Star Wars: Episode VII - The Force Awakens (USE SPOILER TAGS!)

[Zivouhr]

Originally Posted by Nocturnaloner

Normally, I stay out of geekfights, because they're always a waste of time, but what the hell, it's Christmas, and I've got some time to kill.



This is why you're having so many problems in this thread: You're not explaining any of your opinions, you're just spewing out negatives.

Why does it not stand on its own? Even people who have never seen a Star Wars movie have no problems following The Force Awakens. That's the definition of standing on its own.

If the new characters make no sense, how could they make sense, in your opinion?

Why are you insisting that this character is the same as the one mentioned in Revenge of the Sith, when no one knows yet? How is it the 'worst possible'? Have you seen all other possibilities? Worse than if it was JarJar? Can you see how that's a ridiculous statement?

"My family all thinks so too!" is not an argument. I'd like to hear more about your viewpoint, but you're coming across like a crazy person on a rant, instead of someone who is following any kind of logic.

Good point Nocturnaloner. Saying "I hate this movie" does little for the filmmakers in terms of helping them improve it other than to think "What didn't they like about it?" Saying, "I hate this movie because (and giving specific reasons)" is a lot more constructive and gives them something to work with.

On the other hand, "I loved this movie" is a good summary that most of the movie appealed to them and they didn't see much they would change. It suggests "keep doing this."


Personally, I love Star Wars VII, and can't wait for Star Wars VIII.
I definitely saw all of what the movie did right, and didn't worry about some of the minor characters not being tied up with their story/fate since I was having too much fun watching it.

[Show spoiler](like the wise Yoda like character with the goggles, what happened to her?).

[Zivouhr]

Originally Posted by StarkRomanoff

I just saw this last night in 3D w/Atmos...

Now, I've never liked Star Wars. I don't dislike it, it's just not for me. I didn't grow up with it and it was one of those things fans and retailers would try to force on me. Needless to say I was not part of the hype but I knew what it felt like as a fan to have new material released. I went into this with no knowledge of the movie, a few widely known facts about the original movies, and the intention of having this movie get me into the franchise. So, now I can say it...

I LOVED this movie! I thought it was incredibly well shot, well written, well acted, and introduced the new characters brilliantly, leaving so much depth to be discovered. I'm excited for this new generation of Star Wars stories, particularly to see more of Rey. Knowing I have this and future SW films to look forward to, I now want to catch up with the previous films I missed.

As a non-fan and former naysayer, I give this a 5/5.

Cool. Glad to hear you enjoyed it having not been a fan of the series. Rey is cool, agreed. Enjoy the other movies.

How did you like the 3D?
3D looked great in my view, with high medium to strong 3D layers and some nice pop outs. Not flat or mild 3D. Definitely added to the movie experience, made it feel more real as if I was almost there. But that's just my point of view.

[Aerodude73]

Box Office: 'Star Wars: The Force Awakens' Opens to Record $238M for Cosmic $517M Global Launch.


J.J. Abrams' movie scores the biggest North American opening of all time in addition to breaking numerous records overseas.

The Force is back, and it's stronger than ever.

J.J. Abrams' Star Wars: The Force Awakens shattered numerous box-office records over the weekend, grossing $238 million in North America — the biggest opening of all time, not accounting for inflation — for a global launch of $517 million.

The previous biggest domestic opening was this summer's Jurassic World with $208.8 million. Worldwide, Force Awakens scored the second-biggest start of all time behind Jurassic World ($524.9 million), which had the advantage of opening day and date in China. Force Awakens doesn't debut in the world's second-largest moviegoing market until Jan. 9.

Force Awakens' international haul was $279 million, the No. 3 opening of all time behind Jurassic World ($316 million) and the final Harry Potter film ($314 million).

Other records broken by Force Awakens in North America include widest December release of all time (4,134 theaters), biggest Thursday-night previews ($57 million), biggest single day and biggest opening day ($120.5 million), first film to cross $100 million in a single day, fastest film to $100 million and $200 million, top theater average for a wide release ($57,568) and biggest Imax opening ($30.1 million). And Force Awakens came close to taking the record for biggest Saturday from Jurassic World ($69.2 million).

