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View Poll Results: After Reading This Megathread, Will you still purchase LOTR?
Yes 386 59.75%
No 260 40.25%
Voters: 646. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 04-15-2010, 06:21 PM   #9421
ckenisell ckenisell is offline
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I know this has probably already been discussed, but the box art shows DTS-HD Master Audio 6.1. But, I am using an Oppo BDP-83 in bitstream mode and my Integra DTC9.8 is showing DTS-HD 5.1. I am definitely not hearing anything out of the rear channels.

What's the deal? I was really looking forward to 6.1 surround sound.

Oh yeah, I don't want to have to use post processing to get a 5.1 bitstream into a 7.1 output within the receiver.

Last edited by ckenisell; 04-15-2010 at 06:25 PM.
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Old 04-15-2010, 06:33 PM   #9422
BigT BigT is offline
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Mr. Brown, your time and effort put into this LOTR review are very much appreciated. I think you've gone above and beyond what most online reviewers have done and with class to boot. As it seems that the inital production/master issues have been somewhat resolved, i just wanted to add one more factor into this ongoing discussion over the quality of the transfer. I had mentioned them in the past and i don't think many realize that these are very serious problems when it comes to the final product. These are re-production issues and quality controlls during manufacturing. Is it possible that in order for NL/WB to meet deadlines and production targets and/or because of budget constraints including cost factors, they let quality control slip. Considering the size of this release along with distribution factors, not all these LOTR blu-rays are produced in the same factory with the same controls. In my opinion, if the mastering wasn't the whole problem then outsourcing the production of this title to a handfull of dubious distributors could explain the extreme opinions of viewers. You add this to the subjective nature of a person and you get all different views expressed up until now. I always urge people to watchout where they buy from, as with everything else not every identical product is created equal.
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Old 04-15-2010, 06:35 PM   #9423
svenge svenge is offline
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ckenisell: Technically it's 5.1 ES.
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Old 04-15-2010, 06:38 PM   #9424
Q? Q? is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigT View Post
Mr. Brown, your time and effort put into this LOTR review are very much appreciated. I think you've gone above and beyond what most online reviewers have done and with class to boot. As it seems that the inital production/master issues have been somewhat resolved, i just wanted to add one more factor into this ongoing discussion over the quality of the transfer. I had mentioned them in the past and i don't think many realize that these are very serious problems when it comes to the final product. These are re-production issues and quality controlls during manufacturing. Is it possible that in order for NL/WB to meet deadlines and production targets and/or because of budget constraints including cost factors, they let quality control slip. Considering the size of this release along with distribution factors, not all these LOTR blu-rays are produced in the same factory with the same controls. In my opinion, if the mastering wasn't the whole problem then outsourcing the production of this title to a handfull of dubious distributors could explain the extreme opinions of viewers. You add this to the subjective nature of a person and you get all different views expressed up until now. I always urge people to watchout where they buy from, as with everything else not every identical product is created equal.
Doesn't Warner use the same transfer worldwide?
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Old 04-15-2010, 06:39 PM   #9425
supersix4 supersix4 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigT View Post
Mr. Brown, your time and effort put into this LOTR review are very much appreciated. I think you've gone above and beyond what most online reviewers have done and with class to boot. As it seems that the inital production/master issues have been somewhat resolved, i just wanted to add one more factor into this ongoing discussion over the quality of the transfer. I had mentioned them in the past and i don't think many realize that these are very serious problems when it comes to the final product. These are re-production issues and quality controlls during manufacturing. Is it possible that in order for NL/WB to meet deadlines and production targets and/or because of budget constraints including cost factors, they let quality control slip. Considering the size of this release along with distribution factors, not all these LOTR blu-rays are produced in the same factory with the same controls. In my opinion, if the mastering wasn't the whole problem then outsourcing the production of this title to a handfull of dubious distributors could explain the extreme opinions of viewers. You add this to the subjective nature of a person and you get all different views expressed up until now. I always urge people to watchout where they buy from, as with everything else not every identical product is created equal.
Nice post!, I still haven't opened it, but I'll probably watch the first tonight (I still never finished any of these movies ) I saw some of the first when I watched it on netflix, then a couple snippets of the 3rd/2nd on tnthd but thats pretty much it. I kind of can't wait to compare to what I can remember from the first movie I saw on netflix.

