HDTVTEST (Vincent Teoh) Discussion Thread

[wxman2003]

Originally Posted by batman2000

Yeah hard pass until they fixed 1080p to not have forced overscan they switch is stuck with overscan.

It only does that with less than 1080p sources. Overscan is not forced with any 1080p blurays via my OPPO 103D. I have the tv.

[SeeMoreDigital]

Originally Posted by wxman2003

It only does that with less than 1080p sources. Overscan is not forced with any 1080p blurays via my OPPO 103D. I have the tv.

Yep... It's pretty bonkers that some TV manufacturers still don't offer the ability to disable over-scan for standard definition content.

The UK broadcasts far more std-def TV channels than high-def ones and I find it annoying that some of the image is lost to over-scan

[LordoftheRings]

■ https://www.flatpanelshd.com/news.ph...&id=1654235588

[avs commenter]

Samsung is the Sideshow Bob rake gif

[SeeMoreDigital]

It's the TV equivalent of diesel-gate

[I DO BLU]

MiniLED TV has Improved So Much, It's Better than OLED for Living Room, Says TCL - YouTube

[BrownianMotion]

Sony A95K QD-OLED Review - The TV to Beat in 2022! - YouTube

[samlop10]

Shame about the ambient light messing up the black levels, and no option to calibrate it so it doesn’t come out of black so soon either.

Still, QD-OLED seems to provide quite a nice upgrade in color gamut & volume, and a more stable picture. Hopefully LG will adopt it and/or Sony will fix those quirks.

It is interesting to see that most of the upgrades right now seem to be ‘edge cases’ though. As most of the colors in the majority of HDR content shots reside in lower levels of brightness, the jump in color volume isn’t as noticeable in most real content. And also, most content is mastered in DCI-P3 (which most OLEDs without QD already can display) and not Rec.2020. Thus those ‘edge cases’ are where most of the upgrades here fall.

Makes you wonder if those upgrades are worth the extra money when compared to non-QD OLEDs when you consider the (small) drawbacks as well. Will have to wait and see what next year’s QD OLEDs offer, and if bigger sizes will be available in the first place, which the current available sizes already make it a deal breaker for me.

[lgans316]

Originally Posted by samlop10

Shame about the ambient light messing up the black levels, and no option to calibrate it so it doesn’t come out of black so soon either.

Still, QD-OLED seems to provide quite a nice upgrade in color gamut & volume, and a more stable picture. Hopefully LG will adopt it and/or Sony will fix those quirks.

It is interesting to see that most of the upgrades right now seem to be ‘edge cases’ though. As most of the colors in the majority of HDR content shots reside in lower levels of brightness, the jump in color volume isn’t as noticeable in most real content. And also, most content is mastered in DCI-P3 (which most OLEDs without QD already can display) and not Rec.2020. Thus those ‘edge cases’ are where most of the upgrades here fall.

Makes you wonder if those upgrades are worth the extra money when compared to non-QD OLEDs when you consider the (small) drawbacks as well.

Agree. This should benefit only 10-15% of the movies released so far.

As usual the focus is always on 10% and below which is okay with WOLED but with QD-OLED, clearly the panel can be pushed harder, yet Sony decides to play conservative. The brightness measurements on 25% and above windows looks underwhelming.

[MisterXDTV]

Originally Posted by samlop10

It is interesting to see that most of the upgrades right now seem to be ‘edge cases’ though. As most of the colors in the majority of HDR content shots reside in lower levels of brightness, the jump in color volume isn’t as noticeable in most real content. And also, most content is mastered in DCI-P3 (which most OLEDs without QD already can display) and not Rec.2020. Thus those ‘edge cases’ are where most of the upgrades here fall.

Makes you wonder if those upgrades are worth the extra money when compared to non-QD OLEDs when you consider the (small) drawbacks as well. Will have to wait and see what next year’s QD OLEDs offer, and if bigger sizes will be available in the first place, which the current available sizes already make it a deal breaker for me.

I have been saying this for months, and I was attacked by some people in this thread because I didn't understand the POWER of QD-OLED

Now people are beginning to see that basically no content available can use neither the expanded color gamut nor the expanded color volume....

I guess the POWER of QD-OLED was a marketing gimmick by Samsung Display to compete with LG after telling people for 8 years that OLEDs sucked and LCDs were better.... LOL

[lgans316]

Originally Posted by MisterXDTV

I have been saying this for months, and I was attacked by some people in this thread because I didn't understand the POWER of QD-OLED

Now people are beginning to see that basically no content available can use neither the expanded color gamut nor the expanded color volume....

I guess the POWER of QD-OLED was a marketing gimmick by Samsung Display to compete with LG after telling people for 8 years that OLEDs sucked and LCDs were better.... LOL

If you look at the some of the folks at AVSForum they want the latest and greatest and will go above and beyond to defend their purchase.

It's their money which is fine but suddenly the TVs they owned in the past becomes junk. One guy claims he is a hardcore film fan and all he talks is just brightness, nothing else. One guy has a 3000 nit Z9J to watch SDR predominately and says the TV doesn't need much tonemapping (seriously?). Pity that many watch these tailor made HDR demos and come to a conclusion about the picture quality.

I too like some extra brightness but not at the expense of light uncontrollably leaking onto the adjacent areas causing a washed out hazy picture which I myself I have noticed even on the ZD9 on certain occasions. Yesterday I spent 30 mins comparing Doctor Strange 2 on D+ (77A80J / 65ZD9). Although the Z looked brighter during the HDR moments, I can't deny the fact that the OLED offered more contrast, colours and depth which made up for that lack of extra HDR oomph the Z offered.

