The Lord of the Rings: The Motion Picture Trilogy (Extended Edition) (2001-2003)

[Petra_Kalbrain]

Originally Posted by Milambian

Ok, this has been really bothering me every time someone posts this, so I will just ask. Pardon my ignorance, but what is this setting that miraculously affects only one film on a display while leaving all others untouched. If you are changing a calibration setting to adjust the picture of a particular movie, that same change will be occurring in any other film you watch on that display, unless you move your settings back. That's how image settings work. It's... science. If I am wrong, I will happily admit it, but I simply do not see how changing an image/color/whatever setting on your display won't affect other films.

I have my display adjusted using the Disney WoW calibration disc. If I shove my tint away from green and more towards red, that will absolutely change the image of other films. So what setting exactly are we talking about here?

On that note, yes, I DO notice the green overcast in Fellowship compared to the EE DVDs. It does not bother me enough to anger me, and I am happy with my purchase.

I'm not entirely sure. I didn't have to do it myself because my TV didn't show even a hint of offset to the blue skies on my viewing. However, others have stated that a minor adjustment to one of the colours was enough to fix the green but not enough to mess with any other presentation.

It is definitely a colour setting. And it's not a big change that needs to take place to fix the issue. And, obviously it will change other presentations. However, the change in other presentations still keeps the colours looking natural while fixing the green in FOTR.

Maybe someone who has done this will be able to comment further. But, I obviously calibrated my TV to compensate when I got it 4 years ago.

[nathan_393]

Originally Posted by Petra_Kalbrain

I'm not entirely sure. I didn't have to do it myself because my TV didn't show even a hint of offset to the blue skies on my viewing. However, others have stated that a minor adjustment to one of the colours was enough to fix the green but not enough to mess with any other presentation.

It is definitely a colour setting. And it's not a big change that needs to take place to fix the issue. And, obviously it will change other presentations. However, the change in other presentations still keeps the colours looking natural while fixing the green in FOTR.

Maybe someone who has done this will be able to comment further. But, I obviously calibrated my TV to compensate when I got it 4 years ago.

I pulled out my calibration discs today to double check on everything you're suggesting - I've read it all before.

Anyways, my color setting was off by 1 and the hue setting off by 2. Adjusting both does make FOTR look a touch better - less green, more blue. But nowhere near as bad as some of the screenshots in this thread indicate. Generally, my roommate and I see a difference and it doesn't seem to be affecting anything else I've put in to test.

But moving the hue by 2 positions rarely will imo. Although this doesn't return the colour scheme to "Holy cow it's the TE!" status, it does seem to compensate for *some* of the colour problems. It certainly makes the BD for FOTR more watchable for me. And it doesn't egregiously change anything else that I can tell.

Ironically, making the set a touch more green was what did it for me - not less. I seem to remember others reporting this as well. It's important to note than any more red or green would ruin my calibration, according to Disney's WOW disc and the AVS calibration disc floating around.

EDIT: It's entirely possible that this is a placebo effect. Only time will tell.

[frogmort]

Originally Posted by nathan_393

Ironically, making the set a touch more green was what did it for me - not less. I seem to remember others reporting this as well.

I also noticed this on my tv. I found a particularly green shot and paused it, and messed around with the tint a little, and to my surprise, as I went toward red, it became more green, but as I went toward green, it became more blue.
Weird!

[Milambian]

Originally Posted by Petra_Kalbrain

I'm not entirely sure. I didn't have to do it myself because my TV didn't show even a hint of offset to the blue skies on my viewing. However, others have stated that a minor adjustment to one of the colours was enough to fix the green but not enough to mess with any other presentation.

It is definitely a colour setting. And it's not a big change that needs to take place to fix the issue. And, obviously it will change other presentations. However, the change in other presentations still keeps the colours looking natural while fixing the green in FOTR.

Maybe someone who has done this will be able to comment further. But, I obviously calibrated my TV to compensate when I got it 4 years ago.

Thanks for the response! I won't personally be changing my settings for one film. There is an industry standard for a reason! I guess I'll look into this further, unless someone who had made this calibration change themselves would like to chime in.

[Goldengirl]

Green or blue --that doesn't matter to me nearly as much as the added DARK matters.

Oh well, I'm sure I'll be buying again when The Hobbit comes out. Maybe they'll put out a version that is similar in color and brightness to the dvd ee. By then I'll be old enough that Social Security will pay for it.

[nathan_393]

Originally Posted by frogmort

I also noticed this on my tv. I found a particularly green shot and paused it, and messed around with the tint a little, and to my surprise, as I went toward red, it became more green, but as I went toward green, it became more blue.
Weird!

It was odd. I'd say I'm in the middle between TE and EE now, which is probably close to where I should be. Faces are definitely pink instead of a ghastly green.

