News: displays and their technologies

[Lee A Stewart]

Originally Posted by Noremac Mij

No one serious cares about nits.

Sure they do. That's what HDR is all about and people definitely care about that - well maybe except you.

[Auditor55]

Originally Posted by Noremac Mij

No one serious cares about nits.

So then why is every getting orgasmic about Panasonic's 1,000 nit OLED and future LG OLED with such capabilities?

[oddbox83]

Originally Posted by Auditor55

They're putting coolant in OLED so they can reach a mere 1,000 nits on a 10% window, I don't call that a leap forward.

What has that got to do with what I said about MicroLED? All I said about OLED was I own one.

People are entitled to have an opinion, but you just repeat the same old tired arguments. You say you own 2 as well, I very much doubt you own any TBH! There's something slightly fishy.

Anyway, a shame to see this descend into OLED bashing from the usuals. Any meaningful discussion about the pros and cons of MiniLED is just going to be lost in the same nonsense.

[MechaGodzilla]

I think it's exciting that we seem to be taking a more significant step forward on both the OLED and LCD fronts next year, compared to the baby steps of the last three years.

I must say though, when talking mini-LED backlight specifically, it's a shame that it seems like it's mainly Samsung and LG that will go all in on that tech next year. I'd like to see Sony adopt it for their higher-end LCDs, too!

[Noremac Mij]

Originally Posted by oddbox83

What has that got to do with what I said about MicroLED? All I said about OLED was I own one.

People are entitled to have an opinion, but you just repeat the same old tired arguments. You say you own 2 as well, I very much doubt you own any TBH! There's something slightly fishy.

Anyway, a shame to see this descend into OLED bashing from the usuals. Any meaningful discussion about the pros and cons of MiniLED is just going to be lost in the same nonsense.

He doesn’t own one. Neither did he own a ZD9. But it’s fun watching him spew nonsense.

[Lee A Stewart]

The reason why the industry is going towards MicroLED for displays, other than all the points listed in the posts above, is the yield rate. It is very high. It's just currently very expensive. That will drop over time with new tech manufacturing processes and economies of scale kick in.

To this day, only a single company manufacturers OLED panels: LG

[Noremac Mij]

Originally Posted by Lee A Stewart

The reason why the industry is going towards MicroLED for displays, other than all the points listed in the posts above, is the yield rate. It is very high. It's just currently very expensive. That will drop over time with new tech manufacturing processes and economies of scale kick in.

To this day, only a single company manufacturers OLED panels: LG

I couldn’t care less even if I tried about their yield rate. All I care about is the final product. You can get a state of the art OLED for under $1500 all day everyday. At this kind of bargain price it doesn’t matter to me if they have to produce 100 defective panels for every working one.

[Lee A Stewart]

Originally Posted by Noremac Mij

I couldn’t care less even if I tried about their yield rate. All I care about is the final product. You can get a state of the art OLED for under $1500 all day everyday. At this kind of bargain price it doesn’t matter to me if they have to produce 100 defective panels for every working one.

$1500 is NOT a bargain price to anyone other than a videophile of which their market is less than 2% of the entire worldwide TV market.

That's why companies buy their panels from LG instead of developing their own.

[JohnAV]

Originally Posted by Lee A Stewart

$1500 is NOT a bargain price to anyone other than a videophile of which their market is less than 2% of the entire worldwide TV market.

That's why companies buy their panels from LG instead of developing their own.

So you don't spend any money entertaining your family, it all goes to life on the computer.

[wxman2003]

Originally Posted by Lee A Stewart

The reason why the industry is going towards MicroLED for displays, other than all the points listed in the posts above, is the yield rate. It is very high. It's just currently very expensive. That will drop over time with new tech manufacturing processes and economies of scale kick in.

To this day, only a single company manufacturers OLED panels: LG

It still will not ever become mainstream, just like your argument with OLED. Most people won't pay $1500 for a micro-led tv, if they can buy a cheap $500 LED tv instead. Just like you stated about OLED, it won't ever get above 2% of the market share.

[Lee A Stewart]

Originally Posted by wxman2003

It still will not ever become mainstream, just like your argument with OLED. Most people won't pay $1500 for a micro-led tv, if they can buy a cheap $500 LED tv instead. Just like you stated about OLED, it won't ever get above 2% of the market share.

That remains to be seen. OLED's high prices are directly tied to it's poor yield rate. MicroLED will not have to deal with that.

Look at how big the Plasma TV market was before LCD put it in the graveyard. The reason: cost. Simple as that.

[Lee A Stewart]

Originally Posted by JohnAV

So you don't spend any money entertaining your family, it all goes to life on the computer.

That makes absolutely no sense.

[wxman2003]

Originally Posted by Lee A Stewart

That remains to be seen. OLED's high prices are directly tied to it's poor yield rate. MicroLED will not have to deal with that.

Look at how big the Plasma TV market was before LCD put it in the graveyard. The reason: cost. Simple as that.

