Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald (2018) - November 16, 2018

[yeslek]

Originally Posted by dgoswald

I dunno, freeing Rowling's Wizarding World lore from the strictures of the boarding school mystery apparatus made me realise she's got gold on her hands in terms of the mythology she's created. I know we return to Hogwarts in Beasts 2, but you know what I mean, lol.

exactly - there is a rich history and array of characters she only hinted at within the Potter series
I want to know more about the history of the wizarding world and prior significant wizards/witches, heck, even going so far back as the school founders....seeing the magical worlds at differing points of history sounds like a goldmine

it makes the HP story feel kind of basic - fish out of water, finding where he belongs and defeating a big bad....it follows the typical story structure and I never really liked many of the kid characters either and found myself wanting to know more about Dumbledores past (for example) so the fact they are covering it in these movies, AND the time period they chose, has me hooked.

The lore she applied in the Potter series IS a goldmine, I agree, and I would love more from it.

[dgoswald]

Originally Posted by yeslek

exactly - there is a rich history and array of characters she only hinted at within the Potter series
I want to know more about the history of the wizarding world and prior significant wizards/witches, heck, even going so far back as the school founders....seeing the magical worlds at differing points of history sounds like a goldmine

it makes the HP story feel kind of basic - fish out of water, finding where he belongs and defeating a big bad....it follows the typical story structure and I never really liked many of the kid characters either and found myself wanting to know more about Dumbledores past (for example) so the fact they are covering it in these movies, AND the time period they chose, has me hooked.

The lore she applied in the Potter series IS a goldmine, I agree, and I would love more from it.

She's rose again in my estimations since Beasts 2. I thought she'd lost a grip on truly understanding what made her Wizarding World compelling (and, for me, it wasn't limited to Harry and chums), but I hope she's allowed to finish telling this particular story. Newt wasn't sidelined or shunted to supporting status in order to focus on Grindelwald escapades, yet Newt's own story was weaved into the greater over-arching threat posed by the evil wizard. If she continues in this particular vein, I have no problem with future films. The Leta LeStrange strand they introduced in Beasts 2 I found to be utterly fascinating.

[yeslek]

Originally Posted by dgoswald

She's rose again in my estimations since Beasts 2. I thought she'd lost a grip on truly understanding what made her Wizarding World compelling (and, for me, it wasn't limited to Harry and chums), but I hope she's allowed to finish telling this particular story. Newt wasn't sidelined or shunted to supporting status in order to focus on Grindelwald escapades, yet Newt's own story was weaved into the greater over-arching threat posed by the evil wizard. If she continues in this particular vein, I have no problem with future films. The Leta LeStrange strand they introduced in Beasts 2 I found to be utterly fascinating.

completely agree with you there

cant wait to see where she takes this and I hope we get a few more FB movies(wasnt there to be 5 originally?)

[Batman1980]

I believe there are meant to be 5. I would like 3 more, I actually prefer the Fantastic Beasts films in some ways because they're not as limited to Hogwarts are the Potter films are. Not to mention Potter is a terrible character.

[R3P0]

I wouldnt mind a series after fantastic beasts which deals with Voldemorts rise to power the first time. Seeing the original Order of the Phoenix would be kinda cool. Them in school graduating etc etc.

[Batman1980]

That's actually where I want the 5th Fantastic Beasts film to go, they can time jump if necessary to show us Riddle, first at Hogwarts and then his rise to becoming the Dark Lord.

[InuYashaCrusade]

Fantastic Beasts is now the world's most problematic movie franchise

Between J.K. Rowling, Johnny Depp, Ezra Miller, and declining box office, the Harry Potter prequel might be cursed.

https://ew.com/movies/fantastic-beas...re-jk-rowling/

[spider-neil]

Such a fall off for me, from being on the edge of my seat during Deathly Hallows Part 2 to being bored out of my mind during Crimes of Grindelwald. How the mighty (Potter franchise) has fallen.

[ditcin]

No one is allowed to have their opinion - unless it's seeded in the "progressive" train of thought. ...which happens to stupid and closed-minded. Too bad an excellent franchise must put up with this.
Just like other franchises which have been ruined.

[InuYashaCrusade]

Originally Posted by spider-neil

Such a fall off for me, from being on the edge of my seat during Deathly Hallows Part 2 to being bored out of my mind during Crimes of Grindelwald. How the mighty (Potter franchise) has fallen.

I pretend like the Fantastic Beasts movies don't exist.

[levcore]

The best thing WB can do is finish this with a 3rd movie and make it an epic Harry Potter fan crowd pleaser. The 5 movies thing really seems financially dubious considering the box office drop off with Crimes of Grindelwald.

[imsounoriginal]

The best thing they can do is stick to their plan and not over-react to online opinions. That's how we end up with movies like Justice League, Rise of Skywalker, Alien Covenant, etc.

Getting tired of franchise movies being written by Twitter.

[spider-neil]

Originally Posted by InuYashaCrusade

I pretend like the Fantastic Beasts movies don't exist.

