Star Wars: Episode VII - The Force Awakens (USE SPOILER TAGS!)

[Geoff D]

That's an awesome mental image right there.

"By order of the management: No Jedi powers are to be used to get free dances"

[EddieWilson1983]

Originally Posted by CinemaBlu

First of all, the Sith novel isn't canon. Don't quote it.

Lucas assisted Matthew Stover with the plot details he wasn't able to put into the film. As far as I'm concerned, its canon.

Second, Anakin rarely followed the Council's orders. He didn't start blindly following orders until he turned to the dark side. And the Jedi are encouraged to trust their own instincts. That's why the Council allowed Obi Wan to train Anakin despite not believing it was a good idea.

Yoda only allowed Obi-Wan to train Anakin because he respected Qui-Gon, and wished to honor the fallen Master's memory.

And third, the Jedi DID socialize. Remember in "Attack of the Clones" when Obi-Wan meets his "old buddy" at the diner.

I highly doubt Obi-Wan and Dex spent any days just drinking and playing cards. Jettser was a casual friend and ally, nothing more.

How much socializing did the Sith do?

None that we know of, but it fits them better, because creatures of darkness despise the light. If too many of them gathered, their efforts would be stopped...hence the so-called "rule of two".

And the Jedi code encouraged them to be compassionate, meaning, love everybody unconditionally but without attachment. And intimacy isn't forbidden either. George Lucas himself has said that the Jedi aren't celibate.

Intimacy goes beyond the physical, and you can't share the most vulnerable part of yourself with multiple people equally. That's what leads to distrust and jealousy.

Originally Posted by Geoff D

Exactly. The Jedi were so entrenched in their millennia-old dogma that they simply couldn't help Anakin manage his conflicted feelings (much less realise that he'd married in secret), which is what left him open to Palpatine's scheming ways when the old goat told Anakin exactly what he wanted to hear. And the punchline is delivered quite deliberately in ROTJ: it's Luke's unconditional love for his father which is what turns Anakin back to the good side and makes him sacrifice his life to save Luke. After all the bullshit that the Jedi came out with about having no attachments (which includes Yoda in Empire, to some extent), it's love which saves the galaxy in the end. Awwwwwwwwwww.

And thus Anakin fulfils the prophecy of balancing the Force: he destroyed the old ways of the Jedi and the evil ways of the Sith, leaving the path clear for Force users to choose their own destiny.

Precisely; thanks for the support.

[motorheadache95]

I think of the prequel trilogy were really well-written and developed, we would have seen all kinds of great character arcs and themes explored. You can kinda see it buried in the movies, but I thought Lucas didn't do nearly a good enough job thinking the stories or characters through for each film.

I would have actually liked to see the story of Anakin and Obi Wan's friendship as they fight together in the Clone Wars, and seen an actual character-arc as we see a great Jedi Knight betray his loved ones and turn evil. Instead we got the misadventures of Whiny McWhinesalot.

And the idea of Palpatine turning public opinion against the Jedi, creating enough paranoia and fear to convert the Republic into the Empire was a good one, but it isn't fleshed out in the films and really makes no sense at the end when it happens.

Plus I think Bail Organa, the planet Alderaan, and Anakin's "brother" Owen Lars should have bigger roles in all of the films, so you actually care about what they are doing when they do show up in the movies.

[Kaiju]

Is it weird that the one thing I'm most concerned with about this film is if the Disney logo will be featured at the beginning?

[EddieWilson1983]

Originally Posted by Kaiju

Is it weird that the one thing I'm most concerned with about this film is if the Disney logo will be featured at the beginning?

They'll probably put the Lucasfilm logo at the front and the Disney one on the end, like with the Marvel films.

[Walts Ghost]

Originally Posted by Kaiju

Is it weird that the one thing I'm most concerned with about this film is if the Disney logo will be featured at the beginning?

It won't be. It's not featured before the Marvel Studios films. They won't do it here either. It'll just be the Lucasfilm logo.

[Kaiju]

Originally Posted by Walts Ghost

It won't be. It's not featured before the Marvel Studios films. They won't do it here either. It'll just be the Lucasfilm logo.

That's what I was hoping for.

[Revolution 9]

Originally Posted by motorheadache95

You can kinda see it buried in the movies, but I thought Lucas didn't do nearly a good enough job thinking the stories or characters through for each film.

I think it's just the opposite. It feels like Lucas put way too much thought into the prequels, and he had all these big ideas in his head. The problem was when he put them on paper, he neglected to do the little things.

Originally Posted by motorheadache95

I would have actually liked to see the story of Anakin and Obi Wan's friendship as they fight together in the Clone Wars, and seen an actual character-arc as we see a great Jedi Knight betray his loved ones and turn evil. Instead we got the misadventures of Whiny McWhinesalot.

And this is exactly what I was talking about. The friendship between Obi-wan and Anakin was completely overlooked in TPM and AotC. That relationship was obviously important to Lucas, but it was all in his head and never showed up in the scripts. On the script, it was just Anakin & Obiwan bickering all the time. Lucas realized his mistake waaaay too late, and tried to correct it during the first 30 minutes of RotS where you finally see Anakin & Obi-wan behaving like friends for the first time in the entire trilogy.

Originally Posted by motorheadache95

And the idea of Palpatine turning public opinion against the Jedi, creating enough paranoia and fear to convert the Republic into the Empire was a good one, but it isn't fleshed out in the films and really makes no sense at the end when it happens.