I think the most important thing for me to say though is that I simply adjusted calibration on my TV to make it closer to the industry standard, not further away. Which did provide better results with FOTR.

I feel like I'm seeing more shadow detail now than I was before as well.

Regardless, I'm quite pleased with where I'm at and can't see my calibration getting much better at this point. Everything is where it should be, at least for me, and FOTR looks better at the industry standard than it does when it's not quite there. Who knew?

[Aquel]

Originally Posted by nathan_393

It was odd. I'd say I'm in the middle between TE and EE now, which is probably close to where I should be. Faces are definitely pink instead of a ghastly green.

I think the most important thing for me to say though is that I simply adjusted calibration on my TV to make it closer to the industry standard, not further away. Which did provide better results with FOTR.

I feel like I'm seeing more shadow detail now than I was before as well.

Regardless, I'm quite pleased with where I'm at and can't see my calibration getting much better at this point. Everything is where it should be, at least for me, and FOTR looks better at the industry standard than it does when it's not quite there. Who knew?

Would setting the temperature higher (I currently use neutral) improve the colours for FOTR by the way (because the green tint darkens the picture)? I am not sure whether to buy it or wait for a new transfer that maybe will never happen and the price is currently more reasonable than it was at launch date so

[ckenisell]

Originally Posted by Goldengirl

Green or blue --that doesn't matter to me nearly as much as the added DARK matters.

I'm with you on this one. The green tint stinks, but I'm more pissed about the OBVIOUS blacks that are severely crushed.

[nathan_393]

Originally Posted by Aquel

Would setting the temperature higher (I currently use neutral) improve the colours for FOTR by the way (because the green tint darkens the picture)? I am not sure whether to buy it or wait for a new transfer that maybe will never happen and the price is currently more reasonable than it was at launch date so

Most people argue that your TV's warmest setting is closer to the industry standard than neutral, and I agree with that perspective. It would certainly change the colours for FOTR, but whether or not it makes them better will certainly be up to your own eyes to decide.

[Aquel]

Originally Posted by nathan_393

Most people argue that your TV's warmest setting is closer to the industry standard than neutral, and I agree with that perspective. It would certainly change the colours for FOTR, but whether or not it makes them better will certainly be up to your own eyes to decide.

Personally I find warm too.. warm (let alone warm 2). Makes whites look orange. Which is why for normal releases I use neutral. But I will see if warm alleviates the dark, green picture of FOTR (since you can never completely neutralise it unless you throw all of your settings overboard ) when I receive it.

Maybe do some tinkering with the RGB controls if I can't stand the picture.

[nathan_393]

Originally Posted by Aquel

Personally I find warm too.. warm (let alone warm 2). Makes whites look orange. Which is why for normal releases I use neutral. But I will see if warm alleviates the dark, green picture of FOTR (since you can never completely neutralise it unless you throw all of your settings overboard ) when I receive it.

Maybe do some tinkering with the RGB controls if I can't stand the picture.

It took me a couple days to get used to Warm2. But now I can't go back. Skin tones look much more natural with Warm imo.

And nobody will ever be able to alleviate the green tint. haha it'll always be there. But I firmly believe that proper calibration can always help make a positive difference in any Blu-ray's PQ.

[frogmort]

That's another one of those weird things that I discovered while messing around with the picture for FotR. You would think that Warm would reduce the tint problem, but on my tv, Warm makes it the most pronounced, Normal a little less, and Cool almost completely fixes it, but makes other colors seem a little off.

I also have mine set to Warm.

[nathan_393]

Originally Posted by frogmort

That's another one of those weird things that I discovered while messing around with the picture for FotR. You would think that Warm would reduce the tint problem, but on my tv, Warm makes it the most pronounced, Normal a little less, and Cool almost completely fixes it, but makes other colors seem a little off.

I also have mine set to Warm.

I'm not willing to un-calibrate my TV to "fix" a Blu-ray, in that case. I'll survive with my more-pronounced greens I guess.

[frogmort]

Originally Posted by nathan_393

I'm not willing to un-calibrate my TV to "fix" a Blu-ray, in that case. I'll survive with my more-pronounced greens I guess.

I'm the same way. I did play around a little with FotR, but I ended up setting everything back exactly the way it was before. I put a lot of work into "self calibrating" my tv using calibration discs. I still go back and double check everything on a regular basis. I have 187 blu-rays, and apart from the varying quality of different transfers, 186 of them look great. There is no way in hell that I would ever adjust my tv to suit this one movie, and especially just leave it that way for all others. That just seems crazy to me.

I do really think FotR looks great, for the most part, but if I could walk up to my screen and peel away the tint/contrast problems from this, I think it would be glorious! I don't really have any scientific proof to back this up, but I think the problem might not be too much green, but not enough red and blue in the image that makes the green stand out more. I think draining the image of red and blue would explain the darker contrast, more than a boosting of the green would.

