3D/2D Displays that support 3D & 2D & 24p at multiplies of the original frame rate

[HDTV1080P]

Higher native frame rates from 48-120fps offer more realistic movie experience

Around 99% of all movies on film and Digital Cinema have been shot at a native 24fps for 2-D and native 48fps for 3-D. The reason why 24fps has been used for the majority of 2-D movies for almost a century is because its more economical compared to 30fps,48fps, 60fps, 72fps, and 120fps (Different frame rates then 24fps has only occurred for some films between 1890-2013+). In a movie theater with a single light source projector, native 24fps movies are flashed on the screen at 48fps or 72fps to eliminate the unwatchable flicker of 24fps. Same thing with native 48fps 3-D movies the single light source projector will triple flash the image on the screen at 144fps (72fps for each eye) in order to eliminate flicker problems.

In dual light source projector technology like Digital IMAX or Sony 4K SXRD RealD system, native 24fps 2-D movies are shown on the screen at 24fps with no flicker issues since continuous display technology is used. Also native 48fps 3-D movies are shown on the screen at 48fps (24fps for each eye).

The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey movie was shot on RED EPIC 4K Digital Cameras in 3-D at 96fps (48fps for each eye). The 2-D version of the Hobbit was shot at 48fps. The higher the native frame rate of a movie results in less flicker and a better overall realistic quality. For several decades some movies have been shot at high frame rates like 30fps, 48fps, 72fps, and 120fps in order to increase the overall quality of the 2-D movie experience. Oklahoma! (1955) and Around the World in 80 days (1956) were shot at both 24fps and 30fps on 70mm film according to the article. The Widescreen Review article goes on to give examples of when native film shot at 48fps,60fps,72fps,96fps, and 120fps has occurred for special 2-D 65mm/70mm IMAX events or demo’s. The higher the native frame rate audiences feel the movie is more like real life, since minor flicker and judder issues disappear. If the bandwidth were available one day, maybe in the far future native 20,000fps or 100,000fps would become a reality. In the near future for some high budget 2-D movies the native frame rate will most likely be somewhere between 48fps-120fps. For movies like the Avatar 3-D sequel 120fps (60fps each eye) or 96fps (48fps each eye) might be used.

Hopefully a future 4K optical consumer format might be able to handle multiply frame rates up to 120fps.

The Blu-ray format can only offer 1080P at 24fps for 2-D movies and 48fps for 3-D frame packed movies .

Click the following link for a diagram on how the ideal consumer single light source 3-D Front Projector or 3-D display should work when unpacking the frame packed 1920 X 2205 Blu-ray movie image.

http://cepro.com/images/uploads/frame_packed_3d_large.jpg

The following is a select word for word quote from page 34 of the April/May 2013 Widesreen review magazine (total article is 4 pages in length)

“The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey gives audiences their first opportunity to see a film (actually shot on RED EPIC 4K Ultra High Definition Cameras) that is intended to be viewed at 48 frames per second (fps), which is TWICE the normal rate of 24 fps, and in 3D (48 fps) for each eye = 96 total fps). Their first opportunity, that is, since the “High Frame Rate Wars” of the 1890s!”

Click Here To View A Sample Of This Issue

The above link may stop working after a month or so.

[HDTV1080P]

No 2013 Elite TVs Coming From Sharp

The following are word for word quotes from the article:

“Sharp Electronics recently notified specialty A/V dealers handling the jointly administered Sharp/Pioneer Elite TV line that it will not be offering any new models under the premium brand this year.”

“He added the company has sold through inventory on models from the prior year.”

““Due to the unavailability of a component, current 60- and 70-inch Elite LED TVs (model numbers PRO60X5FD and PRO70X5FD, respectively) have been discontinued and are no longer available,” Sharp confirmed in a statement Monday.”

“Sharp-made Elite TVs offered some of the deepest black levels and highest contrast ratios yet seen from LCD technology.”

“In shootouts, the screens had rivaled even advanced plasma sets, including Pioneer’s discontinued Kuro models that some still rank as the benchmark by which flat-panel TV picture performance is judged.”

No 2013 Elite TVs Coming From Sharp

[HDTV1080P]

The 9th generation 2008 model Pioneer Kuro plasma displays are still the best

The following are select word for word quotes from the shootout:

“Also on hand was a last generation Pioneer Kuro monitor, the TV that has been off the market for three years but remains the standard by which most experts (including us at Home Theater) still measure all others”

“Although the sets looked relatively close on some fast-moving program material that mixed bright highlights with black backgrounds, it became very obvious on most moving content and any static graphics that the Kuro still had noticeably deeper blacks than either of the two contenders.”

“From that alone, it was clear we still have a ways to go to get a plasma that's equal to the Kuro, at least on black levels.”

Value Electronics HDTV Shootout: And Then There Were Three...

[HDTV1080P]

Panasonic S60 series 2-D plasma TV (CNET review link):

** 48Hz mode flickers too much **

No 72Hz or 96Hz 2-D mode

What is disappointing is that several professional reviews over several years have mentioned several times that the 48Hz setting on the Panasonic plasma displays are either unwatchable or have a ignoring flicker issue. These are reviews from magazines like Sound and Vision, Home Theater magazine, and Widescreen review magazine (Also CNET). This issue has been going on for a little over 5 years now with Panasonic and the 48Hz setting and it appears that Panasonic does not have any plans to offer 72Hz plasmas for their entire line like LG started doing in 2011.

The entire line of 2011-2013 LG plasma screens offer Real Cinema 3:3 pulldown at 72Hz for 1080p/24 2-D material. Panasonic should offer a 72Hz or 96Hz setting for their entire line of plasmas (bright scenes sometimes has flicker at 96Hz according to a CNET Panasonic review).

The majority of consumers do not own a Blu-ray player yet and the consumers that do have a Blu-ray player just leave their Panasonic plasmas set at the factory default 60Hz setting with 3:2 pulldown issues. As more and more consumers purchase Blu-ray players and become familiar with how to properly display 1080p/24 signals at multiplies of the original frame rate then they will want to use features like 48Hz, 72Hz, and 96Hz that is found on many consumer displays.