** THR.com **

[mjbethancourt]

Screenplay-wise, I thought this was every bit as messy as AOTC, but thankfully unlike AOTC it didn't have a whole third of the film that was unbearably awful. Everything seems to happen in a way that is so inexplicably convenient... and I don't mean coincidental, as in "the force is making everything turn out as it is meant to", no I mean it's like it all happens for the convenience of a writer who doesn't want to be bothered with details or plausibility. Everything felt very "ex machina".

As for the film "looking" like a classic Star Wars film, I attribute that to a decade of improvements in CGI, so now it looks a lot more like physical model footage. For me, the "look" of a classic Star Wars film is defined by a comic-book panel or storyboard visual layout, brought to life with a hard physical reality of industrial materials and realistic lighting. This film doesn't have that same storyboard visual layout, and instead mimics the "look" of classic Star Wars simply by directly porting backgrounds, scenery, and props from them, and yes it does also revert to the lighting style of classic Star Wars. Retreading the story elements also probably went a long way towards putting people in a frame of mind of being "back" in a classic Star Wars rather than a prequel, but for me it had more the effect of the "LotR Tourism" of The Hobbit: an Unexpected Journey, it was too forced.

There was also a fair amount of cheese. In one glaring example, they seemed to self-consciously mock themselves for re-treading old ground: when they are

[Show spoiler] watching the Starkiller hologram, planning their attack, someone makes the reasonable interjection along the lines of "couldn't we just fly in and blow it up like a death star?", and the answer given is "no, because a death star is only this big, but starkiller base is THIS big".

That soooo reminded me of the self-deprecating

[Show spoiler]"we need more teeth"

gag at the end of Jurassic World. Another thing straight from the fondue pot is the performance of Domnhall Gleeson, but bad acting is par for the course in Star Wars, and overall The Force Awakens did somewhat better in that area than all previous Star Wars films.

The thing is, I love all the Star Wars movies, I don't hate any of them, and I don't hate other people for not having the same opinion. AoTC is sorely flawed, and I can't watch it without skipping through several scenes, but I still give it a 3/5 because there is still so much to like about it. Likewise for The Force Awakens, which for me is basically in a tie with Phantom Menace for fifth-best Star Wars movie, with a score of 75/100. I enjoyed it enough to see it again, and buy it on disc next year. But I was disappointed that this film didn't even come close to living up to the hype. Last week's previews were talking about this film like it's the greatest thing to ever happen, and Oscars for best picture and best director were even frequently mentioned. I just don't understand why people choose to dwell exclusively on the negatives of the prequels, and ignore everything that was good about them, but then with The Force Awakens everyone has chosen to completely ignore the flaws and dwell exclusively on what was good about it...

...well, actually, I think I do understand why. I think it's just one last manifestation of the vicious and irrational vilification of George Lucas. I predicted as much here two years ago, and it has unfolded just as I had foreseen. I doubt that I'm the first one to notice that pretty much every single one of the unhinged anti-Lucas/PT lynch mob predictably gave this film 5/5.

So now here's one more prediction, this time for Star Wars 8: in keeping with the retread/rehash formula, now that they've

[Show spoiler]established some fondness and intimate chemistry between our two young leading characters

, there will be a love triangle between Rey, Finn, and Poe, with Rey ending up falling for the older hotshot pilot Poe, while Finn pursues the monastic ways of the force, and becomes a jedi.

...Oh, and Snoke is almost certainly Plagueis. Just as there is really no ambiguity as to who is

[Show spoiler]Rey's father

.

[UK_fan_05]

Why can't someone love this movie without being a Lucas hater? I gave this film a 4/5, might move up to a 5 after repeat viewings. I like all of the Star Wars films. AOTC is the weakest, IMO, at around a 3/5 but everything else is 4/5 or 5/5. Stop trying to justify why people like this movie. Does anyone think that it is liked because it IS a good movie and not because of some agenda against George Lucas or the prequel trilogy?