I've said it before, but WB quietly issued replacement discs for The Matrix - Revolutions because there was one frame that had mild pixelation problems, so it's not like it would be unheard of for them to quietly issue replacements for this, once sales die down a little in a few months. I still find it very telling that Peter Jackson, to this day still hasn't made one single peep about any of this at all.

[nathan_393]

Originally Posted by frogmort

I'm the same way. I did play around a little with FotR, but I ended up setting everything back exactly the way it was before. I put a lot of work into "self calibrating" my tv using calibration discs. I still go back and double check everything on a regular basis. I have 187 blu-rays, and apart from the varying quality of different transfers, 186 of them look great. There is no way in hell that I would ever adjust my tv to suit this one movie, and especially just leave it that way for all others. That just seems crazy to me.

I do really think FotR looks great, for the most part, but if I could walk up to my screen and peel away the tint/contrast problems from this, I think it would be glorious! I don't really have any scientific proof to back this up, but I think the problem might not be too much green, but not enough red and blue in the image that makes the green stand out more. I think draining the image of red and blue would explain the darker contrast, more than a boosting of the green would.

I've said it before, but WB quietly issued replacement discs for The Matrix - Revolutions because there was one frame that had mild pixelation problems, so it's not like it would be unheard of for them to quietly issue replacements for this, once sales die down a little in a few months. I still find it very telling that Peter Jackson, to this day still hasn't made one single peep about any of this at all.

I think it's hard to say if it's a defect or not. But if I was offered a replacement in a similar way to Matrix, I'd take it in a heartbeat.

[mredman]

Originally Posted by nathan_393

I think it's hard to say if it's a defect or not. But if I was offered a replacement in a similar way to Matrix, I'd take it in a heartbeat.

If anyone really think there is a mistake with FOTR after all this time they are truly kidding themselves

PJ thinks the statement from warner and his statement at the theaters is enough. He is not gonna spell it out for the FEW people that still don't believe in him or warner

[Aragorn the Elfstone]

After getting a look at the pics from the new BD for O Brother, Where Art Thou? (which also has the approval of the DP & sports more pronouced greens/yellows), I'm more inclined to think there wasn't a screw up with FotR. I don't think these old DIs were spot on with what the DPs wanted color-wise. Sure, the greens are more pronouced - but after several viewings, I've noticed other colors are too.

I'm still getting used to it, but I'm not too certain this was a mistake.

[kingkong650]

Originally Posted by mredman

If anyone really think there is a mistake with FOTR after all this time they are truly kidding themselves

PJ thinks the statement from warner and his statement at the theaters is enough. He is not gonna spell it out for the FEW people that still don't believe in him or warner

We don´t think there´s a mistake, we KNOW there´s a mistake. The FOTR EE blu-ray has a clearly visible (at least to those who know what to look for) constant green tint running thoughout the whole film. Is Warner going to admit they ****ed up? Of course not. Is PJ going to jeopardise his relationship with Warner by saying they´ve ****ed up while working on The Hobbit, a film directly funded by Warner? Of course not.

Most of the general public have not even noticed the green tint and even if they do, are so impressed by the picture quality/sharpness of the blu-ray that they overlook the constant green tint. Either way, Warner waited without confirming/denying anything about the flaw to see how the general public reacted. When the general public were bowled over by the greatly improved PQ relative to the theatrical release and thereby didn´t notice/give little importance to the constant green tint, Warner decided to release a generic PR statement saying everything was as the filmmaker intended without directly addressing the issue of the green tint and then sweep everything under the carpet, to avoid issuing replacements and thereby maximise profits.

Three months on and we have yet to hear from either PJ or Warner about the green tint on FOTR EE but there you go, no surprises there.

[kingkong650]

I have created my own regraded FOTR EE spread over two dual layer blu-rays, with pretty much identical PQ to the blu-ray but having removed the green tint, correcting the colours and brightness, so I´m not too bothered by their silence, having made a replacement I´m very happy with.

I´m not surprised by how Warner has acted in all this, their actions have been fairly predictable all along, doing everything to maximise their profit margin, turning a blind eye to what was clearly a mistake on their part. I hope the extra profit was worth the damage this whole sordid business caused to their reputation.

This whole affair has made me lose a great deal of respect for Peter Jackson though, who used to have integrity, would respect his fans, answer their questions honestly and sincerely and would be totally straight up with them. That he didn´t step forward and point out the obvious green tint error in his first and best LOTR film IMHO, while understandable with him being funded by Warner right now for The Hobbit, was very disappointing and I expected more from him.

[Aragorn the Elfstone]

You know, as a side note, revisiting this topic reminds me how I was trying to be a voice of reason during the initial controversy over the color changes and tried to keep a cool head. Yet, on the flip side of that - the recent Star Wars debacle had my blood boiling, and I fear I may have gotten a bit hippocritical. It's funny how different things can test your tolerance level.