Far be it for me to tell professionals how to do their job but if I were giving a suggestion, with the first Fantastic Beasts they should have focused on the human character and told the story from his point of view. They did this with HP. As you tell the human character information it is telling the audience information.

As it was Fantastic Beast was tonally all over the place (switching between being light and fun to being dark and horrific). But I was with the movie for the most part. I thought the ending was sweet with the human losing his memory but gaining his dream and girlfriend. All of that goes away (was it explained how he got his memory back?) in the sequel. The story in part 2 was SO convoluted it was hard to get invested. I checked out of the movie pretty early and there is no way I'm watching the third movie in theatres.

[levcore]

Originally Posted by imsounoriginal

The best thing they can do is stick to their plan and not over-react to online opinions. That's how we end up with movies like Justice League, Rise of Skywalker, Alien Covenant, etc.

Getting tired of franchise movies being written by Twitter.

If they stick to their plan and we get 3 more movies, what happens when the next one grosses even less than Crimes of Grindelwald and they have left the story open? It would be better to finish on a 3rd and just have a trilogy. I agree about online opinion but the box office drop off between movie 1 and movie 2 was not good at all.

[spider-neil]

Originally Posted by imsounoriginal

The best thing they can do is stick to their plan and not over-react to online opinions. That's how we end up with movies like Justice League, Rise of Skywalker, Alien Covenant, etc.

Getting tired of franchise movies being written by Twitter.

Sometimes listening to the audience can save your franchise, like Sonic. Not that I am saying they should listen to the audience.
For the record, back in the day, the audience complained that Star Trek: The Motion Picture was slow and boring. The result, Star Trek: Wrath of Khan.

[spider-neil]

Originally Posted by levcore

If they stick to their plan and we get 3 more movies, what happens when the next one grosses even less than Crimes of Grindelwald and they have left the story open? It would be better to finish on a 3rd and just have a trilogy. I agree about online opinion but the box office drop off between movie 1 and movie 2 was not good at all.

You shouldn't write by Twitter consensus but at the same time, they'd be fools to ignore such a precipitous drop in box office returns.

[imsounoriginal]

Originally Posted by levcore

If they stick to their plan and we get 3 more movies, what happens when the next one grosses even less than Crimes of Grindelwald and they have left the story open? It would be better to finish on a 3rd and just have a trilogy. I agree about online opinion but the box office drop off between movie 1 and movie 2 was not good at all.

Ideally, they'll take the criticisms that apply strictly to filmmaking (choppy editing, thinly written characters) and fix those for the next movie. If it still grosses less than Crimes of Grindelwald, then either scale down the budgets for #4 and #5 and let them go to HBO Max, or consolidate both movies into a single, final entry.

But most of the criticism I see towards these movies is just griping about how it's not as good as Harry Potter. "I don't like these movies, so they shouldn't be made anymore." That's not criticism, that's entitlement, and I don't really care about people whining like that.

[spider-neil]

Originally Posted by imsounoriginal

Ideally, they'll take the criticisms that apply strictly to filmmaking (choppy editing, thinly written characters) and fix those for the next movie. If it still grosses less than Crimes of Grindelwald, then either scale down the budgets for #4 and #5 and let them go to HBO Max, or consolidate both movies into a single, final entry.

But most of the criticism I see towards these movies is just griping about how it's not as good as Harry Potter. "I don't like these movies, so they shouldn't be made anymore." That's not criticism, that's entitlement, and I don't really care about people whining like that.

Yeah, I agree. 'It's not like Harry Potter' is not a valid criticism. My biggest criticisms are unlikeable characters (apart from Jacob) and a really convoluted and confusing plot.

[tcripe]

Originally Posted by InuYashaCrusade

Fantastic Beasts is now the world's most problematic movie franchise

Between J.K. Rowling, Johnny Depp, Ezra Miller, and declining box office, the Harry Potter prequel might be cursed.

https://ew.com/movies/fantastic-beas...re-jk-rowling/

Sad but true. I personally enjoy both films but I 100% understand the people who don't. Also decisions from the cast and writers isn't helping the franchise at all. I wouldn't be surprised if we never see the 4th film of this franchise.

[imsounoriginal]

Originally Posted by spider-neil

Sometimes listening to the audience can save your franchise, like Sonic. Not that I am saying they should listen to the audience.
For the record, back in the day, the audience complained that Star Trek: The Motion Picture was slow and boring. The result, Star Trek: Wrath of Khan.

There are certainly success stories, but in general, I don't like this trend towards reactionary filmmaking or franchise planning. If you have a plan, stick to it. Only Kevin Feige seems to know how to take criticisms and apply them effectively, but he's also shown to be the only major franchise head who knows what he's doing (and the MCU has so much goodwill built up by now that people will cut them some slack for a mediocre or bad movie).

Originally Posted by spider-neil

Yeah, I agree. 'It's not like Harry Potter' is not a valid criticism. My biggest criticisms are unlikeable characters (apart from Jacob) and a really convoluted and confusing plot.

And those criticisms are fine. I disagree with them, but those are at least things that the filmmakers can fix. Simply saying "Harry Potter was better" means nothing.