Ghosting / Crosstalk / Double Images Discussion Thread

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by AmrlKJaneway

All my movies are riddled with cross-talk. Not one shot can be viewed without a distracting double image and it annoys the hell out of me.

However, I've found putting on those glasses works wonders to fix this.

Good luck wearing dem spiffy 3D glasses with this ….
http://www.theatlantic.com/video/arc...he-sea/253447/

[banibale]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

Well, perhaps for those who are not following, you should tell people who don’t own your particular type of display, but may be in the market to purchase one, exactly how much the actual resolution(in terms of k’s) is of the images you are watching in 3D...for the clarification of the discussion.

I do understand your point and I respect it. You have offered a valid subjective opinion and something which future 3D TV purchasers should consider . Others who own 3D sets displaying higher resolution and yet seldomly have experienced annoying ghosting while viewing their library of Blu-ray 3D titles might disagree (see Cevolution , without The Bird ).

It’s the exchange of information like this which makes this forum such a valuable asset to its members.

Is nice to see this kind of respectful and unbiased opinion, if I may, let me tell you that some passive sets can display the 1080 lines in a interlace way and still x-talk and ghosting free. However the 2D to 3D converting in passive sets are not even close to the active set converts quality. But 1080p blurays looks as good as any active set with the advantages that is x-talk and flickering free and not loss of brightness, and the disadvantage of not being 1080p per eye instead is 1080i per eye.

Not all passive sets are cheap $, is just a choice some people prefer for a reason. When I went to buy my tv in this store here in new york they had alot of sets in show rooms I Got the passive because I have kids and it was not cheap.... here is the store.... http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/search...140+4292350611

Im open to all options, like right now I'm in a dedicated room or mens' cave construction And still dont know what kind of display to get. Im so happy and excited to see panasonic VT50 neo plasma able to be in bright room and looks just like a led and it has the deepest black levels of any plasma ever.. also is nice to see active projectors like the epson pro cinema 6010 getting good reviews of having minimum or not crosstalk and ghosting at all.
Good luck, "cheers"

[banibale]

Originally Posted by AmrlKJaneway

All my movies are riddled with cross-talk. Not one shot can be viewed without a distracting double image and it annoys the hell out of me.

However, I've found putting on those glasses works wonders to fix this.

Good one.. lmao

[steelerik]

Originally Posted by Cevolution

No active or passive display has zero crosstalk, you can produce a sitution that creates it. Like how I mentioned with my active set in my above post, passive 3dtv technology can also produce crosstalk when looking at the screen at certain angles or if your head is at a different height to the screen. I don't experience any crosstalk on my active plasma, except for when I'm not using the tv correctly while watching 3d, by looking at the screen on what's considered to be an abnormal angle for viewing 3d content. Not everyone has their lounge directly parallel to their tv screen, this would be 1 reason why some people experience crosstalk more than others. But of course they still blame the tech for something that is really common sense, because they feel that 3d should work perfectly at any angle rather than having to accommodate their lounge room for it.

I'd rather have no drop in resolution and no crosstalk, which is what I feel I am getting with my Samsung D8000 plasma.

That just doesn't make sense. Why would anyone deliberately put themselves in a viewing position to create xtalk?! I can assure you that of all the 3D blus I have NONE repeat NONE have ever exhibited xtalk.

Maybe it's just that everyone perceives 3D images that differently. It's certainly a puzzler.

[steelerik]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

Well, perhaps for those who are not following, you should tell people who don’t own your particular type of display, but may be in the market to purchase one, exactly how much the actual resolution(in terms of k’s) is of the images you are watching in 3D...for the clarification of the discussion.

I do understand your point and I respect it. You have offered a valid subjective opinion and something which future 3D TV purchasers should consider . Others who own 3D sets displaying higher resolution and yet seldomly have experienced annoying ghosting while viewing their library of Blu-ray 3D titles might disagree (see Cevolution , without The Bird ).