There are limitations to what can be put on three 2-hour films. The prequels are far, far more epic in scope than the original trilogy. Hell, the story of the prequels was bigger in scale than the entire Lord of the Rings trilogy, which consisted of three 4-hour films. Again, this goes back to what I was saying: Lucas put waaaay too much thought into the prequels. His ideas were too big, too ambitious, and too grandiose to be crammed into three 2-hour films.

[toddly6666]

Originally Posted by Revolution 9

His ideas were too big, too ambitious, and too grandiose to be crammed into three 2-hour films.

http://redlettermedia.com/plinkett/star-wars/

[Elvis]

Originally Posted by toddly6666

http://redlettermedia.com/plinkett/star-wars/

Truth! Let's just hope that the sequels will flow with the UOT so we can flush the PT like a bad bowl movement and never have to connect those films to it again. It's a shame really TPM had some cool casting, characters and ideas. Would be nice if the special effects are toned way down to bring them more in line with Star Wars and TESB. Back to "real looking" light saber fighting, mostly "humans" in the empire and rebel alliance instead of where he was going in ROTJ. Just say no to things like Jar Jar and Fish face. And above all else (everyone repeat after me) no to lens flares!

[jedilips]

Originally Posted by Kaiju

Is it weird that the one thing I'm most concerned with about this film is if the Disney logo will be featured at the beginning?

It's going to be weird to not have th Fox fanfare there for sure. My hope is that John Williams composes something similar that goes over the Lucasfilm/Bad Robot logos that doesn't seem as jarring.

[PeterTHX]

Originally Posted by toddly6666

http://redlettermedia.com/plinkett/star-wars/

How about using your own thoughts and not a tired retread?

[R3P0]

Originally Posted by Elvis

Truth! Let's just hope that the sequels will flow with the UOT so we can flush the PT like a bad bowl movement and never have to connect those films to it again. It's a shame really TPM had some cool casting, characters and ideas. Would be nice if the special effects are toned way down to bring them more in line with Star Wars and TESB. Back to "real looking" light saber fighting, mostly "humans" in the empire and rebel alliance instead of where he was going in ROTJ. Just say no to things like Jar Jar and Fish face. And above all else (everyone repeat after me) no to lens flares!

The PT trilogy was not that horrible, yes it looked to digital, yes it had some very bad 1 liners, and yes it totally exploited the myth that Vader hunted down the Jedi. But its what Lucas wanted to do, the UOT is still around if you want to watch it and completely ignore the PT.

[toddly6666]

Originally Posted by PeterTHX

How about using your own thoughts and not a tired retread?

The Star Wars prequels are the most epic pieces of crap i've ever seen. They could have had potential with a different director and screenwriter but it's very sad when all the cartoon versions (Clone Wars, etc.) are 100 times better in all aspects - storyline, depth, action, dialogue, even the cartoon acting.

And the special effects/cgi overkill in these films are piss-poor as well - nothing that blends well with real environment or real characters and awkward animated movements - ironic for a company that was famous for bringing special effects to the next level. Even when they do special effects in other films, it is way better because other directors that care about quality will not release an unpolished film. Anyone with any common sense would fix the mistakes during filmmaker/crew screenings before releasing them out into the world. The prequels are like polished workprints where characters are wearing their costumes for the first time and practicing their lines with each other. Rather than taking more takes till perfection, Lucas said, "that's a wrap" after rehearsals.

They certainly arent boring but Batman & Robin and Batman Forever aren't boring as well.

[The Fallen Deity]

The PT is pretty decent and entertaining but it isn't a patch on the OT imo.

Everything was done 1000 times better in the OT imo.

[Darkstream]

Here we go with the prequel bashing again...

Sure, Phantom Menace was pretty darn bad (except for Darth Maul), and Attack of the Clones was just kind of meh, though it had its moments, but when it comes down to it, Revenge of the Sith was not only good, it is actually better than 50% of Return of the Jedi. That's right, I said it! Return of the Jedi is only half-great -- the other half is crap.

What half is crap?

Answer:


I love everything else about Return of the Jedi except them.

[The Fallen Deity]

Originally Posted by Darkstream

Here we go with the prequel bashing again...

Sure, Phantom Menace was pretty darn bad (except for Darth Maul), and Attack of the Clones was just kind of meh, though it had its moments, but when it comes down to it, Revenge of the Sith was not only good, it is actually better than 50% of Return of the Jedi. That's right, I said it! Return of the Jedi is only half-great -- the other half is crap.

What half is crap?

Answer:


I love everything else about Return of the Jedi except them.

Revenge Of The Sith is great.

It's a shame that the other two movies in the PT aren't as good.

A bit of trivia if you didn't know this already:

Return Of The Jedi was originally going to have Wookies instead of Ewoks.

That would've been interesting to see.

[Darkstream]

Originally Posted by The Fallen Deity

Revenge Of The Sith is great.

It's a shame that the other two movies in the PT aren't as good.

A bit of trivia if you didn't know this already:

Return Of The Jedi was originally going to have Wookies instead of Ewoks.

That would've been interesting to see.

We did see that -- sort of -- in Revenge of the Sith with the Battle of Kashyyyk.

[peckinpah]

Originally Posted by The Fallen Deity

Return Of The Jedi was originally going to have Wookies instead of Ewoks.

That would've been interesting to see.

Fight would've been over in about 90 seconds, though.

[srinivas1015]

I hate the first half of ROTJ in Jabba's palace far more than anything in the second half. I do remember being awestruck as a kid when Luke gets his saber from R2 and the music kicks in. The use of a lightsaber in combat was a very special thing before the prequels.