8K discussion thread

[unberechenbar]

Originally Posted by Deciazulado

Well one thing 8K displays in big sizes with real high contrast and expanded gamut can be usable for is for people that do or like high res photography right now. Some cameras already have 5K x 8K resolution or higher.
Before, you could only display photographic quality images as relatively medium size reflective print enlargements (max contrast about 200-300:1) or as 35mm projected slides (well there were a few medium format projectors, but.. )

But now you can have high res photographic gamut, and 4000:1 + contrast displayed as if they were 36" x 65" etc. giant large format transparencies on your wall.
"Cinematography/video content" can follow at one point or another after.

That's a good point. The cameras on most phones shoot with greater than 8 MP resolution, which is around 4K so even for looking at amateur photos a 8K screen could be beneficial. Phones with the 32 MP of 8K resolution are still somewhat rare though.

[Deciazulado]

Yes. And tho fairly expensive right now, we have DSLRs at 100MP quality for example, that at one point will become more accesible too.


2160p UHDTVs are 3.75K wide
4320p TVs are 7.5K wide


100MP camera b/w pic scaled down to 3K tall x 4K wide (12MP), the first pic from https://www.digitalcameraworld.com/r...fx-100s-review :

https://cdn.mos.cms.futurecdn.net/bT...HHhzBaFWaR.jpg

(see it at 1:1 full size)



These next ones, are 100MP in full size. You might have to wait a few secs extra after they load in their full size till they reach their true max sharpness.

From their 1:1 size, downscale these to 0.66x to see true “8K” width TV display quality, and 0.33x to see true “4K” width UHDTV display quality.


Close-up pic 8.5K Tall x 11.4K wide https://www.dpreview.com/files/p/art...841208418.jpeg,

the first photo from page 5 of https://www.dpreview.com/reviews/fuj...x-100-review/5



Cat quality pic 8.5K Tall x 11.4K wide https://www.imaging-resource.com/PRO...S-0053-MOD.JPG

from https://www.imaging-resource.com/PRO...-gfx-100sA.HTM

If direct link doesn't work scroll down to:

Performance

Click on the stare.

These eyes…



8.5K Tall x 11.4K wide Boat from https://www.dpreview.com/samples/192...sample-gallery,

go to https://www.dpreview.com/sample-gall...ery/5289113267 for color, image 95.

and click on: Original: JPEG (55.8MB) on bottom right.


Or https://www.dpreview.com/sample-gall...ery/2596825071 for b/w, image 96, Original: JPEG (39.0MB)



8.5K Tall x 11.4K wide Long shot from https://www.dpreview.com/samples/687...ry-dpreview-tv

go to https://www.dpreview.com/sample-gall...-tv/4605174596 (image 62)

and click on: Original: JPEG (62.6MB) on bottom right.


etc.


(This camera has also a quad mode to shoot 400MP (17K tall x 22.8K wide) images from static subjects if you so desire!)





and… a tricolor 5.6K tall x 7.7K wide image from a 6K tall x 8Kwide 50MP camera:

https://i0.wp.com/measuringlight.com...8/dscf0198.jpg

from https://measuringlight.com/2019/08/2...fx-50r-review/

If direct link doesn’t work, scroll down to:

Sharpness & Resolution

Click on the tricolored pic,

then click on the i at bottom right to then click on: View full color size (the https://i0.wp.com/measuringlight.com...8/dscf0198.jpg)


7.7Kasino Royale too much for one Bond

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

Eh, it's no different from watching a BD on a 4K TV: you shouldn't be seeing anything more/less than what's on the disc as long as the upscaling is competent. If you were to see an uptick between your current set and an 8K one showing the same 4K content it'd be due to the newer non-resolution-related display tech just looking betterer (backlight, colour gamut, contrast etc etc) rather than the 8K part having any intrinsic effect.

Correct and ever since Pete’s presentation at SMPTE -

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

https://www.smpte.org/blog/detail-4k-imaging

“2160p30 is inferior to 720p60 and does not show more detail than 1080p30," he said. "2160p60 is superior to 720p60 but only marginally better than 1080p60. And 1080p120 is superior to 2160p60. The Holy Grail for sports is 120; that's when you start to get interesting results.”

Might I add that with any significant people/object or camera (panning) motion - 2160p120 has more clarity than 4320p60
2160p = ‘4K’
4320p = ‘8K’

And if you see any 8K vs. 4K TV demos at industry shows in which there is any significant actor motion or camera panning motion and the 8K60p footage looks superior to the 4K60p, then the TV manufacturers are not including the best processing they have in their 4K TVs.