It’s the exchange of information like this which makes this forum such a valuable asset to its members.

I am afraid I cannot tell you that exact technical aspect Penton, cos' I don't know it. All I have heard is that the passive set I have displays 1080i per eye. Now I could be wrong, it could be 540p ... but these figures don't bother me in the slightest. It's the overall viewing experience that is important to me. And I am very happy with my passive set. I just cannot watch active 3D. The flickering just makes me feel sick quickly. When I have been in stores with friends and family and we are demoing active 3D sets, they too cannot watch without the nausea. However, they come to my house and can sit comfortably and watch all 14 hours of Avatar on my passive set.

[Dnsmills]

I researched for about 2 months before I bought my 3D set, going to a number of stores, viewing A LOT of different sets, both active & passive, and found that the LG set I decided on looked just as good (in my opinion, better) than the active sets. Plus the bonus of no expensive glasses that need constant charging. When watching 3D blus from the comfort of my couch, I have not experienced 1 second of crosstalk or ghosting. That being said, my couch is approx. 12 feet from the screen. When I start getting closer than 9-10 feet, I definitely start getting some ghosting and the picture loses the 3D effect. Who cares? So what? I'm not going to be watching anything in 3D standing in the middle of my living room. I'll be seated on my couch and so will anyone else that comes over and watches my set. I've tried out every seat on my couch and every position displays 3D beautifully with no ghosting. I think this is one of those 'to each their own opinion' situations. Some people will swear up and down active is the way to go and passive sucks and then will be those that feel totally opposite. My opinion? I like the passive set I bought. That's why I bought it. Do whatever you feel is best for you.

[steelerik]

Originally Posted by Dnsmills

I researched for about 2 months before I bought my 3D set, going to a number of stores, viewing A LOT of different sets, both active & passive, and found that the LG set I decided on looked just as good (in my opinion, better) than the active sets. Plus the bonus of no expensive glasses that need constant charging. When watching 3D blus from the comfort of my couch, I have not experienced 1 second of crosstalk or ghosting. That being said, my couch is approx. 12 feet from the screen. When I start getting closer than 9-10 feet, I definitely start getting some ghosting and the picture loses the 3D effect. Who cares? So what? I'm not going to be watching anything in 3D standing in the middle of my living room. I'll be seated on my couch and so will anyone else that comes over and watches my set. I've tried out every seat on my couch and every position displays 3D beautifully with no ghosting. I think this is one of those 'to each their own opinion' situations. Some people will swear up and down active is the way to go and passive sucks and then will be those that feel totally opposite. My opinion? I like the passive set I bought. That's why I bought it. Do whatever you feel is best for you.

Nice philosophy there .. enjoy your set .. and here's to years of fun 3D

[nickoakdl]

I just watched Hugo on my 73" Mitsubishi DLP and it was gorgeous, without a hint of crosstalk or ghosting.

[PaulGo]

Originally Posted by nickoakdl

I just watched Hugo on my 73" Mitsubishi DLP and it was gorgeous, without a hint of crosstalk or ghosting.

Same here on my 61" and 67" Samsung LED DLPs.

[Cevolution]

Originally Posted by steelerik

That just doesn't make sense. Why would anyone deliberately put themselves in a viewing position to create xtalk?! I can assure you that of all the 3D blus I have NONE repeat NONE have ever exhibited xtalk.

Maybe it's just that everyone perceives 3D images that differently. It's certainly a puzzler.

And I can assure you that out of all the 3D blu's I have, NONE I repeat NONE have ever exhibited crosstalk either, under my viewing conditions with my gear. You just made the statement in an earlier post that you get zero crosstalk with your passive setup, and that's 1 reason why you chose passive over active. So I replied to that statement of yours by saying that I don't get crosstalk either on my active set (which has been reviewed as 1 of the best 3d sets of 2011) when viewing from my seating position, and only commented on your statement because I felt you were implying that passive sets don't exhibit crosstalk whatsoever. I went on to say that viewers can experience crosstalk with both active and passive displays if they are sitting or looking at the screen on an angle, or their head is at a different height to the screen (and I also stated in my post before that, that other factors can create crosstalk as well, such as the quality of the display, calibration and room conditions), and IMO would be a reason why many experience crosstalk worse than others, regardless of what display tech they are using.