Last edited by supersix4; 04-15-2010 at 06:48 PM.
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Old 04-15-2010, 06:47 PM   #9426
Russell_L Russell_L is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob71 View Post
Absolutely hilarious--loved it!!!
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Old 04-15-2010, 06:47 PM   #9427
john_1958 john_1958 is offline
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Originally Posted by deeman54 View Post
Ok explain this like a mentioned before this thread has over 9,000 replies, every time some one says something positive about the film some else searched the internet encyclopedia to find some thread make by some idiot to prove them wrong. Take this for another example, This guy is dead wrong and look how much support he's had, over 60 people voted on this just to bring it to the top to defer people from buying it, everyone knows that people look at these rating before they buy a movie. So this is their effort to bring the sales down. Just as the same attempt on amazon.



This doesn't ring a bell. with 66 votes he shouldn't have any bars at all, but the naysayers are seriously supporting him, probably making extra accounts to support him. This is childish. Really makes me think how many dudes on this site are still virgins.

i laugh at the review lol nobody in their right mind would come up with that review
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Old 04-15-2010, 06:51 PM   #9428
radagast radagast is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scorxpion View Post
Hey you still have there VHS tapes,in my country are vanished even as rental
I bought them a long time ago, and never got rid of them.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gandalf Stormcrow View Post
Odd, this http://www.amazon.com/Lord-Rings-Ret...1349526&sr=1-5
says RoTK EE is only one tape, guess it's incorrect.
Yes, it's wrong. Even the TE ROTK VHS is two tapes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Q! View Post
We can only hope, the look of FOTR wasn't purely intentional so maybe they (director, cinematographer) would want a completely new DI for the EE's.

I seriously hope so.
If they don't do a new DI, there will be Melkor to pay.

Last edited by radagast; 04-15-2010 at 07:03 PM.
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Old 04-15-2010, 06:54 PM   #9429
Russell_L Russell_L is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigT View Post
Mr. Brown, your time and effort put into this LOTR review are very much appreciated. I think you've gone above and beyond what most online reviewers have done and with class to boot. As it seems that the inital production/master issues have been somewhat resolved, i just wanted to add one more factor into this ongoing discussion over the quality of the transfer. I had mentioned them in the past and i don't think many realize that these are very serious problems when it comes to the final product. These are re-production issues and quality controlls during manufacturing. Is it possible that in order for NL/WB to meet deadlines and production targets and/or because of budget constraints including cost factors, they let quality control slip. Considering the size of this release along with distribution factors, not all these LOTR blu-rays are produced in the same factory with the same controls. In my opinion, if the mastering wasn't the whole problem then outsourcing the production of this title to a handfull of dubious distributors could explain the extreme opinions of viewers. You add this to the subjective nature of a person and you get all different views expressed up until now. I always urge people to watchout where they buy from, as with everything else not every identical product is created equal.
This is like saying that different pressings of otherwise identical CDs sound different. I've read numerous posts in audiophile-oriented forums claiming that Japanese CD pressings sound better than their US equivalents, even though the recordings are supposedly identical. Maybe there's some truth to this, maybe not..... (I haven't exactly experienced it myself, however--I've got several Japanese-pressed CDs of recordings that are available in US pressings, but the Japanese ones sound better because they have been mastered differently.)