[mjbethancourt]

Originally Posted by UK_fan_05

Why can't someone love this movie without being a Lucas hater? I gave this film a 4/5, might move up to a 5 after repeat viewings. I like all of the Star Wars films. AOTC is the weakest, IMO, at around a 3/5 but everything else is 4/5 or 5/5. Stop trying to justify why people like this movie. Does anyone think that it is liked because it IS a good movie and not because of some agenda against George Lucas or the prequel trilogy?

Didn't say all the 5/5 were from the Lucas lynchers; I said all the self-identified Lucas haters predictably gave it a 5/5. That's not the same thing at all. I'm not attempting to label people (they already labeled themselves), I'm attempting to explain an overwhelming statistical trend, and making the observation that a vast majority of people have chosen to view PT films with a negative predisposition to ignore what is good about them (which obviously does not include you), while also choosing to ignore any and all faults in Force Awakens, which has just as many as any PT film. Just because I find fault in the film, doesn't necessarily mean that I'm bashing it or that I didn't like it, it just means I'm honest about how I review a film, whether I love it or not. Empire Strikes Back is probably my 2nd-favorite film of all time, and I still find fault in it: the acting and principal footage in the first third of that film are dreadful, the bad working conditions come through on the screen. Thankfully, that part of the movie is rescued by spectacular second-unit footage that would hold up in a film made today...

...and are you suggesting that there isn't an agenda against Lucas/PT, at least among a certain group of people?

Oh well, someone didn't like my review. Guess a trolling suspension will be coming my way now.

[UK_fan_05]

Originally Posted by mjbethancourt

Didn't say all the 5/5 were from the Lucas lynchers; I said all the self-identified Lucas haters gave it a 5/5. That's not the same thing at all. I'm not attempting to label people, I'm attempting to explain an overwhelming statistical trend, and making the observation that a vast majority of people have chosen to view PT films with a negative predisposition to ignore what is good about them (which obviously does not include you), while also choosing to ignore any and all faults in Force Awakens, which has just as many as any PT film...

...and are you suggesting that there isn't an agenda against Lucas/PT, at least among a certain group of people?

Oh well, someone didn't like my review. Guess a trolling suspension will be coming my way now.

I don't think the hater groups are as large as you think. Every film has faults, the PT, the OT, and TFA but they aren't massive enough to ruin my enjoyment of the films, except for AOTC. I don't see your post as trolling, I see it as trying to state a fact of why this film was successful. Be honest, you came into the film knowing you wouldn't like it right? Did you have an agenda yourself?

[mjbethancourt]

Originally Posted by UK_fan_05

I don't see your post as trolling, I see it as trying to state a fact of why this film was successful. Be honest, you came into the film knowing you wouldn't like it right? Did you have an agenda yourself?

Absolutely wrong. I went into the film trusting the reviews, and wanting to see the best Star Wars yet. I was encouraged to hear so many people call it the best Star Wars since 1980. I was disappointed, however I never said I didn't like it, so you are wrong to pin that on me. 75/100 is a fine rating, it's the same rating I give to Phantom Menace. Why would I not want to like it, when I love every single Star Wars movie, even AotC? You realize, of course, I can also throw the same thing right back:

"Can't a person give an honest, down-to-earth, zealotry-free review of this film without people assuming I have an agenda and negative predisposition?"

As for the demographics of the Death to Lucas crowd:
if you click on the poll, it lists the names of who gave it which rating. I've been a member here since 2008, I'm familiar with hundreds if not thousands of these screen names, and over the years I've become quite familiar with who is part of that crowd, and I see all their names there. I'm not relying on generalizations, I'm observing empiric data. At any rate, that crowd is big enough and real enough that they have even produced a Death to Lucas documentary, which is even sold on Blu-ray.

No hard feelings, you can't be expected to know my whole story without me telling it. Cheers.

[UK_fan_05]

Originally Posted by mjbethancourt

Absolutely wrong. I went into the film trusting the reviews, and wanting too see the best Star Wars yet. I was encouraged to hear so many people call it the best Star Wars since 1980. I was disappointed. Why would I not want to like it, when I love every single Star Wars movie, even AotC?

As for the demographics of the Death to Lucas crowd:
if you click on the poll, it lists the names of who gave it which rating. I've been a member here since 2008, I'm familiar with hundreds if not thousands of these screen names, and over the years I've become quite familiar with who is part of that crowd, and I see all their names there. I'm not relying on generalizations, I'm observing empiric data.

