HDR Discussion Thread

[IntelliVolume]

Originally Posted by frogmort

As a newbie with all this, it just seems incredibly daunting and confusing. Why was there not a basic standard for all of this? I should be able to plug this into that, then put in a disc and it should look great, right? No, I have to get several PhD's to make it work right.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

Part of the problem is that manufacturers all want their own special sauce inside their TVs, they all want to do things differently to make their sets stand out from the competition. Unfortunately this extended to the whole "HDR mapping" thing, when someone REALLY should've knocked their heads together and told them that using 101 different approaches for mapping/tracking absolute luminance HDR was going to be such a bad idea for the format.

easier to herd cats

[Waboman]

Originally Posted by frogmort

As a newbie with all this, it just seems incredibly daunting and confusing. Why was there not a basic standard for all of this? I should be able to plug this into that, then put in a disc and it should look great, right? No, I have to get several PhD's to make it work right.

Makes me scared to branch out past good ol' fashioned 1080p.

The Torture Never Stops - YouTube

[Waboman]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

easier to herd cats

Not like going down the pond chasin' bluegills and tommycods.

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by frogmort

As a newbie with all this, it just seems incredibly daunting and confusing. Why was there not a basic standard for all of this? I should be able to plug this into that, then put in a disc and it should look great, right? No, I have to get several PhD's to make it work right.

Makes me scared to branch out past good ol' fashioned 1080p.

It's not really about the PhD thing, the best thing that someone can do when getting into 4K HDR is spend as much as they possibly can on the TV itself. This isn't about willy waving but about trying to attain the best possible tone mapping/HDR tracking.

[DisplayCalNoob]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

Part of the problem is that manufacturers all want their own special sauce inside their TVs, they all want to do things differently to make their sets stand out from the competition. Unfortunately this extended to the whole "HDR mapping" thing, when someone REALLY should've knocked their heads together and told them that using 101 different approaches for mapping/tracking absolute luminance HDR was going to be such a bad idea for the format. "By all means slather your special sauce over the end result if you want, but let's at least get some sort of standardised tone mapping approach in place so these sets can all get the fundamentals correct, and what you do with the nits past that point is up to you. Wait, guys, where are you all going?!?".

Going one further and having customisable mapping/tracking controls as Kris suggested would've been even better, dizzyingly complex for noobs perhaps but as the knowledge base widened then more and more of this information would've gotten out there and people could learn as they go. But as the processing inside all those earlier HDR TVs was in gamma space rather than in native PQ space (something which Stacey Spears has mentioned before) then I'm not surprised they didn't have the kind of granular control over mapping/tracking that they really needed, they were just converting PQ into gamma so that the TV's processing could interpret it with its gamma-based controls, and then converted the adjusted signal back into PQ for output. I mean, even now there are very few TVs that allow this sort of explicit control over the trajectory of the mapping/tracking, though the 2019 LG OLEDs deserve a shout-out for their ability to set those things during calibration.

Now that you mention it, Tyler Pruitt mentioned this about a year or two ago(referencing gamma). Dolby Vision expects a gamma of 2.2, I assume this is true for HDR10 as well or at least it should be.

The special sauce doesn't make sense with a absolute EOTF. I guess old habits die hard. In my opinion HDR10+ is another version of special sauce, from what I've read, it performs better in bright rooms. Its using multiple bezier curves for dynamic tone mapping. Its designed to brighten the APL.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

willy

Steed, Geoff, et al. see the dormant Prem league thread, any comments?
I really liked the show.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

Anime - https://netflixtechblog.com/bringing...e-fa68105067cd

For those unaware as not having investigated ^ the assets -

Last Updated: 2020-04-01

Sol Levante is an experimental short anime project commissioned by Netflix in collaboration with Japan’s Production I.G. that sought to answer questions about the challenges involved with bringing 4K and HDR to the medium. These open source assets were made available from the project in order to allow further experimentation and self-education with anime workflow, 4K, HDR, and immersive audio.

If you have any questions about the materials, you can email creativetech@netflix.com.


The open source assets include:

1000 nit VDM,16 bit TIFF sequence and IMF
Selected painted in-betweens for traditional workflow (TGA)
Selected painted drawings for cutout animation (PSD)
Selected After Effects project with base comp
ProTools session (Final Mix)
ProTools session (Atmos deliverable)
Animatic (MOV) and Storyboard (PDF)
HDR10 asset in ProRes 4444 XQ format

This material is available under the Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial-NoDerivatives 4.0 International license (CC BY-NC-ND 4.0). The full license is included as a separate document.