You would like to hope that the community of movie and HT goers on this site would know more than the average consumer about home theatre, so most of us would have our seating positioned correctly, but do you really think that most average consumers would worry about that when they watch 3d on their tv's, and have their lounge in a suitable position for viewing 3d correctly? For example, a lot of people own L shaped corner lounges theses days, they are the modern trend right now, but because half the lounge is automatically not parallel with the tv, it almost guarantees that anyone who sits on those seats is going to experience crosstalk, because it's not an appropriate angle for viewing 3d content on both active and passive displays. It's not a case of anyone deliberately putting themselves in a position where they experience crosstalk, but rather it's a situation where most don't know any better, or don't want to change how their lounge room is set out just to watch 3d.

[Ascended_Saiyan]

Originally Posted by Dnsmills

I researched for about 2 months before I bought my 3D set, going to a number of stores, viewing A LOT of different sets, both active & passive, and found that the LG set I decided on looked just as good (in my opinion, better) than the active sets. Plus the bonus of no expensive glasses that need constant charging. When watching 3D blus from the comfort of my couch, I have not experienced 1 second of crosstalk or ghosting. That being said, my couch is approx. 12 feet from the screen. When I start getting closer than 9-10 feet, I definitely start getting some ghosting and the picture loses the 3D effect. Who cares? So what? I'm not going to be watching anything in 3D standing in the middle of my living room. I'll be seated on my couch and so will anyone else that comes over and watches my set. I've tried out every seat on my couch and every position displays 3D beautifully with no ghosting. I think this is one of those 'to each their own opinion' situations. Some people will swear up and down active is the way to go and passive sucks and then will be those that feel totally opposite. My opinion? I like the passive set I bought. That's why I bought it. Do whatever you feel is best for you.

Unless you have about a 70" screen or greater, you are seated incorrectly. I believe if you sit far enough back, no TV gives you perceivable crosstalk.

[Dnsmills]

Originally Posted by Ascended_Saiyan

Unless you have about a 70" screen or greater, you are seated incorrectly. I believe if you sit far enough back, no TV gives you perceivable crosstalk.

So……I'm not experiencing crosstalk but you say I'm seated incorrectly. Really? So tell me, how SHOULD I be seated. Stupid me, sitting wrong this whole time. Oh, btw, my while my screen is not 70" or greater, it is 65" so it's not to far off.

[banibale]

Originally Posted by Dnsmills

So……I'm not experiencing crosstalk but you say I'm seated incorrectly. Really? So tell me, how SHOULD I be seated. Stupid me, sitting wrong this whole time. Oh, btw, my while my screen is not 70" or greater, it is 65" so it's not to far off.

I was in this fight for months trying to demand a little respect for passive 3D technology by providing links and prove saying by credible sources that passive set can display full HD picture in 3D . somehow A few people think that passive users are idiots and can't tell the difference HD and standard definition .. 540p is so close to 480p that any experts will certify it full HD . Courts around the world allowed LG To continue saying that they passive sets are full hd in 3D , vDE certify LG full Hd in 3 D, ASA said that LG can advertise passive 3D sets as full hd in 3D. I haven't seen any crosstalk or ghosting in my tv yet if I see it I'll say it. The 2011 hdtv shoot out was only about 2D picture quality they did not judged the 3D performance in any of those sets, when you google best 2011tv for 3D viewing passive sets are always on top or near panasonics' sets . My advice to you is just ignore that kind of peolpe and enjoy your amazing tv.

