4K Blu-ray Confirmed, Coming in

[Blu-ray Neo]

Originally Posted by spectre08

Last time I checked there was no law against me ripping CDs, DVDs, and blu-rays for my own personal use. The only time I cross the law is if I share them with other people.

Don't get me wrong, I agree with your sentiment, but it is illegal.

See, there's a "gray" area because you have the Fair Use Act, but then you have the DMCA. (Digital Millennium Copyright Act)

If you circumvent the anti-copy protection of any kind of media even if you didn't copy it, you have violated the DMCA.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital..._Copyright_Act


Either way, if this is the route that Blu-ray 4K is taking, then count me out as well.

[Richard Paul]

The website just reposted their article today so luckily it was just a joke that they must have accidently posted yesterday.

[Geoff D]

I still wouldn't bet against some of it coming true...

[spectre08]

I'm guessing, and hoping, bad april fools joke. It sounds like they just straight lifted the "proposed" XBox One specifications from a couple years ago

[bruceames]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

I still wouldn't bet against some of it coming true...

I wouldn't either, although it wouldn't be nearly as draconian as in the April fools article. If online authentication is required, then it would only require a whiff of internet to get the movie started and not a constant connection. Also discs would certainly not be tied to a specific player (if you played it on someone else's player, then you would just need to log in to your account on that player. Much like logging in to Netflix on someone else's device).

One thing is certain: the studios are going to require much stronger protections than what Blu-ray had. I have a hunch that the copy protection negotiations are behind the hold-up in UHD BD right now (Panasonic already delayed their "target" launch to Spring 2016). I think the studios are looking for a disc format with no First Sale protection and that would mean digital on disc. It still would have a great advantage over streaming and downloads since it wouldn't suffer any of the constraints nor delays brought about by bandwidth.

[Geoff D]

Yep, I think it'll have an online authentication component for sure, but nothing like as severe as the "joke" article.

[Dynamo of Eternia]

Any kind of online authentication, even for a split second, is a non-starter for me.

My problem with it, as is my problem with digital distribution in the first place and the plans that the XBox One originally had is that if one day down the road, the service ceases to exist (i.e. you can't authenticate online anymore), all of your content stops working. Why the f-ing hell would anyone not only buy into that, but specifically WANT that to happen?

It also defeats the entire purpose of physical media by even putting that kind of restriction on it. If that's the way that 4k Blu-Ray goes, then I'll pass.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Richard Paul

The article had some details, such as calling the video watermarking Vidthenticity, and included a few pictures but nothing that couldn't be made in a few hours. I am hoping that this rumor is just a joke that was accidently posted a day early though some of these ideas sound like they came from the Movielabs proposal for DRM.

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

There have been…*concerns/proposals*….. for more concerted protection of UHD content originating directly from various Hollywood studios, check out Heather’s (from 20th Century Fox) comments during Day 2? of HPA in the reporter’s articles you’ve posted awhile ago in the 4K Movies Releases Thread - https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...y#post10417093

I can’t recall how extensively Adam reported on that topic because I briefly skimmed your links (the day Wendy A. spoke, in particular), but if Heather’s actual presentation hasn’t made it online by now and you can’t find it, I’ll see if I can get it for you.

Here ya go - http://hollywoodpostalliance.org/wp-...W10_HPA-v6.pdf

I’m informed by someone in the office that the cut ^ was too deep in order to bring out the best brightness of the precious stone.

[jono3000]

Originally Posted by bruceames.

(Panasonic already delayed their "target" launch to Spring 2016).

Source?

[Dex Robinson]

Originally Posted by Dynamo of Eternia

Any kind of online authentication, even for a split second, is a non-starter for me.
...
It also defeats the entire purpose of physical media by even putting that kind of restriction on it. If that's the way that 4k Blu-Ray goes, then I'll pass.

Absolutely.

ANY restricition that requires me to have an online connection to view discs is a 100% deal killer.

The reason I own physical media is because I demand control of the discs and players that I have purchased. I won't buy things that require third party permission to use.

For me, a mandatory internet connection or permission is the line that can never be crossed.

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

Here ya go - http://hollywoodpostalliance.org/wp-...W10_HPA-v6.pdf

I’m informed by someone in the office that the cut ^ was too deep in order to bring out the best brightness of the precious stone.

So.....everyone above needn't be giving up on UHD BD quite yet?

[bruceames]

Originally Posted by jono3000

Source?

http://www.whathifi.com/news/panason...er-spring-2016

[jono3000]

Originally Posted by bruceames.

http://www.whathifi.com/news/panason...er-spring-2016

Thanks. Saw this in the other thread a while ago. It's not a definite statement - there could still be a player released this year.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

So.....everyone above needn't be giving up on UHD BD quite yet?

Ya just never know for sure, until the fat lady sings….

[bailey1987]

Just seen this on DTS.com. Cool, can't wait for the announcement.

[Richard Paul]

Originally Posted by Dynamo of Eternia

Any kind of online authentication, even for a split second, is a non-starter for me.

