4K Movies Releases

[Dubstar]

Originally Posted by pagemaster

Not a big fan of Atmos anyway, much prefer the IMAX digital system.

if Atmos wasn't so damn loud - 'Oz: The Great and Powerful' in Atmos was the best so far (of the three films I've heard) and it trumps standard IMAX 5.0 audio, in my opinion.

[PeterTHX]

Originally Posted by pagemaster

Not a big fan of Atmos anyway, much prefer the IMAX digital system.

Not sure why a speaker layout developed in the late 1970s would sound better, especially since during The Hobbit I was very aware of the speaker locations in IMAX. In Atmos it was seamless and truly 3D.

[PeterTHX]

Originally Posted by Dubstar

if Atmos wasn't so damn loud - 'Oz: The Great and Powerful' in Atmos was the best so far (of the three films I've heard) and it trumps standard IMAX 5.0 audio, in my opinion.

Probably depends on the theater setup. My last deafening experience was in an IMAX venue for The Dark Knight Rises, the volume levels were raised beyond distortion so bad the last sequence with the sound FX and the music was one painfully long audio version of a blur.

AMC's Atmos setup was near perfect.

[pro-bassoonist]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

But the bottom line is that they’ll come a day that even the most skeptical of 4K critics, like apparently Mr. Zitter, will look back upon the introduction and sales of initial consumer 4K tv’s as being, at the very least, a necessary prerequisite stepping stone in the progression towards a more optimal home-viewing experience with digital displays.

A quick comment here: There are skeptics, and I am one of them, who believe that the studios will not be willing to offer 4K content on the market as they did in years past. There are probably 5+ year-old posts I've left here addressing the issue, and I have not changed my opinion at all.

On the other hand, there are supposedly some pretty smart guys high up the executive ladder in some big companies that are under the impression that they could build a large 4K ecosystem, using a certain console, and lock consumers there to pay for content. My feeling is that they are in for a very rude awakening, as the type of monopoly over 4K content they wish to have isn't going to materialize. Feel free to bookmark this post for future reference, Penton.

Lastly, 4K technology will make it to the consumer. It is not a question of if, but when, and how. The trouble, Penton, is that, as I noted above, there are a group of people who want to have all the cards, and currently assume that everyone else out there isn't seeing what they are trying to build.

Any such market, as the one they are fantasizing about, with optical media out of it, will be as volatile as the European Union. Which is one of many reasons why I am a firm believer that Blu-ray and optical media are here to stay for a very, very long time

Pro-B

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by singhcr

Hi Penton,

Thanks for the information. I went to the Oblivion website and it didn't mention anything about 4k or Dolby Atmos, do you know of any listings of compatible theaters that are showing 4K DCPs? Or would I have to see it in IMAX to see it in 4k?

Of note, I don’t know of any public list available to the consumer that reveals 4K DCPs delivered to theaters. There is a list of Sony 4K equipped theaters here - http://pro.sony.com/bbsc/ssr/mkt-dig...atregmap.shtml

I guess you could cross reference the above list with this list…http://www.dolby.com/us/en/professio....html#Theatres

and see if any location matches your area . Then, after that, best to call for confirmation.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by kong73

Does this mean i'll need a new TV too?

Giz, you’ll always have to buy a new TV….resistance is futile!

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

Just imagine someday watching those buttocks shakin when they’ve been captured at 4K 60fps and displayed at 4K 60p.

No motion blur.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by pro-bassoonist

A quick comment here: There are skeptics, and I am one of them, who believe that the studios will not be willing to offer 4K content on the market as they did in years past. There are probably 5+ year-old posts I've left here addressing the issue, and I have not changed my opinion at all.

On the other hand, there are supposedly some pretty smart guys high up the executive ladder in some big companies that are under the impression that they could build a large 4K ecosystem, using a certain console, and lock consumers there to pay for content. My feeling is that they are in for a very rude awakening, as the type of monopoly over 4K content they wish to have isn't going to materialize. Feel free to bookmark this post for future reference, Penton.

Lastly, 4K technology will make it to the consumer. It is not a question of if, but when, and how. The trouble, Penton, is that, as I noted above, there are a group of people who want to have all the cards, and currently assume that everyone else out there isn't seeing what they are trying to build.

Any such market, as the one they are fantasizing about, with optical media out of it, will be as volatile as the European Union. Which is one of many reasons why I am a firm believer that Blu-ray and optical media are here to stay for a very, very long time

Pro-B

Pro,
I don’t really understand what you are saying/implying.

You’ll have to explain further what you mean. If you think that potentially offering 4K BD or other type of 4K media would somehow jeopardize or devalue the original asset of the studio/content owner, that is no more the case than now offering BD-50s on motion pictures which originally went thru a 2K DI (or 2K datacine source)…which constitutes the vast majority of the titles over the years that consumers have already purchased.

Excuse me for not waiting for a response but this is a busy week and I’ve gotta run right now.

[img eL]

Originally Posted by pro-bassoonist

On the other hand, there are supposedly some pretty smart guys high up the executive ladder in some big companies that are under the impression that they could build a large 4K ecosystem, using a certain console, and lock consumers there to pay for content. My feeling is that they are in for a very rude awakening, as the type of monopoly over 4K content they wish to have isn't going to materialize.