So, in terms of providing the public with greater picture detail, what should the industry be concentrating its efforts on?....with supporting hardware for increases in spatial or temporal resolution?…..unless one wants to view panoramic landscapes with locked off cameras, talking head content or unfair, contrived demos.

as well as the later Warner Bros. study in collaboration with Pixar, Amazon Prime Video, LG, and the American Society of Cinematographers -

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

This study - https://www.techhive.com/article/578...ifference.html , concluded that native 8k (displayed) is only marginally better than 4k in terms of perceived detail as viewed on one brand of 8k TV.

, for which the ^ lead author received The Journal Certificate of Merit last year - https://www.smpte.org/about/awards-p...icate-of-merit , the 8K consumer TV endeavor, in terms of the value of higher spatial resolution per se, is not looked upon fondly by unbiased researchers and engineers in the know without an agenda.

With regards to display tech, other endeavors like multi-primary displays, are more respected by the engineering and cinematographic (https://britishcinematographer.co.uk...ing-in-colour/) community especially if they can garner long term sufficient funding to make the R&D come to fruition with a viable consumer product. 6P had a booth at the recently concluded HPA tech retreat –



https://www.baylor.edu/mediacommunic...y&story=223685

The Baylor University research team members kind of remind me, perhaps Kris too, of the UBC Brightside team back in the day with the development of the first HDR display - https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...ge#post8641670

[thejoeman2]

In the 2nd picture, is that an updated cmyk gamut?

[Lee A Stewart]

Consumers Remain Skeptical of 8k

LONDON—New consumer research suggests that 8K TV is failing to appeal to consumers, with Omdia reporting that 8K TVs only accounted for 0.15% of all TV shipments in 2021 and predicting that only 2.7 million households worldwide are expected to have an 8K TV by the end of 2026.

https://www.tvtechnology.com/news/co...keptical-of-8k

[slimdude]

I've been trying to tell you guys all along about those 8K TVs. They're not flying off the shelves! They were dead on arrival, and the early adopters who've ran out and bought them (so they can say: I got one) have been duped because, they're only being used as an upscaler.

[bailey1987]

Until I have a physical format in 8k I have no need for an 8k tv

[unberechenbar]

I would guess that most people won't buy an 8K TV until 4K TVs become what 1080p TVs are today.

[LordoftheRings]

▪︎ https://www.rtings.com/tv/learn/8k-vs-4k-uhd

Tomorrow never dies ...

[LordoftheRings]

Read on by clicking on it ^ .... We all want one; we know it but are just too afraid to say it.
Be afraid no more, just jump in ...

[slimdude]

Originally Posted by LordoftheRings

Read on by clicking on it ^ .... We all want one; we know it but are just too afraid to say it.
Be afraid no more, just jump in ...

Not everyone want a BMW with a 8K TV inside of it because, some people don't want to try to live above their means. This is for the rich folks, the multi-million and billionaires because, an average Joe Six Pack wouldn't be able to afford it.

[LordoftheRings]

Originally Posted by slimdude

Not everyone want a BMW with a 8K TV inside of it because, some people don't want to try to live above their means. This is for the rich folks, the multi-million and billionaires because, an average Joe Six Pack wouldn't be able to afford it.

Certainly ...

[HDTV1080P]

Originally Posted by bailey1987

Until I have a physical format in 8k I have no need for an 8k tv

You might get your wish in 2026 if a new optical disc format launches (2026-2028 timeframe). People will have to wait and see what happens in the industry to see if the 10 year cycle comes true again. DVD 1997, Blu-ray 2006, 4K Blu-ray 2016, and 8K optical disc 2026+ a possibility.

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by HDTV1080P

You might get your wish in 2026 if a new optical disc format launches (2026-2028 timeframe). People will have to wait and see what happens in the industry to see if the 10 year cycle comes true again. DVD 1997, Blu-ray 2006, 4K Blu-ray 2016, and 8K optical disc 2026+ a possibility.

In an alternate universe, sure. But in this one?

[HeavyHitter]

Originally Posted by HDTV1080P

You might get your wish in 2026 if a new optical disc format launches (2026-2028 timeframe). People will have to wait and see what happens in the industry to see if the 10 year cycle comes true again. DVD 1997, Blu-ray 2006, 4K Blu-ray 2016, and 8K optical disc 2026+ a possibility.