I've been here since 08 also and I also have eidetic memory and I can't remember that many screen names and what their stance on the PT and George Lucas is.

[rickah88]

Originally Posted by UK_fan_05

Why can't someone love this movie without being a Lucas hater? I gave this film a 4/5, might move up to a 5 after repeat viewings. I like all of the Star Wars films. AOTC is the weakest, IMO, at around a 3/5 but everything else is 4/5 or 5/5. Stop trying to justify why people like this movie. Does anyone think that it is liked because it IS a good movie and not because of some agenda against George Lucas or the prequel trilogy?

Well said, and I agree!

[PiratesCove]

Its very interesting that the children of the 70s, 80s the saw the original trilogy and loved them, are unable to understand this film is for the children of the 10s.

If you like the old movies, go watch them,

Star Wars has become a cultural experience (the toys, costumes, dialogue & concepts), beyond the films and too many people are expecting the cultural experience instead of a FILM.

Funny, many critics also hated A New Hope upon its initial run......so

The Force Awakens is Entertainment first, and Mythology second.

Read the book "The Hero With A Thousand Faces" by Joseph Campbell for a better understand of what Star Wars is really about...

[Gamma_Winstead]

Originally Posted by madlost1

[Show spoiler]When was it ever mentioned that Hux was killed?

[Show spoiler]It wasn't. He didn't pay attention to the film he saw. Hux is specifically alive, and told to bring Kylo to Snoke. The only character who is debatable is Phasma, but Kathleen Kennedy confirmed that she's alive and will be in Episode 8. It's easily explainable by saying Phasma just used her communicator to ask someone to open the trash door for her. We don't even actually see her get thrown in either.

[Ernest Rister]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

As Ernest Rinster kept saying...

Stupid British press! It's Rister! RISTER! How am I supposed to get famous and wealthy and go to some glamorous prison when everyone gets my name wrong!

(insert "jumping out of window" gif here)

[rickah88]

Originally Posted by Ernest Rister

(insert "jumping out of window" gif here)

Perhaps our UK poster will name it an Ernest Rister?

[mjbethancourt]

Originally Posted by Nocturnaloner

Why does it not stand on its own? Even people who have never seen a Star Wars movie have no problems following The Force Awakens. That's the definition of standing on its own.

I could be wrong, but I believe you misunderstand what he meant by that. I think what he meant was that the original Star Wars works as a "standalone" movie, it didn't need a sequel or prequel to justify any of its elements. The Force Awakens could not stand alone as a story without the context of the other Star Wars films, too many elements of the story are dependent upon that context, and I would go further to say that out of the 7 films, it is the most dependent upon the context of the franchise, and I think that was by design, there was an undeniable amount of "fan service". (From my point of view, the mere inclusion of Han Solo and the Milennium Falcon are worth about $300-$400 million worth of gross sales, it's not complicated.)

That being said, I'm not sure how meaningful the "stand alone" critique really is, since Star Wars is pretty much the only one out of the 7 that works that way, for the obvious reason that no such context existed in 1977.

[Blu-Benny]

Originally Posted by Aerodude73

Box Office: 'Star Wars: The Force Awakens' Opens to Record $238M for Cosmic $517M Global Launch.


J.J. Abrams' movie scores the biggest North American opening of all time in addition to breaking numerous records overseas.




** THR.com **

wait a minute......this movie ended up breaking records??

who saw THAT coming??

[dallywhitty]

Booking tickets to see this film in IMAX is like trying to find meaning in a will.i.am song. Both my girlfriend and I really wanna see this but I've looked at the screenings over the week and all the good seats are booked already. It's my own fault for not buying tickets earlier, of course, but it looks like I'll be waiting for the hype to die down before I see it.

[StevenHarvey1990]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cpS6TlqgLIQ

Thoughts? I kinda agree with him but it doesn't hurt my enjoyment of the film though.

[JayFank]

Obviously, there are parallels to A New Hope, but I'd say it's more of a remix of Episodes 4-6 than anything else.

[ScarredLungs]

I might go see this in 3D tomorrow with my wife. Is the 3D good?