The following is a word for word quote from the CNET review on the Panasonic S60 series

“I tried the 48Hz mode but as usual it flickered too much for me to tolerate. Since those are the only two modes available, you have to choose between choppy motion and flicker.”

(CNET review link)

[HDTV1080P]

Panasonic ST60 series 3-D plasma TV (CNET review link):

96Hz mode better handles 1080p/24 with slight flicker on some bright scenes

3-D has flicker when 120Hz (60Hz each eye) mode is switched to 96Hz (48Hz each eye) mode

No Cinema quality 144Hz or 192Hz 3-D mode

“48Hz, as usual, created unbearable flicker”

This year in a positive move Panasonic has added the 96Hz mode for 2-D viewing of 1080P/24 material to the 2013 ST60 series plasmas. However for some reason a slight flicker is still seen at the 96Hz mode. I still do not understand why Panasonic still offers the 48Hz mode that creates an unbearable flicker according to CNET. Also new this year is the 100Hz mode for 3-D. Prior Panasonic 3-D plasmas also had the 120Hz mode (60Hz each eye) and the 96Hz mode (48Hz each eye), however they were labeled as 60Hz and 48Hz. In a positive move from Panasonic the 3-D menu correctly labels the total 3-D refresh rate as 120Hz and 96Hz (This is a more accurate way to label the 3-D modes).

All 3-D plasmas from LG, Samsung, and Panasonic use 100% active shutter glasses at the full 1080P resolution. Hopefully in the future one of those manufactories will make a 144fps plasma to match the Cinema 3-D frame rate.

The ideal Panasonic plasma model in the futurre should offer both flicker free viewing in both 2-D and 3-D viewing without 3-2 pulldown. Panasonic should drop 48Hz in all plasmas and if they cannot correct the flicker issue with 96Hz then they should drop the 96Hz setting also. The ideal plasma display should have Digital Cinema triple flash technology where 2-D 24fps material is displayed at 72Hz and 3-D frame packed material is displayed at 144HZ (72Hz each eye).

The following are select word for word quotes from the CNET review on the Panasonic ST60 series

“Worse 3D quality compared with many competing TVs…”

“Unlike last year, the ST60 and all higher-end plasmas have 96Hz modes as well as 48Hz (see below).”

“I did detect slight flicker in 96Hz in bright areas, for example the clouds over Brooklyn in "I Am Legend" (24:49).”

“I did notice some artifacts from 1080p/24 sources in 60Hz mode. On the "Digital Video Essentials" test Blu-ray, we noticed shifting lines and minor instability in the downtown Philadelphia buildings during an upward-facing pan. I didn't see any similar issues during other program material, but assume they might crop up. In any case, I still prefer the flicker-free 60Hz mode, but it's great to have a choice between 96Hz and 60Hz this year (48Hz, as usual, created unbearable flicker).”

“…the 3D performance of the ST60 is somewhat disappointing compared to its 2D prowess.”

“New for this year Panasonic has added three "Hz" values (96Hz, 100Hz and 120Hz) under "3D refresh rate" in its 3D menu. Although described as designed to combat flicker from fluorescent lights, they also have a major impact on the prevalence of crosstalk. That bugaboo of 3D TVs, especially those that use active 3D technology, appears as a ghostly double-image around many onscreen objects.”

“Choosing the 100Hz setting worsened crosstalk considerably, and the 120Hz setting was worst of all. This adjustment didn't seem to do anything else to picture quality, and I didn't test its effects on fluorescent light flicker.”

(CNET review link)

[HDTV1080P]

Panasonic VT60 series 3-D plasma TV (CNET review link):

96Hz mode better handles 1080p/24

No Cinema quality 144Hz or 192Hz 3-D mode

“…48Hz displayed both flicker and more judder.”

The only flicker mentioned in the Panasonic VT60 series CNET review was at the 48Hz setting. Its possible the 96Hz 2-D setting and 120Hz 3-D setting might be flicker free or close to flicker free. 120Hz (60Hz for each eye) still has 3:2 pulldown issues. Since there is no 144Hz mode or 192Hz mode for 3-D frame packed Blu-ray movies offered on the VT60, the VT60 series will not be added to the list (currently only Front Projectors are on the Digital Cinema 3-D list and no flat panel screens qualify yet).

The following are select word for word quotes from the CNET review on the Panasonic VT60 series

“The TV was able to smoothly render our test scene consisting of the Intrepid fly-by from "I Am Legend" without judder or breakup of the diagonal lines of flags when set to 96Hz. Choosing 60Hz for the 24p mode resulted in more judder during this scene while 48Hz displayed both flicker and more judder.”

“Compared with the ST60, the VT60 is a far superior performer when it comes to 3D, especially in quick movement.”

(CNET review link)

[HDTV1080P]

Panasonic ZT60 series 3-D plasma TV (CNET review link):

** The Panasonic ZT60 series is now the new reference 2-D flat panel display at CNET **

96Hz is essentially free of flicker

No Cinema quality 144Hz or 192Hz 3-D mode

CNET has made the decision to make the 2013 Panasonic TC-PZT60 TV series the new reference flat panel display in terms of picture quality (A new OLED model in 6 months or a year from now will most likely be made the new reference display in theory). What that means is that the 2008 Pioneer PRO-111FD overall does not have as good of picture quality when compared to the Panasonic ZT60 plasma series. However, keep in mind that the 2008 Pioneer Elite Signature series PRO-141FD 60 inch and PRO-101FD 50 inch offer an overall better picture quality when compared to the 2008 standard Pioneer Elite PRO-111FD. Also Home Theater magazine and others still rate the Pioneer Elite Signature series like the PRO-141FD as the reference display to compare all other flat panel displays to when it comes to 2-D picture quality. The Value Electronics Shootout and Home Theater magazine clearly mentioned that the Pioneer Kuro had deeper black levels and was the reference display when compared to the Panasonic ZT60 series. I look forward to Home Theater magazine review that should in theory place the 2008 Pioneer PRO-141FD up against the 2013 Panasonic ZT60 series to see which display is the best for overall 2-D picture quality. It’s amazing that a 5 year old Pioneer display has the same black level after several thousands of hours of use, since the build quality in the Pioneers are excellent. Panasonic in the past had problems with some plasma displays black levels fading after a short period of time. Only time will tell if the top of the line 2013 Panasonic ZT60 series has fixed the fading black level issue.