I think it's more like...hopefully every major studio is still supporting UHD BD by 2026.

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by HeavyHitter

I think it's more like...hopefully every major studio is still supporting UHD BD by 2026.

I'd be surprised if the majors are still outputting high quality disc e.g. BD and UHD on this sort of scale by then. Indies yes, majors no. And would equally not be surprised if they dumped them but kept DVD going!

But hopefully they'll have offered forth all their major catalogue upgrades by then, if I have to live with new studio movies being released on digital only (with maybe a boutique disc release a little while later) then so be it.

[TheBondFan]

I'm waiting for a 16K TV.

[nick4Knight]

Originally Posted by unberechenbar

I would guess that most people won't buy an 8K TV until 4K TVs become what 1080p TVs are today.

And that won't happen. Since in that example CONTENT existed with mainstream adoption (or at least a industry path in place) of the entire ecosystem to replace 1080p. The almighty circular sticking point. The glaring hole. I'm not talking about supplemental resolutions for special cases like Sport, Documentaries and the random experimentations of a tiny minority of movies...

There would require all Hollywood and TV series productions somehow embracing 8K as a mastering output resolution. As the years go on it seems less likely, not more. Since the issues of scanning resolution already maxing out older catalog and current filmed content is at play. Since were still on 2K DI being most common years after they tried to push 8K in the first place. And most condemning is 2K CGI files is most blockbuster movies default.

We still haven't even got 12-bit technology at 4K... Which strikes me as so much more where the industry should go at this magical 2026 prediction point. But I'm fine if its beyond that and just folded into a branching/tiered digital standard remaining titled "4K UHD". But that's just me. 8K 10-bit 4:2:0 = boring... 4K 12-bit 4:2:0[/B] (or 4:2:2/4:4:4 in time) = awesome!

[Lee A Stewart]

Originally Posted by nick4Knight

And that won't happen. Since in that example CONTENT existed with mainstream adoption (or at least a industry path in place) of the entire ecosystem to replace 1080p. The almighty circular sticking point. The glaring hole. I'm not talking about supplemental resolutions for special cases like Sport, Documentaries and the random experimentations of a tiny minority of movies...

There would require all Hollywood and TV series productions somehow embracing 8K as a mastering output resolution. As the years go on it seems less likely, not more. Since the issues of scanning resolution already maxing out older catalog and current filmed content is at play. Since were still on 2K DI being most common years after they tried to push 8K in the first place. And most condemning is 2K CGI files is most blockbuster movies default.

We still haven't even got 12-bit technology at 4K... Which strikes me as so much more where the industry should go at this magical 2026 prediction point. But I'm fine if its beyond that and just folded into a branching/tiered digital standard remaining titled "4K UHD". But that's just me. 8K 10-bit 4:2:0 = boring... 4K 12-bit 4:2:0[/B] (or 4:2:2/4:4:4 in time) = awesome!

You might see 4K 12bit in the future. Maybe even 4:2:2 Chroma Subsampling. But you will never see 4:4:4. Reserved as a professional format. Like 16 bit color space which is what todays Cinema Digital Cameras capture at.

[Anthony P]

Originally Posted by HDTV1080P

You might get your wish in 2026 if a new optical disc format launches (2026-2028 timeframe). People will have to wait and see what happens in the industry to see if the 10 year cycle comes true again. DVD 1997, Blu-ray 2006, 4K Blu-ray 2016, and 8K optical disc 2026+ a possibility.

I would love top see 8k physical media, and I think one day we will. BUT 2026 is just way too soon. Let me put it this way a bunch of companies came together in Feb 2002 and named themselves Blu-ray disc founders. At that point most of the tech was kind of ready (blue lasers....)

New formats take years to be made, you need to get a bunch of companies to agree on some standards, you need to make sure you can build production capabilities you need to make sure players can work..... And unlike 3D and even 4K (that have pushed BD as far as it can) a true 8k format will like DVD and BD most likely require a new physical format and not just a tweak on data layers.

Originally Posted by HeavyHitter

I think it's more like...hopefully every major studio is still supporting UHD BD by 2026.

don't know what you mean by "major studio is still supporting UHD BD".

if you mean producing them in-house or just we will have those titles available on UHD BD

but, since someone posted this in a different thread



I just can't imagine studios will want to get rid of 20% of the market or even if we start with the assumption of displacement( those people will buy it on BD/DVD....) accept less revenue.