P.S.
Note as to nomenclature, VDM stands for Video Display Master

[LordoftheRings]

Tom Cruise Reveals ‘Top Gun: Maverick’ HDR Release Delayed Until December 2020

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by LordoftheRings

Tom Cruise Reveals ‘Top Gun: Maverick’ HDR Release Delayed Until December 2020

Yes, and note to Patrick I., recognize the signoff – https://twitter.com/TomCruise?ref_sr...Ctwgr%5Eauthor
Anyway, I’m trying to view the whole thing from a glass half full perspective - https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...4#post17498464

Not to mention, HDR has good potential for leveraging the inherent quality of background snow, be it camera on land or in air - https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...w#post16645928

given the technological basis alluded to, in an aside with regards to sports, back in 2016 –

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

....I wonder if any company will ever produce a skiing competition in 4K HDR as those venues are quite naturally colorful with what the participants and fans wear, as well as there being great inherent contrast between the white snow and blue skies which is routinely constricted by SDR delivery.

[gkolb]

Drum Roll, please. When you read this Saturday morning, this thread will be in excess of 6 Million views. That’s a lot of HDR interest by members and visitors alike. Thanks to all of you, and stay safe. Listen to your mother, Wash Your Hands!

[Penton-Man]

From the uniquely provided for free April issue of American Cinematographer magazine available here -
https://ascmag.com/articles/april-2020-ac-issue

‘……The camera files were recorded in raw, which allowed the completion of an HDR finish, as mandated by Amazon.

“I tried to incorporate a rich, soft quality,” says Vertovec. “[We wanted] these contradictory conceptsof having contrast, but also an overall soft feel. Normally, contrast makes everything seem harsher and sharper. We were trying to ride that line where there’s a lot of contrast, but then there’s also this soft, painterly quality that we were trying to preserve.” Other episodes of Tales From the Loop were shot by cinematographers….’

[LordoftheRings]

Originally Posted by gkolb

Drum Roll, please. When you read this Saturday morning, this thread will be in excess of 6 Million views. That’s a lot of HDR interest by members and visitors alike. Thanks to all of you, and stay safe. Listen to your mother, Wash Your Hands!

Well, if it wouldn't be for HDR top gun Penton-Man this thread would end up in the standard section. So chapeau to Penton, the HDR man!

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by LordoftheRings

Well, if it wouldn't be for HDR top gun Penton-Man this thread would end up in the standard section. So chapeau to Penton, the HDR man!

Perspective, (and no need to say more, just ponder ) is that this viewership milestone pales in comparison to that of the sacrifice of Captain Brett Crozier (and former naval aviator) for others.
Anyway, some trivia - Did You Know, despite obstacles confronting other productions, this remains on schedule - https://www.imdb.com/title/tt8787772/

[Lee A Stewart]

Quantum Dot Display: Entering An Expansion Phase

Quantum Dot Display is an evolving technology that has established itself as a formidable force in 2019 with lower prices, higher product availability and improved performance enabling strong growth in shipments.

This technology is expected to enter an expansion phase in next few years through high capital investments (from Samsung) and technology developments that will enhance other technologies such as LCD, OLED and MicroLED. Finally, it aspires to be a leader by offering the most cost effective, flexible emissive quantum dot display in future. QD technology still has many challenges and faces strong competition from other display technologies.

https://displaydaily.com/article/dis...xpansion-phase

[Penton-Man]

Mon, Apr 6, 2020 11:30 PM - Tue, Apr 7, 2020 12:30 AM PDT -
https://register.gotowebinar.com/reg...40958945543691
^ also in the plans are webinars on HDR fundamentals and studio certification for Dolby Atmos and Dolby Vision Home Entertainment content

[Penton-Man]

A notable transition for – https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...e#post16673062

And, not only with presentations like that ^, but someone who has been an inquiring mind as to ways to improve HDR from the get-go since at least 2015, e.g. see/listen to 24:40 timestamp here - https://tv.theiet.org/?videoid=6846
during the Q&A for the IBC Best Paper that year.

As per the recently updated C.V. - https://www.linkedin.com/in/deklund/ , means Don will have more time to smell the roses and ride the trails beyond Easy Street with friends, albeit social distanced, on up to 4 Corners as pictured here –
https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...e#post13109170

[PaulGo]

Ultimately HDR will become common in live sports events and broadcasting. Given the wide variety of HDR capable sets what may look good on a high end set could look awful on a low end set. How should broadcasters and cable operators handle this? Should they aim at the lowest common denominator or is there another solution?

[Blu Cider]

Just like now where some channels are available in both HD and SD still, 4k channels will probably be available in both SDR and HDR. This will take years before it's implemented though.

[PaulGo]

If your set detects HDR it will be displayed in HDR.