The Panasonic ZT60 series is at least 50% cheaper compared to the Pioneer Elite Signature series. For example the 60 inch 2008 Pioneer Elite PRO-141FD list price is $7,000 + $400 for the required table top stand. The 60 inch 2013 Panasonic TC-P60ZT60 list price is only $3,499.99 with the table top stand. The 65 inch 2013 Panasonic TC-P65ZT60 list price is only $4,099.99. However, it is disappointing that no flat panel display on the market offers a Cinema quality 144Hz refresh rate for 3-D frame packed Blu-ray movies.If Panasonic offers a ZT plasma series in 2014, hopefully it will have a 144Hz or 192Hz setting for 3-D. A 4K QUAD HD 144Hz plasma would also be ideal for 3-D sometime in the future, since full 1080P passive glasses technology could be used when watching 3-D movies.

New this year is the 100Hz mode for 3-D. Prior Panasonic 3-D plasmas also had the 120Hz mode (60Hz each eye) and the 96Hz mode (48Hz each eye), however they were labeled as 60Hz and 48Hz. In a positive move from Panasonic the 3-D menu correctly labels the total 3-D refresh rate as 120Hz and 96Hz (This is a more accurate way to label the 3-D modes). In the movie theater 144fps triple flash is always used when showing 3-D movies from a single light source projector since research has shown that 50% of the population sees flicker at 96fps (48fps each eye) and 120fps (60fps each eye) is not used in the movie theaters because of the 3:2 pulldown judder issues.

The following are select word for word quotes from the CNET review on the Panasonic ZT60 series

“Video processing: The ZT60 handles 1080p/24 film cadence correctly, as expected, but only when you engage its 96Hz mode. In 60Hz mode the set engages the characteristic 3:2 pull-down cadence, which introduces a slight halting stutter compared with the smoother (but not too smooth) motion of correct 24p cadence. That's a marked difference from the ST60, which handles 1080p/24 well in both 60Hz and 96Hz, but I prefer using 60Hz because 96Hz flickers on that TV. On the ZT60 and VT60, conversely, 96Hz is essentially free of flicker, so that's the mode I'd recommend anyone use on this TV with 1080p/24 sources like many Blu-ray movies.”

“According to my measurements, the Kuro and the Elite actually have deeper black levels than the Panasonics, which in turn actually tied the measurement of the F8500. Regardless of those numbers, measured on a black screen, to my eye in a dark room the two 2013 Panasonics looked darkest, particularly in exceedingly dark shots like the night-enshrouded Hogwarts at 46:27.”

(CNET review link)

[HDTV1080P]

100% of all 2011-2013 LG plasma screens offer 72Hz refresh rate for 2-D 1080p/24 source material

In 2013 LG has greatly reduced the amount of plasma screens that they offer compared to 2012.Currently at this time there is only 6 LG plasma screens listed on the LG website.

Starting in 2011 LG started offering the 72Hz Real Cinema 24p (3:3 pull down) mode on all their plasma screens including the low end 768P models. All the 2011-2013 1080P LG plasma models also offer the 72Hz mode when watching 2-D 1080p/24 material.

The select few LG plasma models that do offer the 3-D feature, all use the active shutter glass technology at full 1080P quality. However, what is disappointing about the LG 3-D plasma models is that none of them offer the 144Hz (72Hz for each eye) mode when a consumer watches a 3-D movie. Currently all LG plasma screens are using 120Hz (60Hz for each eye) with 3:2 pulldown when consumers watch a frame packed Blu-ray. Perhaps in 2014+, maybe LG might offer 3-D plasma screens using the 144Hz Cinema quality triple flash technology.

[HDTV1080P]

The discontinued 5 year old 2008 Pioneer Kuro models in another year most likely will not be used as reference displays anymore (in theory)

The following shootout link did not use a Pioneer Elite Signature series like the PRO-141FD or PRO-101FD, and instead a non Elite standard Pioneer KRP-500M plasma was used. When it comes to black levels the edge still goes to the Pioneer, however the next generation 2014 Panasonic ZT series or the first generation OLED display will most likely become the new reference display to compare all other flat panel displays (OLED in theory will be the new King when and if it arrives).

To be honest I am in shock that the 5 year old 2008 Pioneer plasma models that went out of production in April of 2009 are still being used as reference displays. It’s amazing that Pioneer plasmas are so good of quality that they are still used as reference displays. The Pioneer engineers should have received a special reward for their hard work.

QUOTE

“As is tradition at the Flat Panel Shootouts, the team brought out a "mystery contender" to challenge this year's top performers. This was Robert's personal Pioneer Kuro plasma (KRP-500M), one of the last to roll off Pioneer's assembly lines before they abandoned the TV business a few years ago. To many, the Kuro represents the ultimate in picture quality, even to this day. In my opnion, the black levels between the Panasonic sets and the Pioneer in a darkened room were almost too close to call with perhaps a slight edge still going to the Kuro. But in other areas of performance (moving picture resolution, for example), the Panasonic and Samsung sets had the edge. Is the Kuro still an excellent set, even by comparison to day's best? For sure. But the Panasonic and Samsung plasmas definitely held their own against it.”

http://www.bigpicturebigsound.com/Samsung-Panasonic-Plasma-TVs-Trounce-the-LED-Competition-Again-at-Flat-Panel-Shootout-2013.shtml

[Solo man]

Originally Posted by HDTV1080P

The discontinued 5 year old 2008 Pioneer Kuro models in another year most likely will not be used as reference displays anymore (in theory)

The following shootout link did not use a Pioneer Elite Signature series like the PRO-141FD or PRO-101FD, and instead a non Elite standard Pioneer KRP-500M plasma was used. When it comes to black levels the edge still goes to the Pioneer, however the next generation 2014 Panasonic ZT series or the first generation OLED display will most likely become the new reference display to compare all other flat panel displays (OLED in theory will be the new King when and if it arrives).