Do we have any thread in our forum here which contains a list of movies that offers beyond DCI P3 colours?

[MisterXDTV]

Originally Posted by lgans316

If you look at the some of the folks at AVSForum they want the latest and greatest and will go above and beyond to defend their purchase.

It's their money which is fine but suddenly the TVs they owned in the past becomes junk. One guy claims he is a hardcore film fan and all he talks is just brightness, nothing else. One guy has a 3000 nit Z9J to watch SDR predominately and says the TV doesn't need much tonemapping (seriously?). Pity that many watch these tailor made HDR demos and come to a conclusion about the picture quality.

I too like some extra brightness but not at the expense of light uncontrollably leaking onto the adjacent areas causing a washed out hazy picture which I myself I have noticed even on the ZD9 on certain occasions. Yesterday I spent 30 mins comparing Doctor Strange 2 on D+ (77A80J / 65ZD9). Although the Z looked brighter during the HDR moments, I can't deny the fact that the OLED offered more contrast, colours and depth which made up for that lack of extra HDR oomph the Z offered.

Do we have any thread in our forum here which contains a list of movies that offers beyond DCI P3 colours?

I remember only The Lego Batman Movie that was mastered natively in BT.2020.

I guess with digital animation it's way easier to get higher color specs...

https://www.imdb.com/title/tt4116284/technical

[lgans316]

Originally Posted by MisterXDTV

I remember only The Lego Batman Movie that was mastered natively in BT.2020.

I guess with digital animation it's way easier to get higher color specs...

https://www.imdb.com/title/tt4116284/technical

I see.

I have about 1100+ full fat 4K MKV rips from my personal collection. Need to spend some time scanning them and uploading the metadata to analyse how many of them are in BT.2020.

[MisterXDTV]

Originally Posted by lgans316

I see.

I have about 1100+ full fat 4K MKV rips from my personal collection. Need to spend some time scanning them and uploading the metadata to analyse how many of them are in BT.2020.

You can check only the color primaries on the discs but to really check how much of the image goes past Rec.709 or Display P3 you need the Canon reference monitor that Vincent has...

[Geoff D]

Yeah, the metadata won’t tell you anything. Just because it was mastered with 2020 primaries doesn’t mean it covers any part of the 2020 gamut. Pyoko had an amazing ‘heat map’ analysis thread but he hasn’t posted in ages. He’s got more sense than to hang around here all the time.

And also yeah, digital animation is literally created from nothing so they can set what they want for colour, though even under that remit there are no guarantees that they’ll use the 2020 gamut in terms of their aesthetic choices.

[lgans316]

Originally Posted by MisterXDTV

You can check only the color primaries on the discs but to really check how much of the image goes past Rec.709 or Display P3 you need the Canon reference monitor that Vincent has...

Gotcha. So for the peasants it's almost impossible to figure out then.

Wondering when the studios would go full steam with REC.2020 or will it even happen in the next 5 years?

Actually I should have added in my previous post that the scanning was not only for colour space but also for MaxCLL, MaxFALL and mastering container if they are available. Many think most of them are 4000 nits which IMO is wrong. Even the ones in 4000 nits container have MaxCLL well under 1000 nits (Tenet?)

[MisterXDTV]

Originally Posted by lgans316

Gotcha. So for the peasants it's almost impossible to figure out then.

Wondering when the studios would go full steam with REC.2020 or will it even happen in the next 5 years? (Tenet?)

If you look at this video DCI wants to add HDR to the theatrical specs but I don't think they are gonna abandon P3 as the color gamut standard anytime soon...

Movies are made for theaters first....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7xUqF9DpDo0

[teddyballgame]

Originally Posted by MisterXDTV

You can check only the color primaries on the discs but to really check how much of the image goes past Rec.709 or Display P3 you need the Canon reference monitor that Vincent has...

Something like Mr Friedrich's toolset would be handy for a proper analysis. My guess is that few people have the time or resources available to devote towards starting a project like that though. I think we all realize there's a limited audience who is interested in these things.

[lgans316]

Originally Posted by teddyballgame

Something like Mr Friedrich's toolset would be handy for a proper analysis. My guess is that few people have the time or resources available to devote towards starting a project like that though. I think we all realize there's a limited audience who is interested in these things.

“HDRMaster has been a part of our toolset for mastering Ultra HD Blu-ray movie titles for a while now, so we’re delighted with the additions to this new release. With a wide variety of HDR display devices operating with varying peak luminance levels, tone mapping curves and color gamut tracking behavior, the HDRMaster suite lets us perform an in-depth analysis of the content we’re handling, so we can better understand how it will appear on a multitude of displays. In addition to the newly added Luminance Heatmap and Chromaticity Diagram modes, the metadata validation, MaxFALL/MaxCLL calculation and support for HDR10+ make it essential for facilities involved in the production and distribution of HDR video. “

—David Mackenzie

Fidelity in Motion (Ultra HD Blu-ray authoring facility based in New York City)

[MisterXDTV]

Originally Posted by teddyballgame

Something like Mr Friedrich's toolset would be handy for a proper analysis. My guess is that few people have the time or resources available to devote towards starting a project like that though. I think we all realize there's a limited audience who is interested in these things.

I mean the prices for software + plugins are insane. No wonder there's a limited audience