4K Blu-ray content on the horizon?

[Jimmy Smith]

Originally Posted by Fabiosugitani

I like the idea of the 4K Tvs, but I wonder how much the old movies can get improved from it. At the moment I'm more interested in the thinner frameless tvs, but I understand what the market is trying to do and i can't wait to see it get cheap enough.

Ironically older movies may benefit from it more then many newer ones. 35mm film used for closer to a hundred years now has enough detail to support 4k. Some movies of the last decade were shot digitally with 1080p cameras. A movie is stuck at whatever resolution it was shot at now and forever. For example Mel Gibson's Apocalypto, Sin City, and Star Wars Episodes 2 & 3 were all digitally shot in 1080p and thus the Blu-Rays look as good as these movies possibly can. Re-releasing them in 4k would be completely pointless though they would benefit a bit from upconversion. Meanwhile movies from the 30s like Wizard of Oz and Gone with the Wind would benefit from 4k and would look better in 4k then many recent movies that were shot in 1080p

[Chevypower]

Originally Posted by Crazy People

Really? People prefered VHS To DVD? Never knew anybody like that. Must be an outlier. You could see the difference between VHS to DVD. You can slightly see the difference between DVD to Blu-ray. The difference between Blu-ray to 4K is even smaller.

The difference between VHS and DVD is noticeable. VHS's only advantage was no noticeable compression artifacts. The quality difference between DVD and Blu-ray is much more noticeable. The quality difference between Blu-ray and 4K is just as impressive as DVD to Blu-ray. If you're one of those people who cannot perceive quality increases, then it's not worth the upgrade.

[HD Goofnut]

Originally Posted by chevypower

the difference between vhs and dvd is noticeable. Vhs's only advantage was no noticeable compression artifacts. The quality difference between dvd and blu-ray is much more noticeable. The quality difference between blu-ray and 4k is just as impressive as dvd to blu-ray. If you're one of those people who cannot perceive quality increases, then it's not worth the upgrade.

+1.

[ole geezer]

Originally Posted by Crazy People

I have yet to see 3D (including Avatar) that didn't make my brain think that it looked fake.

Well...loooking at it from another angle, if 2D looks "real" to you...your brain's in a world of hurt.

This 1080p to 4k comes down to diminishing returns. Is that increase in technology really worth the change? In this case, it's not. At least not for most people and the way they watch movies. Most people will not watch movies on TV's over 60". The electronic companies can always find new ways to "improve" technology. At what point are those improvements not worth the hassel of changing everything to play it? I think we are at that point. 1080p is good enough for almost everybody. Maybe in 20 years if something really revolutionary comes out that changes the way to watch TV, it will be worth changing things. I don't see the need to increase the number of pixels on my television screen that I won't even notice.

You use the term "most people" like you know before hand what most people would do when it comes to purchasing CE gear. Fact is ....you don't. But, don't feel hurt. No one else does either. Best these manufacturers can do is hope the product they're selling appeals to more than a few folks so they can make some money.

Been that way since the dawn of Home Theater.

[Crazy People]

Originally Posted by Chevypower

The difference between VHS and DVD is noticeable. VHS's only advantage was no noticeable compression artifacts. The quality difference between DVD and Blu-ray is much more noticeable. The quality difference between Blu-ray and 4K is just as impressive as DVD to Blu-ray. If you're one of those people who cannot perceive quality increases, then it's not worth the upgrade.

The difference between 1080p and 4k on a 42" screen or less.... is basically zero. We cannot perceive the quality increase because our eyes cannot tell the difference.

[Crazy People]

Originally Posted by ole geezer

Well...loooking at it from another angle, if 2D looks "real" to you...your brain's in a world of hurt.
You use the term "most people" like you know before hand what most people would do when it comes to purchasing CE gear. Fact is ....you don't. But, don't feel hurt. No one else does either. Best these manufacturers can do is hope the product they're selling appeals to more than a few folks so they can make some money.

Been that way since the dawn of Home Theater.

It's rather easy to determine what people want here.

Most people still don't care about the difference between DVD and Blu-ray quality. Which means the people who will care between 1080p and 4K is even smaller.

It's rather simple.