To be honest I am in shock that the 5 year old 2008 Pioneer plasma models that went out of production in April of 2009 are still being used as reference displays. It’s amazing that Pioneer plasmas are so good of quality that they are still used as reference displays. The Pioneer engineers should have received a special reward for their hard work.

QUOTE

“As is tradition at the Flat Panel Shootouts, the team brought out a "mystery contender" to challenge this year's top performers. This was Robert's personal Pioneer Kuro plasma (KRP-500M), one of the last to roll off Pioneer's assembly lines before they abandoned the TV business a few years ago. To many, the Kuro represents the ultimate in picture quality, even to this day. In my opnion, the black levels between the Panasonic sets and the Pioneer in a darkened room were almost too close to call with perhaps a slight edge still going to the Kuro. But in other areas of performance (moving picture resolution, for example), the Panasonic and Samsung sets had the edge. Is the Kuro still an excellent set, even by comparison to day's best? For sure. But the Panasonic and Samsung plasmas definitely held their own against it.”

http://www.bigpicturebigsound.com/Samsung-Panasonic-Plasma-TVs-Trounce-the-LED-Competition-Again-at-Flat-Panel-Shootout-2013.shtml

Thanks for the link, that was an interesting article for me. I found the LED comparison very interesting as they used words like the plasma trouncing led competition. How the plasma sets were beaten by a fairly wide margin.

I have had my plasma for about 5 years and love the plasma technology. It's also nice to see Samsung coming out with a really nice tv. After, reading so much about the ZT60, I will admit that I was expecting a much better result.

[HDTV1080P]

The ideal optical disc format should offer up to native 8K quality video and native frame rates up to 120fps

It would be ideal if the next generation consumer optical disc format offered lossless video quality with 2TB dual layer capacity (1TB per layer). Then with a lossless video codec that uses a secure 256 bit AES encryption, both 8K and 4K video could be supported with up to 10.2 channels of lossless audio. The over the air broadcast TV ATSC 3.0 standard is going to support up to 8K quality video (according to the current ATSC 3.0 PDF specs which are not finalized yet). That means that if a 4K optical disc format were to launch in 2016+, in about 4+ years later some TV stations might start offering TV programs and movies in native 8K quality. So hopefully what every new optical disc formats appear in the future, it would be ideal if it had the option to support both 8K quality video with native frame rates up to 120fps.

Support for 8K 8192 x 4320 resolution would be ideal for the optical disc format specs instead of limiting the resolution to the 8K home format to 7680 x 4320. Also another issue is it would be ideal to have native 4096 X 2160 as the 4K specs instead of limiting the resolution of QUAD HD displays and optical discs to 3,840 X 2,160. Years ago instead of consumers getting true 2K resolution, instead consumers ended up with 1080P as the optical disc and TV standard. The 2K standard is 2048 X 1080 however for consumers the lower quality 1920 X 1080 resolution was launched. One of the reasons the consumer electronics industry is offering QUAD HD 3840 X 2160 instead of true 4K 4096 X 2160 in the majority of new high resolution displays is because upsclaing 1080P material to 3840 X 2160 is cheaper and easier to upscale when compared to upscaling the material to 4096 X 2160. However, some believe the real reason consumers have QUAD HD and 1080P instead of true 4K and 2K is because the industry wants to keep the best quality only available in the Cinema. The chipsets for existing 1080P displays can cheaply upscale odd resolution formats like 480i, 480P, and 720P to 1080P.

Also when it comes to 8K resolution the official 8K Digital Cinema resolution is 8192 X 4320, however the consumer 8K Ultra high definition format is only 7680 x 4320.

In reality any new optical disc formats are most likely only going to support QUAD HD instead of true 4K. If consumers do also get 8K quality supported video over an optical format then it most likely will be the 7680 x 4320 consumer format instead of the Cinema quality 8K 8192 x 4320 format.

Cinema projection

• 2K Digital Cinema (2048 × 1080)
• 4K Digital Cinema (4096 × 2160)
• 8K Digital Cinema (8192 × 4320)

Home high-resolution standards

1080p (1920 × 1080 progressive scan)
QUAD HD (3840 × 2160 progressive scan)
8K home (7680 × 4320 progressive scan)
8640p (15360 × 8640 progressive scan)

[HDTV1080P]

Ultra HD broadcasts demand higher frame rates

The first generation QUAD HD displays only support native 3840 X 2160 resolutions at 24Hz, 25Hz, and 30Hz since that is the limitation of HDMI 1.4, 1.4A, and 1.4B. Hopefully in the future HDMI 1.5 might offer support for QUAD HD sources with support for native frame rates up to 120Hz (or at least up to 60Hz).

Higher native frame rates become much more important with native 8K and 4K source material.

The following are select word for word quotes from article: Ultra HD broadcasts demand higher frame rates

“Speaking with 3D Focus, Andy Quested, Chief Technologist HD & 3D at BBC Technology, said that the Ultra HDTV formats (4K and 8K) will require the use of much higher frame rates than the commonly used 24/25fps (for feature films) or 50/60fps (for television broadcast), in order to avoid “image smearing.”

““Frame rates of 24/25 will always exist but will require much more attention to the rules of 35mm movie shooting,” Quested said. “At 50/60 [fps] though, the increased temporal resolution accentuates the smearing caused by movement when the shutter is open, but make the shutter too short, and the low frame rate causes multiple images during some motion (look at what looks like a multi-arm bowler in short shutter cricket). At somewhere around 100+ fps, your eyes cease to see separate images even during high movement with short shutter.”

