HDR Discussion Thread

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

Clearly, the individual home user experience for episode 3 of Season 8 GoT was dependent upon what particular display device was used, e.g. https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...o#post16366694 , the ambient lighting , as well as, significantly, the deliverable, e.g. vis-à-vis DirecTV, cable, HBO Go, etc.

The respective post house and colorist are well experienced….https://www.siminternational.com/ and I would have expected them to have anticipated the issues many home users experienced with the various distribution channels in handling the challenging content of epi 3. I choose not to fault Joe, the colorist who graded the episode, as colorists can only advise.

b.t.w., I’ve since been informed that apparently the JPEG 2000 delivery presentation at the special screening at the TCL Chinese Theatre in Hollywood looked fine, but I’m waiting on a 2nd opinion for verification.

and background for those unfamiliar with George R.R. Martin and others, clicking the arrow is of value - https://www.cbsnews.com/news/60-minu...es-2019-04-14/

[LordoftheRings]

¤ https://www.newsshooter.com/2019/05/...em-gets-v-log/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5DQp...ature=youtu.be

[DanBa]

Originally Posted by gkolb

Hi Dan,

I can’t believe all the tech in that box for ~$114! Plus two memory chips. IMHO this price point puts all the tv manufacturers to shame.

Just curious is that a full fat 2019 HDMI 2.1 chip, or some hybrid upgraded 2.0?

The Amlogic S922X SoC integrates a "built-in HDMI 2.1 transmitter including both controller and PHY with CEC, Dynamic HDR and HDCP 2.2" [page 4].
https://dn.odroid.com/S922X/ODROID-N...sheet_V0.2.pdf

But the S922X has only a H.265 / HEVC Main 10 Level 5.1 decoder [page 3] (i.e. 4K@60 at 17.82 Gbps), and 4K HDR HFR for sports (i.e. 4K@120 at 32.08 / 35.64 Gbps) can’t be done.



Developers and hackers seem very excited by the sub-$100 Odroid N2 single-board computer based on the Amlogic S922X SoC.
https://discourse.coreelec.org/t/the...oid-n2/3788/93
https://www.techrepublic.com/article...-pie-4k-video/

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

Clearly, the individual home user experience for episode 3 of Season 8 GoT was dependent upon what particular display device was used, e.g. https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...o#post16366694 , the ambient lighting , as well as, significantly, the deliverable, e.g. vis-à-vis DirecTV, cable, HBO Go, etc.

The respective post house and colorist are well experienced….https://www.siminternational.com/ and I would have expected them to have anticipated the issues many home users experienced with the various distribution channels in handling the challenging content of epi 3. I choose not to fault Joe, the colorist who graded the episode, as colorists can only advise.

b.t.w., I’ve since been informed that apparently the JPEG 2000 delivery presentation at the special screening at the TCL Chinese Theatre in Hollywood looked fine, but I’m waiting on a 2nd opinion for verification.

https://fstoppers.com/originals/here...oo-dark-363735

[Penton-Man]

follow-up to original posting query from 3 days ago -

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

b.t.w., did any locals see it at the theater here? - https://twitter.com/ChineseTheatres/...98331002146816

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

Clearly, the individual home user experience for episode 3 of Season 8 GoT was dependent upon what particular display device was used, e.g. https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...o#post16366694 , the ambient lighting , as well as, significantly, the deliverable, e.g. vis-à-vis DirecTV, cable, HBO Go, etc.

The respective post house and colorist are well experienced….https://www.siminternational.com/ and I would have expected them to have anticipated the issues many home users experienced with the various distribution channels in handling the challenging content of epi 3. I choose not to fault Joe, the colorist who graded the episode, as colorists can only advise.

b.t.w., I’ve since been informed that apparently the JPEG 2000 delivery presentation at the special screening at the TCL Chinese Theatre in Hollywood looked fine, but I’m waiting on a 2nd opinion for verification.

2nd opinion, from a vfx supervisor (bottom right) who also saw the special screening of epi 3 at the Chinese -



concurs

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

concurs

although, I’d assume, not with Conan’s editors :

We Upped The Brightness On "Game Of Thrones" - CONAN on TBS - YouTube

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

but personally, I felt the creative choice for episode 3 of GoT went too far….for that intentional ‘fog of war’ effect, compounded by the fact that the delivery method to the vast majority of uncalibrated TV consumers will forever to have been by streaming it,

reminds me of a clip I think I posted somewhere on this forum several years back….https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RVS1kkX66GY#t=2m26s

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

https://fstoppers.com/originals/here...oo-dark-363735

Still, you gotta laugh when one of the linked-to complainers in that article is watching it in broad daylight with all that ambient illumination bouncing off the TV.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

Still, you gotta laugh when one of the linked-to complainers in that article is watching it in broad daylight with all that ambient illumination bouncing off the TV.