Lastly, 4K technology will make it to the consumer. It is not a question of if, but when, and how.

Any such market, as the one they are fantasizing about, with optical media out of it, will be as volatile as the European Union. Which is one of many reasons why I am a firm believer that Blu-ray and optical media are here to stay for a very, very long time Pro-B

+1

[singhcr]

Originally Posted by pagemaster

Oblivion will get Dolby Atmos and the movie was shot in 4K.



IMAX digital is not 4K, I wouldn't waste my time seeing it in 15/70 either. Just seek out a 4k theatre, that is assuming it will be advertised.

I was referring to the idea of taking the 4k DCP and printing it to 15/70 film.

[pro-bassoonist]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

Pro,

I don’t really understand what you are saying/implying.

I don't think it is a coincidence that multiple parties aren't rushing to negotiate an expansion of the Blu-ray specs that could accommodate 4K content. On the other hand, to me it is obvious that there is a push to build an ecosystem to stream 4K content. I think that this scenario is doomed to fail.

The issue isn't devaluation of studio content. The issue is control of the 4K content, which some very familiar players wish to have by building a 4K ecosystem and locking people in it. You can have the 4K studio content, but you pay for it and "own" it only in the ecosystem.

The only way I could see people getting excited about owning 4K content is if 4K content is offered through Blu-ray. You have to have physical ownership. The idea that people, and especially big collectors, would rush to pay for 4K copies of their favorite films and own them in the ecosystem I mentioned above is beyond naive.

Red Ray-based physical format isn't the savior for 4K either.


Pro-B

[Brightstar]

well alot of websites claim that 4k wont take off till 2017 !!

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by pro-bassoonist

I don't think it is a coincidence that multiple parties aren't rushing to negotiate an expansion of the Blu-ray specs that could accommodate 4K content. On the other hand, to me it is obvious that there is a push to build an ecosystem to stream 4K content. I think that this scenario is doomed to fail.

The issue isn't devaluation of studio content. The issue is control of the 4K content, which some very familiar players wish to have by building a 4K ecosystem and locking people in it. You can have the 4K studio content, but you pay for it and "own" it only in the ecosystem.

The only way I could see people getting excited about owning 4K content is if 4K content is offered through Blu-ray. You have to have physical ownership. The idea that people, and especially big collectors, would rush to pay for 4K copies of their favorite films and own them in the ecosystem I mentioned above is beyond naive.

Red Ray-based physical format isn't the savior for 4K either.


Pro-B

I see, now I think I’m catching your drift. I had thought that you were implying (like before, unless that was some other mod) that future 4K movie offering to home entertainment hobbyists would essentially be like selling copies of the DSM (Digital Source Master)to the consumer, which is what I believe we had already had an exchange about in the past, months ago and I thought I had adequately explained how it was not.

Bottom line, with your assertion, so, you think that 4K needs Blu-ray as a savior….or at least amongst that subgroup of viewers who place *content ownership* as being of the highest priority. Your obvious vested interest aside….that is an interesting notion, albeit somewhat of a depressing qualifier given the formation and progress of the BDA task force. Anyway, I hope for the non-biased sake of being able to best ‘watch’ content with increased resolution that the BDA ultimately feels the same way you do, and acts accordingly. After all, they are at least ‘considering’ it…i.e. 4KBD, for those not following the situation, see - https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread.php?t=214000

I personally prefer (and always have) optical media along with its packaging and art work just like I cherish the hand written letters my deceased parents had written me, rather than if they had phoned me or sent me those same communications via e-mail < just no soul to that, even though I would *own* those emails.

Anyway, memories and reminiscing aside, let’s be more specific, who are these “familiar players” (other than Sony, RED and Netflix that have already publically announced intentions to develop a 4K distribution platform) which you refer to that are also pursuing a non-optical based ‘4K ecosystem’?

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by singhcr

Hi Penton...

singhcr

The reason why I bolded ‘equipped’ in the previous reply to you is that despite the fact that some motion pictures have gone through a 4K DI (and been ‘mastered in 4K’), that does not automatically mean that all the DCPs are/were 4K DCPs.

There have been instances where some content providers have produced 4K and 2K DCPs (of a motion picture mastered in 4K) and for one reason or another sent the 2K deliverable to the theater operator….which ended up being exhibited thru the 4K ‘equipped’ projection systems and I think audiences have been clueless when that’s happened.

This brings up another interesting thought which is of some debate amongst D-Cinema insiders in that would a ‘maxed out’ 2K DCP (meaning having a constant 250Mb/s data rate, which equates to about 230 GB for a 2 hr. feature) look better than a 4K DCP run through a 2K projector?

Food for thought.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by joliefan

well alot of websites claim that 4k wont take off till 2017 !!

Heck, before that a lot were claiming that 4K would be a non–starter to begin with (i.e. never happen) and then, as time goes by, they conveniently *move the goal posts* with their forecasting.

b.t.w., since you are a fan (as am I) of ‘tres jolie’ (Pro has got me speaking French now ), in case you’re unaware, this interview is available. Been awhile since I watched it but I like the line that goes something like ‘only in Hollywood would you get extra credit for Therapy’.