[pro-bassoonist]

Originally Posted by Jimmy Smith

Unless your some kind of insider thats a big assumption your making based on absolutely nothing. I see no evidence whatsoever any studios are planning to release 4k movies on multi-layered Blu-Rays. If you do please present it.

Jimmy, this isn't exactly some sort of a secret. This became public knowledge more than 2 years ago, and a little earlier for other folks (). Anyhow, I hope this qualifies as 'official':



John Taylor, Vice President of Public Affairs and Communications at LG Electronics USA:

"Well, firstly, our 3D UD TV can upgrade 1080p signals to a 4K2K output but we're also expecting the arrival of 4K Blu-rays in 2013."

http://www.pocket-lint.com/news/4381...n-blu-ray-2013

In other words, just another Blu-ray option.

[Jimmy Smith]

Originally Posted by pro-bassoonist

Jimmy, this isn't exactly some sort of a secret. This became public knowledge more than 2 years ago, and a little earlier for other folks (). Anyhow, I hope this qualifies as 'official':

John Taylor, Vice President of Public Affairs and Communications at LG Electronics USA:

http://www.pocket-lint.com/news/4381...n-blu-ray-2013

In other words, just another Blu-ray option.

Dude Im pretty sure he meant by 4k Blu-Rays he meant upconversion. The Blu-Ray standard took years to ratify and it will take a uniting of the industry to agree to a single standard to avoid another format war. 50 gigs is not a high enough capacity for 4k movies even with a new codec so it can't be delievered with current Blu-Ray discs and players that is a fact

[pro-bassoonist]

Originally Posted by Jimmy Smith

Dude Im pretty sure he meant by 4k Blu-Rays he meant upconversion. The Blu-Ray standard took years to ratify and it will take a uniting of the industry to agree to a single standard to avoid another format war. 50 gigs is not a high enough capacity for 4k movies even with a new codec so it can't be delievered with current Blu-Ray discs and players that is a fact

OK, Jimmy, obviously you are not following closely what I have written thus far - about the development of a new codec, portfolio adjustments, etc - so lets leave things as they are.

Hopefully you bookmarked the posts I pointed out to you earlier

Pro-B

[FlipperWasIrish]

Originally Posted by Crazy People

The same concept applies to TV. At some point, a certain resolution is good enough. It stops at some point. For 99% of the consumers, it ends at Blu-ray/1080p quality.

Yippee!!! I am now a 1%er. I guess I have to watch out for the Occupy Wall Street nutjobs...

[Jimmy Smith]

Originally Posted by FlipperWasIrish

Yippee!!! I am now a 1%er. I guess I have to watch out for the Occupy Wall Street nutjobs...

lol

[Jimmy Smith]

Originally Posted by pro-bassoonist

OK, Jimmy, obviously you are not following closely what I have written thus far - about the development of a new codec, portfolio adjustments, etc - so lets leave things as they are.

Hopefully you bookmarked the posts I pointed out to you earlier

Pro-B

Again a new codec isn't enough. Even with a new more efficient codec a 200 gig capacity will be nessesary for a 3 hour 3D 4k movie

[Monkey]

Originally Posted by Crazy People

The difference between 1080p and 4k on a 42" screen or less.... is basically zero. We cannot perceive the quality increase because our eyes cannot tell the difference.

Based on your other comment "You can slightly see the difference between DVD to Blu-ray." you are about the last person I'd take advice from in anything in regards to picture quality. No offense, but it is probably better for you as you'll save money but I'm fortunate to have good eye sight and enjoy the far superior picture quality of blu-ray over DVD.

Frankly, this thread is probably the last place on the internet you should even bother to have a conversation in as it really serves no purpose for someone of your visual abilities. I'm surprised you even bothered going to blu-ray.

[Crazy People]

Originally Posted by ole geezer

Well...loooking at it from another angle, if 2D looks "real" to you...your brain's in a world of hurt.
You use the term "most people" like you know before hand what most people would do when it comes to purchasing CE gear. Fact is ....you don't. But, don't feel hurt. No one else does either. Best these manufacturers can do is hope the product they're selling appeals to more than a few folks so they can make some money.

Been that way since the dawn of Home Theater.