[steelerik]

Originally Posted by banibale

I was in this fight for months trying to demand a little respect for passive 3D technology by providing links and prove saying by credible sources that passive set can display full HD picture in 3D . somehow A few people think that passive users are idiots and can't tell the difference HD and standard definition .. 540p is so close to 480p that any experts will certify it full HD . Courts around the world allowed LG To continue saying that they passive sets are full hd in 3D , vDE certify LG full Hd in 3 D, ASA said that LG can advertise passive 3D sets as full hd in 3D. I haven't seen any crosstalk or ghosting in my tv yet if I see it I'll say it. The 2011 hdtv shoot out was only about 2D picture quality they did not judged the 3D performance in any of those sets, when you google best 2011tv for 3D viewing passive sets are always on top or near panasonics' sets . My advice to you is just ignore that kind of peolpe and enjoy your amazing tv.

Banibale, I think you and I were championing Passive tech on another forum .. unless it was another Banibale of course

I do agree though, it doesn't matter what tech you have .. if you are happy then that's all that matters

.... Right, I'm off for my hockey fix .. back soon : -)

[Cevolution]

Originally Posted by banibale

I was in this fight for months trying to demand a little respect for passive 3D technology by providing links and prove saying by credible sources that passive set can display full HD picture in 3D . somehow A few people think that passive users are idiots and can't tell the difference HD and standard definition .. 540p is so close to 480p that any experts will certify it full HD . Courts around the world allowed LG To continue saying that they passive sets are full hd in 3D , vDE certify LG full Hd in 3 D, ASA said that LG can advertise passive 3D sets as full hd in 3D. I haven't seen any crosstalk or ghosting in my tv yet if I see it I'll say it. The 2011 hdtv shoot out was only about 2D picture quality they did not judged the 3D performance in any of those sets, when you google best 2011tv for 3D viewing passive sets are always on top or near panasonics' sets . My advice to you is just ignore that kind of peolpe and enjoy your amazing tv.

You have come along way since then Banibale. The problem I had with you during that time, is that you were disrespecting people who own active sets while trying to get that respect for passive, you can't demand and expect members to respect your views if you're not respecting there's. I'm glad that's in the past now and we've moved on from it, where we can have more mature conversations

[banibale]

Originally Posted by Cevolution

You have come along way since then Banibale. The problem I had with you during that time, is that you were disrespecting people who own active sets while trying to get that respect for passive, you can't demand and expect members to respect your views if you're not respecting there's. I'm glad that's in the past now and we've moved on from it, where we can have more mature conversations

I'm glad you feel that way..

[Dnsmills]

I think both active & passive each have their pros & cons. I wouldn't poop on anyone's decision to get an active set. To each his own. But for me the pros far outweigh the cons on a passive set much more than an active set. I couldn't be happier with my set and if somebody wants to think I'm an idiot for choosing passive over active, I promise I won't lose a wink of sleep over it. I think if some active pushers had a look at my passive set, they might open their minds a bit.

[Nommag]

I own a lg passive set and I definitely believe their is a loss of resolution anyone who thinks there isn't is misguided. But, it isn't by much and some movies have made me second guess the resolution loss, like gnomeo and juliet. I got a passive tv for the sake of my multiple friends who come for movie nights and most of them can't tell the difference between blu-ray and dvd (or they refuse to acknowledge it) let alone any drop in resolution, we are always happy with what the lg is showing us.

[banibale]

Originally Posted by steelerik

Banibale, I think you and I were championing Passive tech on another forum .. unless it was another Banibale of course

I do agree though, it doesn't matter what tech you have .. if you are happy then that's all that matters

.... Right, I'm off for my hockey fix .. back soon : -)

... yes mate is me, the same old banibale, we fought together for passive.. but is nice to see all of us understanding both technology much better now.. good to see you again.

[steelerik]

Originally Posted by banibale

... yes mate is me, the same old banibale, we fought together for passive.. but is nice to see all of us understanding both technology much better now.. good to see you again.

While ever we have firm fans of both technologies, it can only be positive for 3D as a whole.

Get behind your 3D folks