“There is standards work being completed in the UK to address the issue: the ITU-R BT2020 has two UHD formats at 7 680 x 4 320 and 3 840 x 2 160 (16:9) at 24/1.001, 24, 25, 30/1.001, 50, 60/1.001, 60 and 120 progressive frame a second. The International Television Union has put together a technical paper asking the general production community to explore whether 120fps would work as a viable worldwide standard.”

““There are thoughts it needs to be higher or there needs to be 50Hz multiples of either 100 or 150fps,” Quested said. “Tests are under way, and results may take a while to resolve into standards.”

Ultra HD broadcasts demand higher frame rates

[HDTV1080P]

Sony KDL-55W900A 3D LCD HDTV

(Home Theater magazine review link)

** 3-D Flicker issue **

The Sony KDL-55W900A will not be added to the list since it appears that just like all other Sony displays, 3:2 pulldown is used for each eye when the HDTV is in 3D mode. The Home Theater magazine review by Thomas J. Norton mentions that Sony claims that the KDL-55W900A will not use 3:2 pulldown when playing native 3D material. However when Thomas J. Norton reviewed the KDL-55W900A while in 3D mode he noticed a 3-D flicker issue that made him question the set’s claimed nonuse of 3:2 pulldown and high refresh rate.

In the United States to my knowledge all the theaters use passive glasses. In many areas of the world the Xpand active shutter glass technology is used in theaters at 144fps. At 144fps active glasses are flicker free without ghosting and a greatly reduced dizzy effect. When a flat panel HDTV or projector is watched in a completely dark room with no lights and no LED clock lights, flicker free 3-D performance with active glasses can occur as long as the 3-D display is unpacking the frame packed Blu-ray at 48Hz and then triple flashing it at 144Hz or QUAD flashing the image at 192Hz. For example all 240Hz LCD flat panel displays on the market so far insert black frames between real frames so the effective total output is really 120Hz in 3-D mode (60Hz for each eye). The ideal flat screen display should offer triple flash technology at 144fps or quad flash technology at 192fps with no black frame insertion.

The following are select word for word quotes from the Home Theater magazine review

“The only nuisance was 3D flicker. It was clearly visible on scenes with an expanse of bright white or color and made me question, at least for 3D, the set’s claimed high refresh rate and nonuse of 3:2 pulldown.”

“For those more sensitive to it, the flicker could be eliminated by turning the set’s Motionflow control to Standard, which didn’t do serious damage to a movie’s film look.”

“Sony’s motion-smoothing features are Motionflow and Smooth Gradation. In most settings, they incorporate frame interpolation. While some settings of these controls are less bothersome than others, I continue to find that frame interpolation kills the film-look of movies and left both of these controls off for all of my viewing.”

** Click here to read the complete Home Theater magazine review **

[HDTV1080P]

Panasonic ST60 series 3-D plasma TV (Sound and Vision magazine review):

96Hz mode better handles 1080p/24

No Cinema quality 144Hz or 192Hz 3-D mode

Located on pages 32-34 of the July-August 2013 Sound and Vision magazine, there is a review on the Panasonic TC-P60ST60. In the review they mention that the Panasonic ST60 series has “…the same not-very-useful 48-Hz display mode found on many previous Panasonic plasmas…” What they did not mention is why the 48Hz mode on the ST60 is not very useful. When Sound and Vision magazine reviewed the 2012 Panasonic ST50 series plasma back on June 5th 2012 they said the following about the 48Hz setting ”fairly serious level of image flicker generated by the 48-Hz setting makes it all but unusable.” Also this year when CNET reviewed the 2013 ST60 series they said the following “48Hz, as usual, created unbearable flicker”. This flicker issue has been going on for a little over 5 years now with Panasonic and the 48Hz setting and it appears that Panasonic does not have any plans to discontinue the 48Hz setting on future plasma models.

In a very positive move for consumers, the 2013 ST60 series plasmas offer a true 4:4 pulldown 96Hz mode which is ideal for when consumers are watching 2-D 1080p/24 material. So when the 96Hz mode is turned on 60Hz video based material will be displayed at 60Hz like it is suppose too, however when one pops in a true 1080p/24 2-D Blu-ray disc the ST60 series is smart enough to repeat each frame 4 times just like one experiences in the commercial movie theater.

Also new this year is the 100Hz mode for 3-D. Prior Panasonic 3-D plasmas also had the 120Hz mode (60Hz each eye) and the 96Hz mode (48Hz each eye), however they were labeled as 60Hz and 48Hz. In a positive move from Panasonic the 3-D menu correctly labels the total 3-D refresh rate as 120Hz and 96Hz (This is a more accurate way to label the 3-D modes). In a big 3-D disappointment all flat panel displays including the Panasonic ST60 series still lacks a Cinema quality 144Hz or 192Hz 3-D mode. Consumers that want 3-D Cinema quality frame rates like 144fps are forced to purchase an expensive ceiling mounted front projector.

The following are select word for word quotes from page 34 of the July-August 2013 Sound and Vision magazine article

“The ST60 has the same not-very-useful 48-Hz display mode found on many previous Panasonic plasmas, but it also has the 96-Hz mode found on the company’s recent upper-end models that lets you display 24-frames-per-second content (nearly all movies) in a 4:4 sequence (each frame is displayed 4 times per second). This creates a judder-free motion image without having to add the dreaded interpolation (soap-opera effect) processing used by high-frame-rate LCDs.”

http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/art...-hdtv?page=0,1

[HDTV1080P]

The 2013 Samsung PN60F8500 compared to the reference 2008 Pioneer PRO-141FD

(Home Theater magazine review)

Cinema quality 96Hz mode for 2-D 1080p/24 source material

No Cinema quality 144Hz or 192Hz 3-D mode

Home Theater magazine has just compared the 2013 Samsung PN60F8500 plasma display to the 2008 Pioneer PRO-141FD plasma. The discontinued 60 inch Pioneer has an overall better 2-D picture quality when compared to the latest 60 inch Samsung F8500 series. The Pioneer PRO-141FD Elite Signature series still has the deepest black levels and is used as a reference display at Home Theater magazine when comparing all the new plasma displays that are released on the market.

