HDR Discussion Thread

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Waboman

Are we still talking about that episode?

https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...d#post16355336

looking forward to this - https://www.blu-ray.com/movies/Game-...lu-ray/240117/

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Agent Kay

Too much on topic stuff Penton, back to top gun

Guess what day it is? No, not hump day….

Hump Day Camel Commercial - Happier than a Camel on Wednesday - Hump Daaaay! - YouTube

rather, 33 years ago today was the Top Gun world premiere (in New York City), cue the music –

Kenny Loggins - Danger Zone (Video) - YouTube

and, Waboman, have a La Corne ale as above

[Waboman]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...d#post16355336

looking forward to this - https://www.blu-ray.com/movies/Game-...lu-ray/240117/

Yeah, I'm looking forward to that too. Now send me a couple La Corne's por favor.

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

after a hard day (started at 5:00 A.M.) on la job, kicking back ….

[Show spoiler]

5am on a Sunday? You're rivaling Ted Ferguson for office daredevil.

Ted Ferguson - Bud Light Daredevil - YouTube

[Penton-Man]

So, since nobody got the correct answer - https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...r#post16271723 , in remembrance of the 33rd anniversary of the world premiere of Top Gun, I’ll extend the contest until Wednesday when I’m disappearing for at least a couple days and won’t be checking in.

Come on TG tweeters and gram-ers, I know you follow this thread. Heck, no way we're averaging close to 2,000 views/day on this thread simply from videophiles reading, at least I don't think so. Here’s a hint as to the street - https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...w#post16252872

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Waboman

5am on a Sunday?

Keep up, that was Saturday my man. Whereas, on any Sunday - https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...y#post10107534

be it motorized or not, it’s on two wheels away from the job.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

on two wheels

not 3, like the banditos….

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

PM’ed this from over at the *science* forum – https://www.avsforum.com/forum/166-l...l#post58033288

Someone who’s a co-member over there advise ARROW, no it’s not. The often quoted chart is extrapolated from data based upon the notion as interpreted by video engineers (not vision scientists) that maximal visual acuity as being that humans can see detail up to 1 min. of arc, i.e. simple or Snellen acuity, it does not account for Vernier acuity(aka hyperacuity) - https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...r#post16138549
something we’ve discussed intermittently for going on about 4 years now if you follow the hyperlinks back far enough.

And quickly skimming the original post I see what imagic’s proposing, he’s essentially offering his version for the validation of 8K tvs by building on theories introduced in a paper in the SMPTE Journal from ?March 2017 by Ed, but with AI being smart enough to eliminate spatial artifacts by doing something akin to mathematically applying an anti-alias filter to get rid of jaggies without the downside of then-induced softening, which has previously been difficult.

Personally, I think consumers would be far better served if the electronics companies invested more resources into other things that improve picture quality…..at the same time remembering –

because most of us don’t watch photos on TV or gall bladder surgery with nothing moving in the field even if you have an 8K source coming in and don’t need the AI upsamping –

but alas, the TV manufacturers are not really interested in input from their hardcore users, unlike the guys and gals in the camera divisions from this or that company who are quite amenable to users' suggestions for a better mouse trap.

The whole 8K thing is just too funny. Yes, I know that we were in the same boat with 4K, everyone pooh-poohing it from afar to rationalise their own reluctance to upgrade (again), and I'd never go back but for me the killer app has UNQUESTIONABLY been HDR and the resolution bump is the cherry on top. But there is no 'HDR 2: Maverick' coming any time soon, and although that's not to say there isn't room for vast improvement in the display domain when it comes to current HDR, those display improvements would be coming with or without 8K.

Will this fabled AI upscaling give you better results on a 8K than on a 4K? Sure I guess, but it may well take the average viewer a bloody big screen to discern such things, and even then it depends on how that upscaling is handled and what individual people think is "better" (more "sharpness" and "pop" vs smoother image, better handling of hyper-acute aliasing).

As for matey in that thread, I always get a chuckle when heavily photo-oriented people weigh in on these things because they often don't have any idea of how temporal resolution makes it a very different ball game.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

Heck, no way we're averaging close to 2,000 views/day on this thread simply from videophiles reading, at least I don't think so.

dang, I just checked, maybe we are and it is for the most part, if not all, videophiles reading as before I was sharing any inside information about Top Gun: Maverick there were many months where we were averaging 3,000+ daily views and one day looks like we topped out at 5,000+/day - https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...0#post14650654

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

The whole 8K thing is

consumer TV marketing executives winning out over real engineers
like I said, whole different ballgame compared to the camera folks of Sony, Arri, RED, Panny, etc. where they aim to serve their users with what they really want/need rather than blow smoke up their…..