I didn’t catch that particular comment, but I did read what Rob Mitchell posted (near the top) and I think he should really take the time to watch this past 60 Minutes episode I linked - https://www.cbsnews.com/news/60-minu...es-2019-04-14/ as IMO he doesn’t realize what he’s missing.

Can you guys across the pond get that ^ 60 Minutes clip or is it blocked?

My only difficulty with regards to the content of the series has been in remembering the past histories of all the different characters, but luckily not having questions to this extent:

Game of Thrones Hotline for Confused Fans #2 - YouTube

[LordoftheRings]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

although, I’d assume, not with Conan’s editors :

We Upped The Brightness On "Game Of Thrones" - CONAN on TBS - YouTube

For that one ... (doesn't play on my end, the video above in the quote);

http://teamcoco.com/video/we-upped-t...ame-of-thrones

[Agent Kay]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

lol, you’re telling me, like for instance –



wrong, Tina, the pic ^ was not shot in New York, think about 2,800 miles west of N.Y. here – https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...d#post16344466

He was in London last week????

Damn, I would have dropped him my first Twitter DM

[Penton-Man]

Agent Kay’s back - https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...n#post16243793

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

GoT

And in terms of workflows, some people online have been making the knee jerk assumption that last Sunday’s Game of Thrones episode 3 was derived from an HDR grade, like so (down to bottom left) –



and that the subsequent SDR trim had been screwed up, due to lack of attention, etc. Not so fast with the assumption, blogger ‘experts’.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by BrownianMotion

Saturday Night Live is still on TV?

oh yeah, esp. fulfilling for opera fans -

Weekend Update: Opera Man Returns - SNL - YouTube

and since we (here in the U.S.) no longer have three co-equal branches of government (as the Constitution mandates) while we ride further and further down the road of dictatorship, the show decided to open with a GoT vs. Avengers Family Feud….

Family Feud Cold Open - SNL - YouTube

at least the escapism of comedy helps me sleep better at night.

[Penton-Man]

meanwhile….

What are the Best Ways to Manage Color for HDR and Multiple Deliverables - NAB2019 - YouTube

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

did you complete your knee physical therapy?

Originally Posted by Waboman

That's a long story...

take a seat and confess -

Pedestrians Confess on the Iron Throne - YouTube

[Penton-Man]

So, what’s the bottom line about Game of Thrones episode 3 of Season 8, or what can we learn from all this. Well watching at the Chinese - https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...e#post16373877 (P3 SDR), or at home on a decently calibrated, excellent television in a dark room at a good bitrate can result in one seeing an acceptable picture. But that requires a whole lot of hoops for a consumer to jump thru, which he/she may not be able to achieve, and thru no fault of their own, for a product which is intended to bring satisfaction broadly to a large population of viewers.

An analogy might be that you can have a superbly effective vaccine for a disease, but in the end, how good is it really if the masses it is intended to immunize (and satisfy) have to firstly know and then have the ability to go to a teaching hospital (UCI, UCLA, USC, etc.) where a highly qualified person must administer it, rather than the consumer simply driving locally to any clinic or local community hospital close-by and having any healthcare provider give it to you, no fuss no muss.

Even if people didn’t optimize their televisions as Tom Cruise and Christopher recommended in their PSA - https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...m#post16116265 , that movie was/is still watchable if the masses of viewers do nothing but turn their TVs on to the content.

Hopefully tonight’s episode 4 of GoT will be more efficacious (I haven’t watched it yet).

[LordoftheRings]

Is it happening in daytime or nighttime? We might see what's going on?

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by LordoftheRings

Is it happening in daytime or nighttime? We might see what's going on?

outside - daytime
inside - plenty of this - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0c6HSbI2Jm0#t=1s , but by candlelight, etc. With regards to picture quality, the 4th episode should cause no such complaints as the 3rd did.

[mrtickleuk]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

So, what’s the bottom line about Game of Thrones episode 3 of Season 8, or what can we learn from all this. Well watching at the Chinese - https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...e#post16373877 (P3 SDR), or at home on a decently calibrated, excellent television in a dark room at a good bitrate can result in one seeing an acceptable picture. But that requires a whole lot of hoops for a consumer to jump thru, which he/she may not be able to achieve, and thru no fault of their own, for a product which is intended to bring satisfaction broadly to a large population of viewers.

[...]

Even if people didn’t optimize their televisions as Tom Cruise and Christopher recommended in their PSA - https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...m#post16116265 , that movie was/is still watchable if the masses of viewers do nothing but turn their TVs on to the content.

I don't agree with the second part, because the bitrates are NOT in the control of the viewer! The low bitrates are a huge achilles' heel and are set deliberately and knowingly by the greedy penny-pinching broadcasters. You cannot and should not blame the viewers for this.

Even if you remove the bitrates from the equation (which isn't fair, but just for the sake of argument let's say that the bitrates were adequate for the material): most viewers do not (and will not ever) watch their TV in a darkened room. Therefore, I agree with your main point - there was no hope of most viewers ever being able to enjoy the episode to the fullest.