. If it really is HDMI 1.3 compliant then it should be able to send HD bitstream, if it's not HDMI 1.3 compliant but is advertised as such... I believe most of the standalone BD players have allowed bitstream audio because being only profile 1.0 players, they will never have to worry about mixing secondary audio so it allows owners to get the most from their machines especially given the lack of any player that decodes all the HD formats... (And of course it allows those same manufacturers to sell you a shiny new amp too )

However, the PS3 is not such a beast and is 1.1 compliant (wth 2.0 promised) and therefore WILL have to worry about audio mixing... This thread shows how confusing it can all get with only one audio stream, and I suspect Sony may be holding off on bitstream HD audio until people get used to things like PiP. You could argue on the PS3, that being a highly interactive games machine, such features might get more use on this platform and be more popular than on standalones where primary concern might be more PQ/AQ related. If that's the case it may make more sense for Sony to hold back on HD bitstream for a while.

We'll see of course, but I would not rule it out.

[PaulGo]

Originally Posted by Maxpower1987

So Toshiba has decided to have a few more firesales on players and fund a few sales on discs as well. Big whoop. They did it before and it never helped so why would it this time around?

I love the way Toshiba spins the facts:

"As Toshiba achieved the #1 sales volume in the next generation DVD
category with an approximately 50 percent market share in 2007, HD DVD is
proven to be the format of choice for consumers. Coupled with an 80 percent
plus market share of all next generation DVD equipped notebooks for the 4th
quarter 2007, the HD DVD format has already paved the way to a high
definition digital AV solution by eliminating the boundaries between the
consumer's living room and on the go."

Meaning HD-DVD sales of stand-alone players are now less than Blu-ray stand-alone players even with the Toshiba $99 fire sales. Also if you add PS3 sales to the figure they are being totally demolished.

[JonasK]

Originally Posted by eat_me_cool

A good explanation here by Ian_S

http://www.avforums.com/forums/showp...7&postcount=25

I don't know if it a good explanation, but I can directly say that it is incorrect. Bitstreaming of HD audio is not a mandatory feature of HDMI 1.3.

[dobyblue]

Originally Posted by Papi4baby

400 For that i'll get the HDMI reciever or a standalone player.

Thanks for the info, didn't know anything about that, looking at it anyways.

Yes but for those with $10,000 worth of amplification and receivers not capable of HDMI, it will be perfect.

[edgebsl]

Its lies not SPIN. They had record sales volume on one specific title. One a certain Mr Bay is demanding release on blu. Overall sales volume are nowhere near 50% for players or software. Even if you cut out the PS3 , Blu Ray still won the player category for the year.

I understand inventory must be moved. But lying to consumers like that, and making them think TS still has a "win" in their play book. Is just dirty. I hope anyone getting suckered in by this ends up feeling so burned they never buy another TS product again.

Thats what they deserve for lying like that.

[Elandyll]

Originally Posted by edgebsl

Its lies not SPIN. They had record sales volume on one specific title. One a certain Mr Bay is demanding release on blu. Overall sales volume are nowhere near 50% for players or software. Even if you cut out the PS3 , Blu Ray still won the player category for the year.

I understand inventory must be moved. But lying to consumers like that, and making them think TS still has a "win" in their play book. Is just dirty. I hope anyone getting suckered in by this ends up feeling so burned they never buy another TS product again.

Thats what they deserve for lying like that.

Actually on HD DVD players, not counting the Xbox add ons, they are slightly under 50% of the market.
Of all HDM player standalones.

They used to have 55%+ of that market at the end of November, is what they don't tell you
Now Blu Ray has taken the lead, so they had to split it by CE maker to still show a lead (very misguiding, as they dunble blu Ray and HD DVD in the same term of "next gen HDM player standalones").

As per now touting the Laptop market domination, that is beyond retarded, and somewhat pathetic that they'd have to resort to showing these stats hehe.

[Frode]

Please don't believe anything you read on AVS.

A good explanation here by Ian_S

http://www.avforums.com/forums/showp...7&postcount=25

*cough* And AVForums is any better? At this point it's well known that HDMI version means absolutely nothing as far as the capabilities of the player goes. All it does is describe the capabilities of the transport, not the features supported by the player, or how possible it would be to add said features. Case in point - there are TVs out now that support xvYCC which needs hdmi 1.3, but I've yet to hear of any that support decoding bitstream audio, never mind the new codecs.

There's been no answer on IF/WHEN we'll ever get DTS-HD-MA on the PS3, and I doubt there ever will unless it's suddenly released one day. Put it to rest.

[eat_me_cool]

Originally Posted by JonasK

I don't know if it a good explanation, but I can directly say that it is incorrect. Bitstreaming of HD audio is not a mandatory feature of HDMI 1.3.

He doesn't say that its mandatory. What we do know for a fact is that we DO NOT KNOW if bitstream is possible from the PS3.

Silicon Image IMPLY it is on their website, but nobody except Sony can say for sure.

[phansson]

There was speculation that they couldn't improve the upscaling of SD DVD on the PS3. They did.

There was speculation that the PS3 wouldn't be 1.1 capable. It is.

There was speculation that the PS3 wouldn't be 2.0 capable. That has been announced.

The PS3 is a pretty amazing piece of A/V equipment. I would never doubt it being able to bitstream advanced audio eventually.

[kjack]

Originally Posted by merrick97

Do any of you care to comment on this further proof of Toshiba's stupidty

What do people expect? That they will suddenly run a white flag up the pole? Not going to happen. But keep in mind that the number of companies that decided to do a BD player as a result of the Warner announcement was staggering. Many companies that sell a DVD player today will be selling a BD player before the end of 2008.

[Blu Titan]

Originally Posted by blu2

Just so I am clear, this is complete and total non-insider speculation on your part, correct?

It is just deduction on my part.

[Azumi]

Originally Posted by kjack

What do people expect? That they will suddenly run a white flag up the pole? Not going to happen. But keep in mind that the number of companies that decided to do a BD player as a result of the Warner announcement was staggering. Many companies that sell a DVD player today will be selling a BD player before the end of 2008.

How do the BDA perceive Toshiba? Is it still a competitor, or a likely Blu-ray partner for tomorrow?