For some reason this Home Theater magazine review does not mention anything about how the Samsung PN60F8500 handles 2-D 1080p/24 source material and frame packed 1080P 3-D material. However, according to the Samsung PN60F8500 spec sheet this plasma display uses a Cinema Smooth Plus feature. It is my understanding that the Cinema Smooth Plus feature operates at the same frame rate (Hz) as the Samsung PN60E7000FF which uses the standard Cinema Smooth feature.

Therefore, the Samsung F8500 plasma TV series operates at 60Hz, 96HZ, and 120Hz. When Cinema Smooth Plus is turned on the Samsung F8500 series will display native 2-D 1080p/24 source materiel at 96Hz using a Cinema Quality 4:4 pulldown repeating frame process. However, the Samsung F8500 plasma TV series still uses 3:2 pulldown for each eye when playing back a frame packed Blu-ray 3-D image, with a total refresh rate of 120Hz (60Hz for each eye). The ideal 3-D plasma display should use 144Hz triple flash technology or 192Hz quad flash technology when playing back a 3-D frame packed Blu-ray movie.

The Samsung PN60F8500 also has a feature called Evolution kit to improve on the speed and performance of the streaming features in the future (Evolution is a bad name for the kit since 100% of all electronic hardware and software is created by intelligent human engineers and human programmers). It is impossible for this Samsung PN60F8500 to evolve by natural processes into a better performing HDTV no matter how many decades this Samsung plasma sits around. It is awesome that the Samsung engineers and software developers have created a way for consumers to install an optional piece of hardware in the Evolution interface jack on the back of the HDTV. This will allow new faster streaming and GUI features to be used without having to purchase a new HDTV or Blu-ray player in order to update to the latest steaming technology.


The following is a Quote from the Samsung PN60F8500 spec sheet:

“Cinema smooth adjusts the frame rate of the panel for displaying 24fps source movies on Blu-ray Disc®, dedicated 24p cable and satellite channels at this native frame rate. The resulting video characteristic is a smoother and more natural film like experience.”

Specifications Sheet PDF

The following are select word for word quotes from the Home Theater magazine review

“It was only on the very darkest scenes that the Samsung couldn’t keep up with my last-generation Pioneer Kuro (the 60-inch, PRO-141FD monitor). Kuros are no longer available, of course, but can’t be ignored because while they aren’t perfect (no video display is), on some important characteristics their performance established an as yet unsurpassed benchmark of what’s possible in a modern HDTV.”

“The Samsung did reasonably here, but the black of space between the stars was clearly deeper and darker on the Pioneer.”

“Also keep in mind that the Samsung can be driven to higher brightness levels (though not LCD levels) than the Pioneer and retails for less than half of what my non-3D Kuro did back in 2009. The Samsung’s extra brightness on 2D is of little use to me—as noted earlier, I find that the roughly 30 ft-L I can reach on the Pioneer is more than satisfying in the subdued room lighting I prefer.”

*** Click here to read a complete review at the Home Theater magazine website ***

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New low cost true Cinema quality 72Hz each eye and 96Hz each eye 3-D 1080P Passive glasses projector technology is now available

** This Airflex5D passive glasses 3-D frame rate is comparable to a 192Hz (96Hz each eye) and 144Hz (72Hz each eye) active glasses systems **

** This Airflex5D system is one of the best products on the market for those looking to install a Cinema quality passive glasses 3-D projection system **

** Supports Panaavision 3D and Infitec Dolby 3D system. (No special silver screen needed, uses standard screens) **

** Supports both Linear passive 3-D and Circular passive 3-D technology (requires special silver screen) **

The 3-D consumer displays that display 3-D and 2-D signals at Cinema quality frame rates currently only contains 3-D projectors in the price range of $49,995-$199,995+. Those are some awesome high-end projectors between $50,000-$200,000+, however the problem is only around 1% of consumers are willing to spend that much money on a projector. The good news is that with the new Airflex5D 3-D Multi-projector Stacking system processor box, it will allow consumers to create their own 72Hz each eye or 96Hz each eye 3-D passive projector system at only the fraction of the cost.

How the Airflex5D system works

When using a 3-D Blu-ray player with a 3-D movie the frame packed Blu-ray HDMI signal is 1920 x 2205P at 24Hz going into the Airflex5D 3-D processor. Then the Airflex5D 3-D processor unpacks the frames to restore the original 48Hz 3-D image that contains two separate 1080P/24 images for each eye. Then if the consumer owns a 10-bit Airflex5D model the Airflex5D system will offer true 1920 x 1080P resolution for each eye when processing the 3-D signal, (the lower cost 8-bit models only offer 1920 x 540 resolution internal processing before upscaling the image to 1080P). So with a 10-bit Airflex5D system there is two HDMI outputs (or 2 DVI outputs for some models) that is used to connect two separate projectors. One 1080P projector contains the left eye polarized filter and the other 1080P projector contains the right eye polarized filter.