Last edited by Russell_L; 04-15-2010 at 06:58 PM.
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Old 04-15-2010, 07:14 PM   #9430
Batman1980 Batman1980 is offline
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Grand Bob, about 15 pages into the Hobbit. This made me think of LoTR a bit - Balin. Wasn't Balin, son of Fundin Gimli's cousin? Here lies Balin, son of Fundin, Lord of Moria. I do wonder how Bilbo felt about that.
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Old 04-15-2010, 07:22 PM   #9431
Gremal Gremal is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Russell_L View Post
This is like saying that different pressings of otherwise identical CDs sound different. I've read numerous posts in audiophile-oriented forums claiming that Japanese CD pressings sound better than their US equivalents, even though the recordings are supposedly identical. Maybe there's some truth to this, maybe not..... (I haven't exactly experienced it myself, however--I've got several Japanese-pressed CDs of recordings that are available in US pressings, but the Japanese ones sound better because they have been mastered differently.)
The CD issue has to do with manufacturing processes of the discs themselves. Anyone know if LOTR discs came from different BD production plants? I suspect many of the different perceptions of LotR BDs are due to different home theater setups and misconceptions about how these films really looked in the theater--Ken has done his due diligence but most people seem to think the originals had tremendous depth and detail on the silver screen. They did not. CGI was a big reason.
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Old 04-15-2010, 07:48 PM   #9432
snowball_iv snowball_iv is offline
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For those that bought this did anyone use the $10 off coupon for weta? If so what did you get?

I thought about getting the mini sheilds just cause they were the cheapest but never pulled the trigger.
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Old 04-15-2010, 07:57 PM   #9433
Chordata Chordata is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by john_1958 View Post
i laugh at the review lol nobody in their right mind would come up with that review
It's amazing the number of "-" clicks the positive reviews get. Some people need to find a better way to use their time.

My review simply said: it's not the worst thing of all time, as some have said. View it and decide for yourself.

It's gotten way more "-" clicks than "+" clicks.
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Old 04-15-2010, 08:04 PM   #9434
radagast radagast is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gandalf Stormcrow View Post
Grand Bob, about 15 pages into the Hobbit. This made me think of LoTR a bit - Balin. Wasn't Balin, son of Fundin Gimli's cousin? Here lies Balin, son of Fundin, Lord of Moria. I do wonder how Bilbo felt about that.
And Oin was taken by the "Watcher in the Water" outside the eastern gates of Moria.
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Old 04-15-2010, 08:06 PM   #9435
Batman1980 Batman1980 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by radagast View Post
And Oin was taken by the "Watcher in the Water" outside the eastern gates of Moria.
That ugly water demon that attacked them at that Elvish entrance?
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Old 04-15-2010, 08:10 PM   #9436
radagast radagast is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gandalf Stormcrow View Post
That ugly water demon that attacked them at that Elvish entrance?
Elvish? Moria was a Dwarvish place. There were Elvish letters on the door. The passage about Oin was in the book that Gandalf found, and read aloud, in the chamber where Balin's tomb was.
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Old 04-15-2010, 08:32 PM   #9437
DaViD Boulet DaViD Boulet is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob71 View Post
OMG OMG OMG.

Brilliant. The end... I'm still recovering!

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Old 04-15-2010, 08:32 PM   #9438
Lt. Aldo Raine Lt. Aldo Raine is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by P@t_Mtl View Post
I did not feel like he was a whiney b1tch but I did feel like had diarrhea for a good part of the movie I few times when he died (sort of) I was sure he soiled his hobbit underpants
how dirty and smelly do u think they were at the end of their quest lol
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Old 04-15-2010, 08:41 PM   #9439
DaViD Boulet DaViD Boulet is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Russell_L View Post
This is like saying that different pressings of otherwise identical CDs sound different. I've read numerous posts in audiophile-oriented forums claiming that Japanese CD pressings sound better than their US equivalents, even though the recordings are supposedly identical. Maybe there's some truth to this, maybe not..... (I haven't exactly experienced it myself, however--I've got several Japanese-pressed CDs of recordings that are available in US pressings, but the Japanese ones sound better because they have been mastered differently.)
That has to do with jitter.

