Sony introduces high-end ZD9 TV series with HDR

[pbz06]

Originally Posted by DJR662

I almost always watch in a pitch dark room with my ZD9. You still think it would be better to use Custom for 1000 nit material and at what contrast and gamma level do you have it at? As you know this TV can be bright as hell, especially in a dark room plus my viewing distance is slightly less than 2 meters. I use Custom for 3D viewing so that would mean adding another picture setting for 3D then.

Btw you say Universal, Paramount and Fox master at 1000. So only Sony master at 4000? What about Warner and Lionsgate and will they all continue to master their movies at the same level?



So when watching SDR on Pro, contrast is also at 90?

Yup.

[elwaylite]

Im kinda torn. We sit straight out about 9 feet, from an 18" tall stand, so an LCD would work fine with the limited view angles. The ZD9, the A1E and the 75" 940E are all tempting. The 75" monster especially. Can't wait to see what the shootout results look like.

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by DJR662

I almost always watch in a pitch dark room with my ZD9. You still think it would be better to use Custom for 1000 nit material and at what contrast and gamma level do you have it at? As you know this TV can be bright as hell, especially in a dark room plus my viewing distance is slightly less than 2 meters. I use Custom for 3D viewing so that would mean adding another picture setting for 3D then.

Btw you say Universal, Paramount and Fox master at 1000. So only Sony master at 4000? What about Warner and Lionsgate and will they all continue to master their movies at the same level?

I mentioned those three for 1000-nit grades because the other three all do 4000-nit.

And no, I don't use another mode for 1000-nit stuff, when I tried it out at length it looked much too bright and overcooked, as I explained in my reply to my own post above.

Originally Posted by pbz06

So with Home at 88 and Gamma +1, doesn't it blow and clip when watching 4000 nit content?

I tested it with BvS, and there's a couple scenes during the Doomsday battle where his eyes light up and shoots lasers, there was obvious clipping and it also looked bad in general when I had Home and 90. Also when superman is floating in space unconscious and "healing", the camera pans and the sun is in view, and it's also a good scene to test the clipping. Above 82 and it started looking bad and clipped.

I sort of want to do what you do and just have one HDR setting so I can stop tweaking!

I've gone back and forth with movies like BvS and Pan which have lots of clipping torture tests (see my photo a few posts up ) and I'm getting very little highlight loss, if any. If I bring up the 7669 nits ramp on a Sony disc then it clears the 3000 nit bar, and when using Ryan Masciola's more precise nit ramp then it goes all the way up to 89% which is literally just under 4000 nits. I'm very, very happy with how I've got it right now.

[DJR662]

^^^ And I am very, very happy with information like this, wish you'd also own the XD9405.

[Geoff D]

I went back and looked at a few more bits in BvS and the only things that are clipping are the very brightest speculars that literally only last for a fraction of a second, like the lens flares at the bottom left of the frame when Wonder Woman jumps in and sends that massive energy wave towards Doomsday. If I switch between contrast 82 and 88 then those little specular points are definitely clipping but the actual action which is constant from frame to frame e.g. all the energy/lightning bolts, heat vision blasts, explosions etc are fine.

One thing I did notice though is some hellishly gnarly artefacts, like when Supes is floating in space and we get that massively bright shot of the sun: as the light recedes the sun itself becomes a morass of macroblocks, it's fugly. Reminds me exactly of how ST '09 chokes whenever the brighter elements flash across the screen.

[pbz06]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

I went back and looked at a few more bits in BvS and the only things that are clipping are the very brightest speculars that literally only last for a fraction of a second, like the lens flares at the bottom left of the frame when Wonder Woman jumps in and sends that massive energy wave towards Doomsday. If I switch between contrast 82 and 88 then those little specular points are definitely clipping but the actual action which is constant from frame to frame e.g. all the energy/lightning bolts, heat vision blasts, explosions etc are fine.

One thing I did notice though is some hellishly gnarly artefacts, like when Supes is floating in space and we get that massively bright shot of the sun: as the light recedes the sun itself becomes a morass of macroblocks, it's fugly. Reminds me exactly of how ST '09 chokes whenever the brighter elements flash across the screen.

Yup, that scene is exactly what I noticed which got me revisiting the test patterns. With Contrast at 82, it did avoid those sun artifacts on my test. But like you said, it does make the picture look dull (which this movie has a dull palette to begin with).