Originally Posted by Monkey

Based on your other comment "You can slightly see the difference between DVD to Blu-ray." you are about the last person I'd take advice from in anything in regards to picture quality. No offense, but it is probably better for you as you'll save money but I'm fortunate to have good eye sight and enjoy the far superior picture quality of blu-ray over DVD.

Frankly, this thread is probably the last place on the internet you should even bother to have a conversation in as it really serves no purpose for someone of your visual abilities. I'm surprised you even bothered going to blu-ray.

On the spectrum of what is possible for video content, the difference between DVD and Blu-ray is without question marginal.

I have updated me DVD collection to Blu-ray. I also know that that increase in quality was the smallest of any jump in home consumer formats yet. And the jump to 4K is an even smaller increase to the human eye.

[Monkey]

Originally Posted by Crazy People

On the spectrum of what is possible for video content, the difference between DVD and Blu-ray is without question marginal.

I have updated me DVD collection to Blu-ray. I also know that that increase in quality was the smallest of any jump in home consumer formats yet. And the jump to 4K is an even smaller increase to the human eye.

For you, not me.

[Crazy People]

Originally Posted by Monkey

For you, not me.

For both of us. For everybody. Placebo effect....

[Monkey]

Originally Posted by Crazy People

For both of us. For everybody. Placebo effect....

No, you physical limitations don't apply to me. You've made that clear already. It is no secret that all humans don't have identical eye site (like man other tributes).

[Jimmy Smith]

Originally Posted by Monkey

Based on your other comment "You can slightly see the difference between DVD to Blu-ray." you are about the last person I'd take advice from in anything in regards to picture quality. No offense, but it is probably better for you as you'll save money but I'm fortunate to have good eye sight and enjoy the far superior picture quality of blu-ray over DVD.

Frankly, this thread is probably the last place on the internet you should even bother to have a conversation in as it really serves no purpose for someone of your visual abilities. I'm surprised you even bothered going to blu-ray.

The greater the screen size the greater resolution matters.

On a screen smaller then 30 inches the difference between an upconverted DVD and Blu-Ray is quite negligible because your eyes are just not strong enough to see such tiny pixels. On a 60 inch model the difference is night and day

With 4k an even larger screen will be required to see the difference. Your eyes probably can't tell the difference between 1080p and 4k on a television smaller then 40 inches but on a television 80 inches it will be apparent but still not as great as the leep from DVD to Blu-Ray

[Monkey]

Originally Posted by Jimmy Smith

The greater the screen size the greater resolution matters.

Agreed, assuming all other factors are the same.

On a screen smaller then 30 inches the difference between an upconverted DVD and Blu-Ray is quite negligible because your eyes are just not strong enough to see such tiny pixels. On a 60 inch model the difference is night and day

This isn't true for me.

With 4k an even larger screen will be required to see the difference. Your eyes probably can't tell the difference between 1080p and 4k on a television smaller then 40 inches but on a television 80 inches it will be apparent but still not as great as the leep from DVD to Blu-Ray

I haven't had the opportunity to try but I'd like to. Seating distance is a big factor as well.

I'm in no rush for something better than blu-ray as with good transfers jobs the picture quality is amazing on a good display. That said I sure as heck would love to see how a 4k image would look in the home on a great display. Frankly I'd rather they start making movies at higher frame rates instead (reducing ugly judder) or do both, but that's another topic.

[Crazy People]

Originally Posted by Jimmy Smith

The greater the screen size the greater resolution matters.

On a screen smaller then 30 inches the difference between an upconverted DVD and Blu-Ray is quite negligible because your eyes are just not strong enough to see such tiny pixels. On a 60 inch model the difference is night and day

With 4k an even larger screen will be required to see the difference. Your eyes probably can't tell the difference between 1080p and 4k on a television smaller then 40 inches but on a television 80 inches it will be apparent but still not as great as the leep from DVD to Blu-Ray

You are correct. We are looking at the majority of televisions on the market not being able to show a difference between 1080p and 4k.

The average television size being sold is 38".

And of the fraction of TV's that will be able to show the changes in resolution, the difference will be a smaller gap then VHS to DVD or DVD to Blu-ray. Add in people who don't care, and the market for this is tiny.