My problem with it, as is my problem with digital distribution in the first place and the plans that the XBox One originally had is that if one day down the road, the service ceases to exist (i.e. you can't authenticate online anymore), all of your content stops working. Why the f-ing hell would anyone not only buy into that, but specifically WANT that to happen?

I wouldn't mind online authentication for a useful feature (the ability to copy the movie to a device, the ability to skip all of the commercials/warnings, the ability to stream the video to nearby authorized devices) but to make online authentication necessary just to play the disc would be going too far.

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

Here ya go - http://hollywoodpostalliance.org/wp-...W10_HPA-v6.pdf

I’m informed by someone in the office that the cut ^ was too deep in order to bring out the best brightness of the precious stone.

I can understand that Fox wants to be paid for their content but they have a serious obsession with DRM. I am waiting for the day when Fox proposes a DRM system that requires a camera pointed at the viewers to make sure that there isn't an excessive number of people in the room. Of course they would have to license that patent from Microsoft...

[Brightstar]

Originally Posted by jono3000

Thanks. Saw this in the other thread a while ago. It's not a definite statement - there could still be a player released this year.

This means we might have to wait another year ? might as well change the treads name to coming in spring 2016

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by Brightstar

This means we might have to wait another year ? might as well change the treads name to coming in spring 2016

IMO the late 2015 date was always gonna be a very limited rollout anyway, i.e. we weren't likely to be deluged with players and software, so 2016 was always gonna be the year UHD BD began in earnest.

If it gets pushed back to this time next year then so be it, they can use IFA this year to showcase actual hardware and demo discs (IF that stuff's ready by then, natch) and then launch it with a full-on PR blitz at CES next January.

[Dynamo of Eternia]

Originally Posted by bruceames.

I wouldn't either, although it wouldn't be nearly as draconian as in the April fools article. If online authentication is required, then it would only require a whiff of internet to get the movie started and not a constant connection. Also discs would certainly not be tied to a specific player (if you played it on someone else's player, then you would just need to log in to your account on that player. Much like logging in to Netflix on someone else's device).

One thing is certain: the studios are going to require much stronger protections than what Blu-ray had. I have a hunch that the copy protection negotiations are behind the hold-up in UHD BD right now (Panasonic already delayed their "target" launch to Spring 2016). I think the studios are looking for a disc format with no First Sale protection and that would mean digital on disc. It still would have a great advantage over streaming and downloads since it wouldn't suffer any of the constraints nor delays brought about by bandwidth.

The problem with any online authentication is that it defeats the entire purpose of physical media, and it potentially means that all content released on the format will potentially "expire" one day if down the road they stop supporting 4K BD and shut down the authentication servers and so forth.

As it is, it's going to be an uphill battle getting people to buy into another physical media format. And by adding in any kind of account set up/online authentication, they will have basically made a format that is hindered by the worst aspects of both physical media and digitally distributed media. Both forms have their respective advantages and disadvantages, with me preferring physical in it's current forms because I don't have to worry about connecting to a server and the like to authenticate it.

But now, if they go forward with anything like this, you have the lesser aspects of physical media (having to swap out discs and so forth) with the lesser aspects of digital media (having to connect online, being dependent on an external service to maintain authentication) rolled into one. All they have to do is arrange for customers to get a kick in the nuts each time they buy a movie, and the full package will be complete!


The most assinine part about this is that no matter how much they think they've finally found a way to stop the pirates once and for all... it won't work. It will at best slow them down a bit. The people who currently circumvent existing protections are going to find a way around this. And it will be the legit customer that suffers for it.

While I know some others on this site have larger collections than I do, I have a pretty damn big collection (as can be seen under my screen name) of legitimately purchased Blu-Rays and DVDs that continues to grow. Screwing over a customer like myself would not be a good idea. While I doubt that I will go as "hog wild" upgrading all of my previous movies to 4K BD as I have upgrading movies from DVD to BD, there some that I definately would upgrade again, and of course by new movies in the new format... IF it doesn't have these restrictions.

The worst thing that they can do is treat their legitimate customers as criminals. I don't mind relatively unintrusive forms of DRM (i.e. the copy protection that already exists on DVDs and Blu-Rays) that don't interfere with normal use and playback. But the second that they create something like this that not only constantly "checks in" on me, but also potentially limits my ability to use my legitimately purchased content when/if authentication servers are ever shut down for any reason (by choice, by force, whatever), that's the moment that they lose me as a customer.

Go ahead and come up with some kind of new copy protection. It probably won't take long for pirates to get around it, but it also won't take long for them to get around this other potential DRM either.

This will most likely be a case where they do little to nothing to stop the pirates, and do far more to drive away the customers who otherwise would have happily paid for the legitimate product.

[bruceames]

Well nobody knows if it will happen or not so we can just hope for the best. I would hate it too, but would accept it is the lessor of two evils (the other evil is stay with 1080p Blu-ray while my neighbors are enjoying 4K).