I'll stick with Home/88/+1 for a while to check out more movies and scenes for myself. Until now, I just had Home/90 with Gamma at 0 which has been looking good until I popped in BvS and noticed those scenes.

[DJR662]

You should copyright those settings, Geoff!

Who knows how many people are lurking around this thread and using them for their Z9Ds.

[mutelight]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

There's no point posting any white balance stuff because it really is different from set to set (and mine is very different from SDR to HDR, even) but here's the juice for my UHD viewing, delivering 1869 nits peak output which maps to just under 4000 nits:

[Show spoiler]Brightness: Max
Contrast: 88
Gamma: +1
Black level: 50
Black adjust: off
ACE: off
LD: medium
XDR: high

Color: 52
Tint: 0
Color temp: Expert 1
Live color: off

Sharpness: 50
RC: off
Random NR: off
Digital noise NR: off
Smooth gradation: off

Motionflow: Off
Film mode: Medium (this is the first setting where the reverse 3:2 pulldown is applied to 24fps mastered as 60Hz, Low has no effect. Motionflow must be set to TrueCinema or Custom to enable it, good for DVDs and older 1080i60 sources e.g. DVHS or certain Blu-rays)

Video options: all on auto

Just trying out these setting with The Fifth Element which arrived today and thus far the results are stunning. Thank you, sir!

[gkolb]

News flash from the WKRP newsroom, little babies!

Just got a software (aka firmware?) update on the Z9D at 1030pm PDT.
No documentation or thumbnail of what got updated yet.
Be on the lookout...

[DJR662]

Btw anyone else not liking the new picture settings menu structure since the previous update? I prefer the bright white text against the black background. If it ain't broke...

Oh well, at least there's no horizontal lines and a Motionflow/local dimming error during HDR playback like on the XD9405 since last year's October update.

[Geoff D]

I love the new menus, how they're smaller and more compact when changing settings during playback.

And I've gotta say, the OS has been excellent so far in terms of responsiveness and whatnot. I don't use any of the streaming shite nor even have it connected to the Internet but still, the way some people were talking about the android system was like it was the slowest thing on earth.

[PeterTHX]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

I love the new menus, how they're smaller and more compact when changing settings during playback.

And I've gotta say, the OS has been excellent so far in terms of responsiveness and whatnot. I don't use any of the streaming shite nor even have it connected to the Internet but still, the way some people were talking about the android system was like it was the slowest thing on earth.

Not for me, sluggish city. Hell, there's a delay in just opening the menu from the remote.

[Geoff D]

It reacts very quickly for me but again: no internet shite.

[DJR662]

I haven't had any real problems with the ZD9's Android OS (unlike the XD9405), save for a couple of instances of unresponsiveness. Have it connected to the internet so the missus can watch Netflix, Youtube and whatever.

[gkolb]

Originally Posted by gkolb

News flash from the WKRP newsroom, little babies!

Just got a software (aka firmware?) update on the Z9D at 1030pm PDT.
No documentation or thumbnail of what got updated yet.
Be on the lookout...

Found documentation notes on the Sony USA site:

"UPDATE System Software Update
This software update (version PKG6.2648.0065NAA) provides the following changes and benefits:

Improvements over version PKG6.2414.0040NAA:
•Adds ... [+]
Release Date 7/11/2017 Version PKG6.2648.0065NAA File Size 1.56 GB "

" What Does This Do?


This software update (version PKG6.2648.0065NAA) provides the following changes and benefits:

Improvements over version PKG6.2414.0040NAA:

•Adds support for the Amazon® Alexa™ app that runs on Amazon Echo™ devices
•Resolves an issue where optical digital sound sometimes stops
•Resolves an issue where the TV speakers and the sound from the PS4 controller are out of sync
•Resolves an issue where frame drops occur and the AV is out of sync when playing 4K HDR 60fps content

Benefits provided by previous updates and included in version PKG6.2648.0065NAA:
•Adds support for the A2DP Bluetooth® profile
•Adds support for PIP (Picture-in-Picture) while using an app (watch TV in a small window while using an Android TV™ app)
•Adds support for Hybrid Log-Gamma HDR content via HDMI® and USB/Home network
•Improves the Settings screen to support changing settings while viewing TV (some exceptions may apply)
•Adds support for task-switching (switch between previously used apps and the current app by holding down the HOME button on your remote until the task-switching menu appears) "

Sounds like a few issue resolutions, and AFAIK the HLG and PIP mentions were installed in the prior update, maybe issues were resolved for them, too.