Inside The Actors Studio - Angelina Jolie - YouTube

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

Just imagine someday watching those buttocks shakin when they’ve been captured at 4K 60fps and displayed at 4K 60p.

No motion blur.

Nothing wrong with motion blur!

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

Nothing wrong with motion blur!

hah, in the case of cellulite deposits, I feel your sentiment (do I need to post an illustrative video for that?). Otherwise, my personal feeling is that I would prefer no motion blur with finer gluteus in-motion specimens…
http://www.complex.com/music/2012/11...haking-gifs/24

or if you prefer the pink…
http://www.complex.com/music/2012/11...haking-gifs/11

P.S.
I’m recording (in HD, as that's all we've got these days) the France vs. Itay WCQ today as well as Mexico vs. U.S. I would love to have been able to view those matches in native 4K regardless of *ownership*.

Anyway, regarding the later match, I predict Mexico will totally dominate play but I’m hoping for a less than embarrassing outcome for us USAers.

[pagemaster]

Originally Posted by PeterTHX

Not sure why a speaker layout developed in the late 1970s would sound better, especially since during The Hobbit I was very aware of the speaker locations in IMAX. In Atmos it was seamless and truly 3D.

I have no problem with the lay out of IMAX, the best sound for movies always came from the 70mm prints of the 70s, todays sound is nowhere near the quality of that time. I am talking magnetic vs digital.

What I like about IMAX vs AMTOS is that IMAX is a standardized set up, the same in every location. Atmos can be can configured any which way which I don't really like.

[pro-bassoonist]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

I see, now I think I’m catching your drift. I had thought that you were implying (like before, unless that was some other mod) that future 4K movie offering to home entertainment hobbyists would essentially be like selling copies of the DSM (Digital Source Master)to the consumer, which is what I believe we had already had an exchange about in the past, months ago and I thought I had adequately explained how it was not.

You seem to be confusing my stance on the subject - which wasn't that the studios will not sell 4K content if there is a viable market, but rather that they will be unwilling to sell 4K content matching their masters for pennies. I have not changed my opinion. If 4K hard copies are sold (let's assume it is 4K Blu-ray), I don't believe they will be exact replicas of the studio masters.

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

Bottom line, with your assertion, so, you think that 4K needs Blu-ray as a savior….or at least amongst that subgroup of viewers who place *content ownership* as being of the highest priority.

No. What I wrote is that Red-Ray cannot be 4K's savior. This is different. I think that it would be a terrible mistake if someone decided to push a new physical format for 4K content that isn't backwards compatible with Blu-ray.

Blu-ray is here, it is established, and its portfolio can be adjusted to accommodate 4K content. It is clearly the better option.

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

Your obvious vested interest aside….that is an interesting notion, albeit somewhat of a depressing qualifier given the formation and progress of the BDA task force.

My "vested interest" has been the same for many years, long before Blu-ray came to exist, and long before DVD came to exist - I wish to own hard-copies of the films I like to have in my library. I don't want a second party monitoring what I view, when I can view it, and/or deciding what I should view. It is that simple.

The same goes for music. I prefer CDs, and in very rare occasions vinyl. I don't buy MP3s/downloads. I am from the generation that appreciated the concept behind an album - which covers a number of things, from the coverwork and booklet to the order in which the songs are organized.

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

Anyway, I hope for the non-biased sake of being able to best ‘watch’ content with increased resolution that the BDA ultimately feels the same way you do, and acts accordingly.

I truly hope so. If they don't, Blu-ray with its current resolution limit is the end of the line for me. I am not interested in 4K streaming content, at least as far as films/cinema is concerned. Sports programing is fine.

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

I personally prefer (and always have) optical media along with its packaging and art work just like I cherish the hand written letters my deceased parents had written me, rather than if they had phoned me or sent me those same communications via e-mail < just no soul to that, even though I would *own* those emails.

Anyway, memories and reminiscing aside, let’s be more specific, who are these “familiar players” (other than Sony, RED and Netflix that have already publically announced intentions to develop a 4K distribution platform) which you refer to that are also pursuing a non-optical based ‘4K ecosystem’?

Let's wait and see how things turn out. The months ahead will be quite interesting. You can count on me - when the time is right, I will comment.

Pro-B

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by pro-bassoonist

You seem to be confusing my stance on the subject - which wasn't that the studios will not sell 4K content if there is a viable market, but rather that they will be unwilling to sell 4K content matching their masters for pennies. I have not changed my opinion. If 4K hard copies are sold (let's assume it is 4K Blu-ray), I don't believe they will be exact replicas of the studio masters....

Of course not. I don't know anybody who thinks or would think they are.

Oh lord, do you think Blu-rays(HD) which are sold today are “exact replicas of the studio masters” derived from 2K sources? On the other hand, don’t answer that, I don’t want to encourage further back-and-forth *debate*. I’ll read the rest of your post. You’re right I’m totally “confused” about your stance.