What this means is that any 2-D or 3-D projector can be used with the Airflex5D system (If a 3-D projector is used the 3-D feature built into the projector is never used when connected to the Airflex5D 3-D system). Up to 16 projectors can be stacked, however most consumers to keep things simple will just want to stack 2 projectors. The Airflex5D system maintains the same contrast levels even when stacking 2x identical projectors because it will increase both full white and full black-level lumens resulting in an unchanged contrast ratio (For example if one stacks two 3,000 lumens projectors they will have a 6,000 lumens output while maintaining the exact same contrast ratio).I would recommend consumers only stack 72Hz and 96Hz 1080P projectors in order to get the Cinema Quality frame rates of 72Hz each eye or 96Hz each eye. Stacking 60Hz projectors will result in 3:2 pulldown for each eye. Stacking 48Hz projectors for 3-D may result in 50% of the population seeing a 3-D image flicker. The advantage of 72Hz each eye and 96Hz each eye is that image flicker does not exist and the 3-D quality is greatly improved by matching the 3-D frame rate quality of the commercial 3-D theaters. Most low cost consumer projectors are using either a 48Hz or 60Hz refresh rate. The old Panasonic PT-AE1000U for $5,999 has a 72Hz refresh rate for 1080p/24 material. It’s hard to find low cost 72Hz projectors, however the good news is that 96Hz LCOS projectors and 96Hz LCD projectors are very common now with prices below $3,500.

A few examples of 96Hz each eye 3-D systems that can be created by stacking projectors

1. JVC dual DLA-X95RKT high-end system (around $30,000) Each eye sees flicker free 96Hz in both 2-D and 3-D: The JVC DLA-X95RKT projector list price is $11,999.95 each. Stacking two together will be around $24,000 list price. Then one needs to decide if they are going to use Panavision omega optical filters over the projector lens or the Infitec Dolby 3D system (both of those passive systems allow consumers to use a standard projector screen). However if one wants to use the polarized system then they will have to add in the cost for a special polarized silver screen (not included in above total). There are two passive 3D formats to choose from depending on the type of projector one is using (Circular and Linear). DLP projectors use Circular filters. LCOS and LCD projectors use Linear filters. The Airflex5D AF5D-60 processor is $4,999 + an estimated cost of around $1,000 for 2 linear polarized filters (10 pairs of low cost passive glasses included).

2. JVC dual DLA-X35B low cost system (around $8,200): Each eye sees flicker free 96Hz in both 2-D and 3-D: The JVC DLA-X35B projector list price is $3,499.95 each. Stacking two together will be around $7,000 list price. The cheapest 10 bit Airflex5D system that offers true 1920 X 1080P for each eye is the Airflex5D AF5D-21SL kit for $1,199. A DVI to HDMI adapter needs to be used on both projectors for this low cost processor box. If one wants HDMI and DisplayPort then they can purchase the top of the line Airflex5D AF5D-60 kit with linear filters and glasses for $5,999 instead of the $1,199 Aifeflex AF5D-21SL kit. Both kits include 10 pairs of low cost passive glasses. Cost of required silver screen not included in the total price above.

Some of the required components needed to create a 72Hz each eye or 96Hz each eye 3-D passive projector system

1. Airflex5D 3-D Multi-Projector Stacking system: A small 10-bit processing box that connects two projectors. Warning the AF5D-20 and AF5D-30 are 8-bit systems that only offer 1920 x 540 resolution for each eye before upscaling the image to 1080P. The AF5D-21, AF5D-5, and the top of the line AF5D-60 all use 10-bit processors for true 1920 x 1080P resolution signal processing for each eye.

2. Any projector technology will work: LCD, DLP, LCOS, LED, and Laser projectors are all 100% compatible with the Airflex5D stacking system. Projectors do not need to be 3-D, plain old 2-D projectors will work. When stacking projectors it is recommend to use the exact same model numbers, especially for 3-D source material.

3. Any two identical projectors that accept a 1080p/24 input: (Projectors need to have a 72Hz or 96Hz repeating frame method if one wants the Cinema quality 72Hz each eye and 96Hz each eye frame rates). Note: 60Hz only projectors will produce 3:2 pulldown issues for each eye. 48Hz Projectors will produce possible image flicker issues that 50% of the population might see. The Airflex5D 3-D system processor can also convert the two separate 1080P/24 images to 1080P at 60Hz by adding 3:2 pulldown to each eye for those that own older projectors with only 1080P 60HZ inputs.

4. Brightness of the projected image can be increased by 16X by using 16 projectors at the same time (Example): A single low cost 1080P 3,000 lumens projector costs $699. By connecting a QTY of 16 3,000 lumens projectors and a QTY of 8 Airflex5D systems at the same time the brightness can be increased to 48,000 lumens at a fraction of the cost of a high-end projectors. In a 3-D system 8 projectors would be used for the right eye and 8 projectors would be used for the left eye.

5. Silver screen is needed for Polarized Circular and Polarized Linear 3-D: For consumers that want to use their existing projector screen then they should look into purchasing the Panavision Omega Optics Filter or an Infitec Dolby 3-D filter. Both Panavision and Infitec Dolby 3-D systems allows consumers to use their standard projector screen.

The following are some reference links to read more about the Airflex5D 3-D series of products

Airflex5D home page

Airflex5D Model Comparison (PDF)

Passive 3D and Active 3D Comparison (PDF)

FAQ’S (PDF)

Airflex5D User Manual for AF5D-21 (PDF)

Airflex5D User Manual for AF5D-5 & AF5D-60 (PDF)

[HDTV1080P]

The Airflex5D 3-D Multi-Projector Stacking system will not be added to the list since it technically is not a projector. Also Cinema quality frame rates only occur when consumers use two identical 72Hz or 96Hz projectors. This Airflex5D product is just a low cost way consumers can use to create their own Cinema quality passive glasses technology projection system at a fraction of the cost (when compared to the top of line Cinema quality projectors that are located on the list).

[HDTV1080P]

Important note Regarding the Airflex5D system comments above

Since each eye sees 96Hz in 3-D using passive glasses with the JVC projectors used in the example, this means it is comparable to a 192Hz active glasses projection system (96Hz for each eye).

Two 96Hz projectors were called a 192Hz system, however technically both 2-D and 3-D viewing is at 96HZ. However when viewing in 3-D one projector displays a full left eye 1080P 96Hz image and the other projector displays a full right eye 1080P 96Hz image (That is why 192Hz was used to label the 3-D system).