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Agent Kay

Too much on topic stuff Penton, back to top gun

this is how it all began…https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TCPMPSbkNQg#t=3m56s

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Waboman

Are we still talking about that episode? It's so two weeks ago.

harkening back to what I said nearly 2 weeks ago with regards to darkness, fog and smoke stressing deliverables which are not as robust as 4K Ultra HD, read carefully – https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...s#post16366165

as an example:



and

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

I think I’ve said from the beginning the resultant picture quality that viewers experienced was multi-factorial in etiology, but I think these articles written by TV reviewers, calibrators, and non-busy colorists give the false impression as to the significance of the individual TV, proper calibration and ‘messed up’ color grading as being culprits. By far, by weight, the overwhelmingly primary root cause to the situation lies with the creative choice (too dark) combined with the delivery platforms, which I haven’t seen addressed much online. From there, everything else was secondary (no proper calibration) pilling on, making the situation worse.

I also think that too much attention has been given to the factor of those viewers’ ambient lighting conditions while watching episode 3. I realize Joe and Jane sixpack are not that technologically nor scientifically savvy these days, e.g.…
but I think they’ve viewed enough TV shows or movies at home in the past that have been on the dark side and have realized thru plain old common sense that if they turn down/or off the lights in the room, they will then receive a better looking picture which I would imagine a large majority did do after becoming so frustrated with not seeing much of anything for so long during the battle.

finally, yesterday, a consumer tech journo gets it - https://www.forbes.com/sites/johnarc.../#4e845718f0a8

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

this is how it all began…https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TCPMPSbkNQg#t=3m56s

and Tony Scott bounced the personal check he wrote to the NAVY for turning around the aircraft carrier for better lighting!

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

So, since nobody got the correct answer - https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...r#post16271723 , in remembrance of the 33rd anniversary of the world premiere of Top Gun, I’ll extend the contest until Wednesday when I’m disappearing for at least a couple days and won’t be checking in.

Come on TG tweeters and gram-ers, I know you follow this thread. Heck, no way we're averaging close to 2,000 views/day on this thread simply from videophiles reading, at least I don't think so. Here’s a hint as to the street - https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...w#post16252872

because, like last year –

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

Where’s LordoftheRings with his YouTube contributions for this week? Those tunes of yours keep me rolling.

Lordo, a flashback from nearly a year ago…..https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...s#post13632805

Flash forward to today at Long Beach, a pic of the motorsickles geared-up for one of the best motocam teams in the business for this year’s Amgen tour -



Although not in HDR (but someday, eventually, will be), I think even for Vancouverites living in the midst of their northern natural beauty, the Amgen Tour of California is still worth a watch just for the majestic scenery of my state, starts tomorrow -

2018 Amgen Tour of California Preview Show - YouTube

On the women’s side (starts May 17th), I’m rooting for Coryn.

I’ll be at several of the stages of this year’s event

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Waboman

Tiger

LordoftheRings, wake up!, tigress on base –



In the far background, one can see Point Loma

[Penton-Man]

https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...n#post15377796
^ and with more economical cameras (8 cameras under $13,000 (plus the Amira for control) ->
https://vimeo.com/335478017

science: skin is the body’s largest organ, take care of it

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Waboman

that [Game of Thrones] episode? It's so two weeks ago.

I know, I know, but this is so 4 weeks ago and it still may provide some insights for those without direct knowledge - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4D1JlbQdY90#t=1s

[LordoftheRings]

Here, to warm up on things to buy today ... in Full UHD (HDR) ... fantastic clarity, details and upscaling qualities. Stop living in the past and espouse the future beauties now ... 8K displays.

Samsung is into it, LG is into it, Sony is into it, Sharp is into it, Panasonic is into it, all girls and boys are into it...daytime nighttime, @ the beach in their speedos and bikinis, in their hotel rooms in their pajamas and nightingale, under water in their skin suits, flying high in the sky with their capes.

By the way I like golfing.

¤ https://www.techradar.com/news/4k-vs...ng-to-full-uhd

[DisplayCalNoob]

I would jump on once film studios stop releasing 4K upscaled content for native 4K, even special effects heavy films.

[FilmFreakosaurus]

Originally Posted by DisplayCalNoob

I would jump on once film studios stop releasing 4K upscaled content for native 4K, even special effects heavy films.

You will be waiting a good, looooooong time.

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by FilmFreakosaurus

You will be waiting a good, looooooong time.

And yet 4K VFX is a pre-requisite for stuff like Netflix original content. 8K OTT delivery is going to be up to date with actual end-to-end 8K finishes before theatrical movies are done in 4K on a regular basis, if at all. Netflix have already done 6K finishes for certain shows, including the VFX: https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/be...-waters-779131 and that was FOUR ****ing years ago!

The problem with theatrical VFX in 4K is down to one simple thing: time. There's just not enough of it to finish 2000 or 3000 shots in 4K across all these different vendors in the time that they have, not to mention the need to deliver them early so that the 3D vendors have enough lead time on the 3D conversion. I still contend that this 3D post-production pipeline is one of the main things that's holding back 4K VFX in the theatrical environment. But as 4K OTT services don't have to deliver anything like that number of shots OR that ever-increasing number of different deliverables then their VFX houses can concentrate on one thing and one thing only: dat 4K VFX sweetness.