British Film Institute (BFI) Discussion Thread

[EddieLarkin]

I suppose I can't rule out getting it eventually for the exclusive content, but it'll have to wait until it's bargain priced now that I'm having to pay out double for the main feature!

[MifuneFan]

Originally Posted by EddieLarkin

That's something at least, though it would presumably still be accurate to call it a new scan of an old source, as opposed to Lobster's new scan of a newly restored source. The Lobster restoration was touted as being the first new presentation of the film to restore its original dimensions, whereas the BFI's has the same extensive left side cropping due to the presence of an erroneously added soundtrack on the print:

http://www.nitrateville.com/viewtopi...=20070#p151180

So new transfer or not, this still feels like a very outdated presentation of the film.

Agreed

[rapta]

Let's cheer everybody up with DVDBeaver's review of Eyes Without A Face: http://www.dvdbeaver.com/film5/blu-r...ce_blu-ray.htm

After over a year of agonising over the delays, I'm glad we finally get this (and a maxed out transfer at that). Great stuff! Fingers crossed Vivre Sa Vie and Rashomon are the same.

[kristoffer]

Nice. I didn't catch that "Vivre sa Vie" was on its way.
Maybe there is hope for a remastered Seven Samurai as well.

[rapta]

Originally Posted by kristoffer

Nice. I didn't catch that "Vivre sa Vie" was on its way.
Maybe there is hope for a remastered Seven Samurai as well.

Somehow I doubt it. I have high hopes for Rashomon though, being my favourite Kurosawa. And Vivre Sa Vie I've never seen, but I'd probably buy any earlier Godard film if they released it (though I recently realised I didn't buy Le mepris when I had the chance, and have yet to get RoGoPaG either).

[Dan8700]

Glad I didn't pre-order the Vertov collection... whew.

Originally Posted by nitin

Adrian Martin has said Night and the City and Where the Sidewalk Ends are coming from the BFI!!

I wonder which master they will use for NatC, tho, hopefully the 4k one Criterion used. For some reason, I wouldn't be so sure...

Already own the CC, but I'm curious to see what they did on Rashomon (new source maybe? newer resto?)!

[rapta]

They said they're restoring it themselves from scratch...that's what they said to me on Twitter when they announced it anyway. I expect it will be great - it has already been delayed once (was originally supposed to be out in May).

[Yami]

This is the description Criterion provide for their transfer:

[Show spoiler]The basis for the restoration was a 35mm black-and-white print held in the collection of the National Film Center in Tokyo. Made in 1962 from the original camera negative, the print itself was in good physical condition, but the negative from which it had been made was extremely battered due to extensive printing and handling over the years; many shots had started to shrink and warp, and there were numerous scratches and abrasions. Moreover, dust, dirt, and other artifacts from the damaged negative had been photographed into the print.

The print was scanned at 4K resolution at Lowry Digital in Burbank, California. The original scans were then converted to 2K files for extensive image processing and cleanup. Certain damage could be repaired using Lowry's automated software, but many frames had to be cleaned by hand. The warping in some shots and the blurring of every second frame of the film were addressed with customized visual effects tools. Once the image restoration was complete, two 4K digital intermediate 35mm negatives were produced, as well as a complete digital archive of both the raw scan and the restored image files.

The film's audio was restored from the 1962 print and a fine-grain master positive in the Kadokawa Foundation's collection. The elements were transfered at DJ Audio in Los Angeles, and Audio Mechanics in Burbank identified the best source element for each shot, in order to create a seamless soundtrack.

Restoration supervisors:

Michael Friend, Michael Pogorzelski/Academy Film Archive, Los Angeles.
Akira Tochigi/National Film Center, National Museum of Modern Art, Tokyo.
Yuniko Amano, Masao Kawano/Kadokawa Pictures, Inc., Tokyo.

I'll be very pleased if the BFI's restoration is spectacular, but I have to question why they're spending money on that when there's a perfectly good transfer out there already. Especially at a time where they're getting their funding cut left right and centre.

[MifuneFan]

Would be nice if they put out a BD release of Godzilla/Gojira. I already have the CC release, but Region B folks deserve a proper edition of that on BD. It's a masterpiece.

[rapta]

Originally Posted by Yami

This is the description Criterion provide for their transfer:

[Show spoiler]The basis for the restoration was a 35mm black-and-white print held in the collection of the National Film Center in Tokyo. Made in 1962 from the original camera negative, the print itself was in good physical condition, but the negative from which it had been made was extremely battered due to extensive printing and handling over the years; many shots had started to shrink and warp, and there were numerous scratches and abrasions. Moreover, dust, dirt, and other artifacts from the damaged negative had been photographed into the print.

The print was scanned at 4K resolution at Lowry Digital in Burbank, California. The original scans were then converted to 2K files for extensive image processing and cleanup. Certain damage could be repaired using Lowry's automated software, but many frames had to be cleaned by hand. The warping in some shots and the blurring of every second frame of the film were addressed with customized visual effects tools. Once the image restoration was complete, two 4K digital intermediate 35mm negatives were produced, as well as a complete digital archive of both the raw scan and the restored image files.

The film's audio was restored from the 1962 print and a fine-grain master positive in the Kadokawa Foundation's collection. The elements were transfered at DJ Audio in Los Angeles, and Audio Mechanics in Burbank identified the best source element for each shot, in order to create a seamless soundtrack.