It is extremely difficult for them to make MicroLED tv's. Yield rates are not that high.
Section 5 gives a good description of what the issues are. The link gives you a pdf file of a research article. Very indepth.
Also, with manufacturers pushing 8K tv's., it will become more difficult to produce 8K micro led tv's just because they have to pack them more closely together than 4K. By the time micro led becomes reasonably priced, equivalent to OLED, 4K will be dead, and all that will be sold will be 8K tv's.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=...pDFvgpNUoNBLFd

[Lee A Stewart]

Originally Posted by wxman2003

It is extremely difficult for them to make MicroLED tv's. Yield rates are not that high.
Section 5 gives a good description of what the issues are. The link gives you a pdf file of a research article. Very indepth

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=...pDFvgpNUoNBLFd

That PDF is almost 2 years old (Feb. 2019)!

December 10, 2020:

Full-Color Realization of Micro-LED Displays



https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7764662/

[wxman2003]

Originally Posted by Lee A Stewart

That PDF is almost 2 years old (Feb. 2019)!

December 10, 2020:

Full-Color Realization of Micro-LED Displays



https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7764662/

I highly doubt contrast ratio is only 10,000:1 with OLED, unless they are basing contrast on something else.

[Lee A Stewart]

Originally Posted by wxman2003

I highly doubt contrast ratio is only 10,000:1 with OLED, unless they are basing contrast on something else.

Try reading what I posted. It's all there. The latest information all about MicroLED.

[wxman2003]

Originally Posted by Lee A Stewart

Try reading what I posted. It's all there. The latest information all about MicroLED.

I did, and it still doesn't say how it determined the contrast numbers. It just showed a table from the NTSC.

2nd, the current yield rate is still not "high". Maybe in the future, but not at this moment because there are a lot of ifs that must occur. There is no doubt that micro led is the future, just not in the next 5 to 10 years for the average Joe Consumer that buys $500 tvs at Wal Mart, which as you have said make up the bulk of sales.

" However, despite such excellent performance, micro-LED display face many difficulties in their commercial mass production. The two main technical problems of this technology are the mass transfer of LED chips [18] and the production of a full-color display [19]. For inorganic LEDs, the size of the grown wafer is limited, usually to 4 inches or 8 inches [20]. Therefore, to realize a large-area micro-LED display, it is necessary to transfer the LED array grown on the wafer to a circuit substrate that can drive it to illuminate. This process requires the support of mass transfer technology. The mass transfer technologies applied to micro-LEDs mainly include pick and place technology, self-assembly technology, and selective release and transfer technology, each of which has its own advantages and limitations; moreover, the accuracy and yield have a great influence on the performance of the display. A 4K full-color TV includes (3840 × 2160 × 3) pixels. If the mass transfer technology used can guarantee a 99.99% yield, 2488 pixels may still be damaged. This will undoubtedly increase the difficulty and cost of later maintenance. Therefore, the yield and cost of the massive transfer limit the development of micro-LED technology to a certain extent."

[Lee A Stewart]

Originally Posted by wxman2003

I did, and it still doesn't say how it determined the contrast numbers. It just showed a table from the NTSC.

The NTSC notation is just the wording for the NTSC abbreviation used for measuring the Color Rendering.

How high do you believe the contrast ratio is on an OLED and what is the measuring "yardstick" you are using to determine it?

2nd, the current yield rate is still not "high". Maybe in the future, but not at this moment because there are a lot of ifs that must occur. There is no doubt that micro led is the future, just not in the next 5 to 10 years for the average Joe Consumer that buys $500 tvs at Wal Mart, which as you have said make up the bulk of sales.

I strongly doubt MicroLED will ever be a $500 TV just like OLED won't be. But more companies are looking into manufacturing MicroLED. It's the uniqueness of the technology - tiles - as opposed to a single glass substrate.

LCD will be with us for a long long time.

[Scottishguy]

Originally Posted by Lee A Stewart

The NTSC notation is just the wording for the NTSC abbreviation used for measuring the Color Rendering.

How high do you believe the contrast ratio is on an OLED and what is the measuring "yardstick" you are using to determine it?



I strongly doubt MicroLED will ever be a $500 TV just like OLED won't be. But more companies are looking into manufacturing MicroLED. It's the uniqueness of the technology - tiles - as opposed to a single glass substrate.

LCD will be with us for a long long time.

Sure will. The industry has spent year's riding the LCD gravy train, focusing more on things they can market like resolution over more meaningful but less marketable screen improvements. Essentially forcing a large chunk of enthusiasts to post CRT roll the dice with self self emissive tec to get the quality they crave.

But now the industry is being forced to innovate like they've never had before. It will pay off in the end, but we are talking 8 to 10 year's.

I thought it might be sooner, but nope.

[Auditor55]

Originally Posted by Noremac Mij

He doesn’t own one. Neither did he own a ZD9. But it’s fun watching him spew nonsense.

Sir Noremac.

I owned the Z9D. I now own a 65 inch LG C8 and a Sony 55 inch A8H OLED. I have no reason to lie. I've been in this hobby for a long time, video enthusiasts have always been on a quest for video perfection, so we must continue to have companies push the envelope. If I just sat back like some of you and get all prideful about certain display technology because I purchased it, the industry will sit back to. People complained about OLED and nits and now higher nit OLEDs are coming to the market. Some people complain about, banding, tinting with OLED, that's not my complaint. I've complained about black crush and now LG and others are trying to address those issues.