Most folks don't realize that only the vertical axis of digital-audio is "digital"... the amplitude of each sample is measured with a bit word: digital. However, the horizontal axis is basically "real time", and so if the samples are run throug the d/a converter in a smooth, even manner just like they were originally sampled to begin with... you get good sound out of the d/a converter.

however, if there's time-clock variation, then the samples pass throug the d/a conversion process unevenly (even if the average time clock speed is the same). This is called "jitter" and it can degrade the sound of the d/a process.

Jitter can get introduced in a number of places when we talk about CD playback. Shocking as it may be, the *pressing* of the CD itself is one place. How? Because many CD players use the raw RF signal generated during the laser-read as their master-clock to send along side the audio samples. Therefore, a cleaner pressing that produces a cleaner RF signal can produce a cleaner clock. Please note that these very small timing errors in no way affect the integrity of the recovered bit-data... only the *d/a conversion* process itself is affected in a negative way if it's fed a clock with timing variability.

Jitter is also a reason why some gold CDs sound better than aluminum discs pressed from the same glass master: gold CDs produce cleaner RF signals when red by the lasers in most transports.

Some CD players generate "asyncranous" clocks that are in no way associated with the raw RF signal. Those types of playback systems would be immune to jitter in the transport and basically play the discs in a way that sounds identical. However such CD players are actually few and far between. There are also outboard devices that reclock data in various ways to try to reduce or elliminate timing variability to scrub/reclock the time clock. The Genesis Digital lens did a ground-up bran-new clock that was completely disassociated with the original clock. for this reason, the digital output of the device had the potential to drift over time out of sync with the incoming signal, and so they had a large RAM buffer to server as a cushin (worked for a 74 minute CD given the timing variation of most transports). They had an optional "phase lock loop" reclocking option when watching laserdisc to keep the incoming/outgoing digital signals in sync, but this reduces the effectivness of the reclocking as a result. Most jitter-filters in consumer gear are merely "phase lock loop" because they need to keep what goes out (to the DAC or other device) ultimately in sync with what's coming in.

Even when using an outboard d/a converter, the original time-clock signal is sent along with the audio data to the receiving device, and just like any analog signal, the time-clock can be subject to reflections in the cable etc. This is how some folks can hear differences between "digital cables" even when the bit-data is 100% the same.

Remember, jitter doesn't cause bit-errors: it just introduces very slight irregularities into the analog time clock that can cause the d/a conversion process to become less accurate, even when the bit-data is 100% perfect.

Ok, back to LOTR!

p.s. I have a few Japanese CDs that sound absolutely superb... almost "analog" like. I've also been surprised that making bit-copies of my aluminum CDs to gold recordable CDs often produces better sound when I play back the recorded discs, as does copying CDs to my iPod in Lossless and playing back via the digital-output WADIA iDock (100% bit-for-bit original to the CD, but completely free from the CD's transport jitter issue).

Last edited by DaViD Boulet; 04-15-2010 at 08:49 PM.
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Old 04-15-2010, 08:43 PM   #9440
42041 42041 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigT View Post
Mr. Brown, your time and effort put into this LOTR review are very much appreciated. I think you've gone above and beyond what most online reviewers have done and with class to boot. As it seems that the inital production/master issues have been somewhat resolved, i just wanted to add one more factor into this ongoing discussion over the quality of the transfer. I had mentioned them in the past and i don't think many realize that these are very serious problems when it comes to the final product. These are re-production issues and quality controlls during manufacturing. Is it possible that in order for NL/WB to meet deadlines and production targets and/or because of budget constraints including cost factors, they let quality control slip. Considering the size of this release along with distribution factors, not all these LOTR blu-rays are produced in the same factory with the same controls. In my opinion, if the mastering wasn't the whole problem then outsourcing the production of this title to a handfull of dubious distributors could explain the extreme opinions of viewers. You add this to the subjective nature of a person and you get all different views expressed up until now. I always urge people to watchout where they buy from, as with everything else not every identical product is created equal.
Um, this is a digital disc, not an LP. It's either the same or its completely different.
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