Restoration supervisors:

Michael Friend, Michael Pogorzelski/Academy Film Archive, Los Angeles.
Akira Tochigi/National Film Center, National Museum of Modern Art, Tokyo.
Yuniko Amano, Masao Kawano/Kadokawa Pictures, Inc., Tokyo.

I'll be very pleased if the BFI's restoration is spectacular, but I have to question why they're spending money on that when there's a perfectly good transfer out there already. Especially at a time where they're getting their funding cut left right and centre.

Yeah you'd have to ask them that. There seems to be a general boost in their output this year though, so maybe they get funding from elsewhere?

This is exactly what they Tweeted me back with:

Rashomon is a BFI restoration. We're releasing it on DVD and Blu-ray, individually.

Just double-checked by the way - I later asked them about the delay and was told it was actually due to the 'extras production'. I hope they don't just do what they just did with Man With A Movie Camera and transfer from an old battered print they already have (but I haven't actually seen their previous DVD release...I have the Optimum DVD). It could be the case, though, that this is why they're doing these restorations in-house - rather than shell out for a costly international source, instead use the materials they already have? Maybe it's cheaper...but could have mixed results when compared to other restorations. Depends on the film too I guess - Eyes Without A Face looks immaculate.

Originally Posted by MifuneFan

Would be nice if they put out a BD release of Godzilla/Gojira. I already have the CC release, but Region B folks deserve a proper edition of that on BD. It's a masterpiece.

Would buy this in a heartbeat. Current BFI DVD needs a lot of cleaning up...looks so battered you could serve it with chips.

[oddbox83]

Originally Posted by MichaelB

It's not an "old restoration", it's a new 2K scan of the BFI's own archival print. Which applies to everything else on the disc.

That's not an excuse as far as I'm concerned. Imagine the furore if Eureka had made a new scan of a Caligari archival print instead of the new restoration.

The restored version is what they've used to promote the cinema release which is highly misleading. If it's all about including the Nyman score and the two cuts don't match to facilitate alternative audio tracks, why not have both as separate encodes?

[MifuneFan]

Originally Posted by rapta

Would buy this in a heartbeat. Current BFI DVD needs a lot of cleaning up...looks so battered you could serve it with chips.

[Yami]

The BFI missed the boat with Gojira last year when there was a new film to cash in on, a 60th anniversary to cash in on, and a new 4K restoration (that I think is even newer than what Criterion used) was doing the rounds.

[rapta]

Originally Posted by oddbox83

That's not an excuse as far as I'm concerned. Imagine the furore if Eureka had made a new scan of a Caligari archival print instead of the new restoration.

The restored version is what they've used to promote the cinema release which is highly misleading. If it's all about including the Nyman score and the two cuts don't match to facilitate alternative audio tracks, why not have both as separate encodes?

To be fair to them the theatrical release is technically after the Blu-ray release, so not sure if it was just a coincidence or they just fast-tracked a Blu-ray disc release from their current materials...knowing they would be touring the newly restored theatrical print? Either way I guess it is a bit cheeky - then again it's not terrible, it's just not nearly as good as the US release.

Originally Posted by Yami

The BFI missed the boat with Gojira last year when there was a new film to cash in on, a 60th anniversary to cash in on, and a new 4K restoration (that I think is even newer than what Criterion used) was doing the rounds.

I think the BFI's motto should be 'missed the boat' as they seem to be releasing stuff they should have years ago in some cases... (I'm kidding, they're great!)

[tenia]

I'm afraid that, unfortunately, it might be a question of rights or of budget that prevented them in the past to access the Gojira restoration, the Seven Samurai one, and in this case maybe the Man with a Camera one.

[Aclea]

Price reductions to around £8.50 at Amazon on many of their Blurays like The Day the earth Caught Fire, That Sinking Feeling, Gaslight and The Battle of the Coronel and Falkland Islands today.

[ijustblumyself]

Is the Italian only audio on BFI's Bergman/Rossellini set enough to turn someone off buying it? I'm okay with the differences in PQ, but I'm wondering whether the audio may be a bigger issue.

[deepbreathsanddeath]

Originally Posted by Aclea

Price reductions to around £8.50 at Amazon on many of their Blurays like The Day the earth Caught Fire, That Sinking Feeling, Gaslight and The Battle of the Coronel and Falkland Islands today.

Same prices at base.com, they remove VAT like Amazon and international shipping is only £1.49 per title (unless you order something heavy).

[nitin]

Originally Posted by Dan8700

Glad I didn't pre-order the Vertov collection... whew.


I wonder which master they will use for NatC, tho, hopefully the 4k one Criterion used. For some reason, I wouldn't be so sure...

Already own the CC, but I'm curious to see what they did on Rashomon (new source maybe? newer resto?)!

I have also just realised the BFI dvd didnt include the British version at all so if it stays the same with the blu, back to the Criterion for me (which has the british version in a compromised state but at least it's there). The american version is superior for sure but like Blade Runner, the changes are fascinating and interesting to check out.

[fdm]

Well my decision about the Rossellini/Bergman box was narrowing down to letting it ship and if it arrives in decent shape to keep it, and if not return it. And now that it's shipped it's up to the post office.

(Same goes for the Dreyer box, which should be showing up any day now.)

[Update: The Rossellini/Bergman box arrived in fairly good shape, so probably a keeper (my War Trilogy set is near pristine, the R/B not so much). This second (and probably last) Dreyer box attempt was in worse shape than that base.com copy I returned a few months ago, and it's already on its way back. Time for a breather from box sets from overseas again... (These were all amazon/uk to the U.S. by the way.)]