[HDTV1080P]

Sony XBR-65X900A 3D LCD Ultra HDTV

** Four times the native resolution of standard HD **

The discontinued 60 inch 2008 Pioneer PRO-141FD for $7,000 still offers an overall better picture quality when watching 1080P 2-D material when compared to the $24,999.99 Sony XBR-84X900 and the $6,999.99 Sony XBR-65X900A, since the Pioneer black levels are reference quality. Sony also offers a 55 inch 4K Ultra HD XBR-55X900A for only $4,999.99. The 3 different Sony 4K Ultra HD sets all use Edge-lit LED’s instead of the better quality full LED backlit local dimming.

For 2-D viewing, there is currently very little benefit to the Sony XBR-65X900A since there is a lack of 4K QUAD HD material on the market. Until a QUAD HD optical format is launched all native 480i-1080P video is upscaled to the Sony’s native resolution of 3,840 X 2,160 (theoretically in 2016 or later a new optical QUAD HD format will launch). Consumers can purchase a Sony 4K Ultra HD Media Player for $699 that will download 4K Ultra HD movies that can only be played back on a Sony brand Ultra HD display. At this time downloaded 4K QUAD HD movie selection is extremely limited.

The big advantage of the Sony QUAD HD displays is the 3-D quality is the best 3-D quality that consumers have ever seen from a flat panel screen so far. The Sony QUAD HD displays like the XBR-65X900A offers true 1080P quality for each eye using low cost $10 passive glasses (The true 1920 x 1080P for each eye is upscaled to 3840 x 1080 while watching 3-D frame packed Blu-ray’s) . It’s too bad that this Sony XBR-65X900A does not offer 144Hz triple flash technology or 192Hz QUAD flash technology for 3-D. It is my understanding that this Sony XBR-65X900A after the black frame insertion between each frames, will use a total of 120Hz (60Hz for each eye) when watching a Blu-ray frame packed movie. The frame rate in 3-D still needs to be verified on the Sony. It’s a big disappointment that so far no 3-D flat panel offers Cinema quality 3-D frame rates yet. The list only contains Front Projectors that offer Cinema Quality frame rates.

The following are select word for word quotes from the Home Theater magazine review

“The Motionflow control engages Sony’s motion-smoothing circuits. Most of its selections employ frame interpolation. The Impulse setting uses dark frame insertion and worked the best of all the options, doing the least damage to the film look of movies. But it produced a dramatic loss of brightness. I left Motionflow off for all my tests and viewing.”

“With the introduction of its new 2013 XBR sets, Sony has shown that it’s serious about bringing Ultra HD, popularly referred to as 4K, to consumers at prices that, while still high, are less seizure-inducing than the $25,000 sticker on its 84-inch XBR-84X900 (Home Theater, June 2013).”

“Technically, 4K is shorthand for a resolution of 4096 x 2160 pixels—the professional 4K format. Consumer 4K sets, on the other hand, have a resolution of 3840 x 2160, exactly four times the pixel count of full HD 1080p. Regardless of the industry’s plan to refer to such sets as Ultra HD, 4K has already crept into the lexicon as the popular term for 3840 x 2160 home video.”

** Click here to read the complete review at the Home Theater magazine website **

[HDTV1080P]

New 4K Christie Mirage 4K25 and 4K35 3-chip DLP 3-D Projectors for commercial theaters

** These are the first and only DLP full resolution 4K commercial projectors with 120Hz 3D operation. **

Since these two projectors are sold only to commercial movie theaters, the projectors will not be added to the list at the beginning of this thread (Also theme parks, and other private industries purchase these types of projectors). Around July 8th 2013 the Christie Mirage 4K25 and 4K35 DLP 3D projectors were released. These two new 4K projectors offer a full 4,096 by 2,160 resolution with native 24Hz-120Hz movies in the commercial theater.

In the future there is going to be more native 2-D 60Hz movies and native 3-D 120Hz (60Hz each eye) movies. The higher the native frame rate of the movie the more realistic the 2-D or 3-D image will be. There might even be native 120Hz 2-D movies shown in the future. Note: native 60Hz and native 120Hz does not contain any 3:2 pulldown and it is better quality then native 24Hz movies since it has a more realistic live feel to the movement. I hope that a future 4K consumer optical format will support native 60Hz 4K movies and 120Hz 4K movies. The Blu-ray format only supports native 1080P at 24Hz and the ideal new consumer format should support native frame rates between 24Hz-120Hz. If a lot of 2-D movies in the future are released at 1080P with native 60Hz for example then 100% of the 1080P HDTV’s on the market already have a 1080P 60Hz input. This would be excellent quality native 60Hz 2-D 1080P without 3:2 pulldown that all consumers could enjoy without the need to upgrade their existing 2-D 1080P projectors or 2-D 1080P HDTV’s.

Examples of what these new 4K projectors can do when used in a dual IMAX type setup:

1. Native 4K (4096 X 2160) 2-D 24Hz movies are displayed at 4K 24Hz.

2. Native 4K (4096 X 2160) 2-D 30Hz movies are displayed at 4K 30Hz.

3. Native 4K (4096 X 2160) 2-D 48Hz movies are displayed at 4K 48Hz.

4. Native 4K (4096 X 2160) 3-D 48Hz movies are displayed at 4K 48Hz (24Hz for each eye). No need to triple flash with a dual IMAX projector setup.

5. Native 4K (4096 X 2160) 2-D 60Hz movies are displayed at 4K 60Hz.

6. Native 4K (4096 X 2160) 3-D 60Hz movies are displayed at 4K 60Hz (30Hz for each eye).

7. Native 4K (4096 X 2160) 2-D 96Hz movies are displayed at 4K 96Hz.

8. Native 4K (4096 X 2160) 3-D 96Hz movies are displayed at 4K 96Hz (48Hz for each eye).

9. Native 4K (4096 X 2160) 2-D 120Hz movies are displayed at 4K 120Hz.

10. Native 4K (4096 X 2160) 3-D 120Hz movies are displayed at 4K 120Hz (60Hz for each eye).

Christie Mirage 4K25 and 4K35 brochure