Nothing sounds or smells like a Dolby Vision mention in the above to me.

[DJR662]

I wish there would be an update with the following documentation note:


This software update provides the following changes and benefits:

-Disables all apps and makes your smart TV dumb so it can focus solely on the one thing it was meant to do: showing a goddamn picture.

[Geoff D]

That's what mine does

[gkolb]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

That's what mine does

Hey Geoff,

I input your calibration settings into Cinema Home (Thanks!), but I can't get them to stick. I had to re-enter some parts a second time. Now I just looked today and the Brightness and Gamma settings in C Home are back to default again.

I might mention that I have found my Z9D running two different mornings in the last 4-5 weeks when we got up. And I know I had turned it off both times. (Don't ask, I do know for sure.)

Now I am wondering if I need to do some kind of grand reset, or turn off the internet connection to keep it from talking to the Sony mothership. On the other hand, it could just be talking to the cable provider central computer, as it has added add'l digital cable channels at certain times in the last 6 months.

Any thoughts or ideas would be appreciated. I too would just like a non-smart-ass TV. ( I'm kinda thinking of pulling my hair out at this point.) With the option to watch Netflix HDR programs when needed.

I do like your cal setttings, although most of the HDR movies we have watched in the last month haven't seemed to have any huge WOW hdr moments in them.

[Geoff D]

That doesn't sound right to me, I'd reset it just to be sure but seeing as you've got yours hooked into the internet and I don't then who knows?

Go with what you like on the settings if you feel you're not getting the pop you once were, alls I can say is that stuff like John Wick 2, Lego Batman and Warcraft knocked my socks off for HDR. Not everything is going to look super-bright and super-colourful, Logan being a case in point with its very natural looking HDR grade, and yet it still reveals tons of highlight detail that the BD just chokes on. Loving this TV.

[elwaylite]

Well, I made my jump into 75" land, its not a ZD9 but its baby brother and I am pretty dang impressed.

First impressions, coming from a 65" E6 OLED (keeping in mind no pitch black room viewing yet):

• Doesn't look big sitting there, but dang when its on from 9.5 feet, took a little getting used to. Going to be great during movies.
• As expected, motion is much better than the OLED. After some testing I settled on Standard MotionFlow mode, which is what I used on my 930C when I had it. Saw a little artifacting on Smoothness 3 (Still not near as much as an LG's TruMotion), and it did not present in live content on Standard, so knowing Standard is 650 lines of motion rez, Ill just go with it. Now it is a tad soapy, but I actually prefer that, so YMMV.
• Video processing in familiar content streaming and Directv is very surprising. I see less noise in the lower quality feeds than on a 65" OLED, but they do not generally do as well as an LCD in that area. The cool thing is, the content is blown up 10" more and mostly looks as good or better. On Amazon and Netflix high quality streams from an X800, I think the image is cleaner than the 65" was.
• HDR on Netflix and Blu-ray looks great, and it def has the nit power.
• Styling wise its a lovely display, and I love the wire hiding panels and the way they disappear in the stand legs.
• Screen uniformity on mixed content looks great.
• Really happy with Cinema Pro mode out of the box, I read they were pretty dang accurate in these modes, and it appears so. Chad B should be here next month for my cal.

Now for the warts:

• Picture is a little flat compared to the OLED (some scenes), but it was fully expected by me. You can't really trump zero blacks on pixel with the ability to light the one next to it, FALD can't do it.
• View angle... My wife and I are lucky enough to be right out in front and eye level, so its lovely. I did some moving around, and I'd estimate if you have a 7 cushion couch, the center cushion as well as 2 to each side (5 total) would get a excellent view from 10 feet, but 6 and 7 on the outer edge start to wash. I think this is better than my 930C.

This thing is a beauty, no doubt it is a way to go if you want larger than 65" and can't afford a 77" OLED. And it is obviously better than LG's OLED in a few ways. Can't wait to watch King Kong or GITS UHD this weekend and check out the dark room performance. I used to use my 930C in a dark room, and other than some flashlighting it did a good job, so I imagine this one will do fine.

Few pics of the setup and the wire management.