Star Wars: The Original Trilogy (1977-1983)

[octagon]

Originally Posted by Moviefan2k4

If you're not prepared to boycott them, then quit complaining about how they do business.

You can demand this all you want but I'm not obligated to do as you ask. None of your frustration or anger changes that - this is completely my call to make.

[Zivouhr]

Repost from Last Jedi:

In the beginning, Star Wars still made more than the sequel, Empire. Sequels tend to lose some of the initial interested audiences.

Star Wars 1977

Domestic Total Gross: $307,263,857
Domestic Lifetime Gross: $460,998,007
Distributor: Fox Release Date: May 25, 1977
Genre: Sci-Fi Fantasy Runtime: 2 hrs. 1 min.
MPAA Rating: PG Production Budget: $11 million

Total Lifetime Grosses
Domestic: $460,998,007 59.5%
+ Foreign: $314,400,000 40.5%
= Worldwide: $775,398,007



The Empire Strikes Back 1980
Domestic Total Gross: $209,398,025
Domestic Lifetime Gross: $290,475,067
Distributor: Fox Release Date: May 21, 1980
Genre: Sci-Fi Fantasy Runtime: 2 hrs. 9 min.
MPAA Rating: PG Production Budget: $18 million

Total Lifetime Grosses
Domestic: $290,475,067 54.0%
+ Foreign: $247,900,000 46.0%
= Worldwide: $538,375,067



Return of the Jedi 1983

Domestic Total Gross: $252,583,617
Domestic Lifetime Gross: $309,306,177
Distributor: Fox Release Date: May 25, 1983
Genre: Sci-Fi Fantasy Runtime: 2 hrs. 14 min.
MPAA Rating: PG Production Budget: $32.5 million

Total Lifetime Grosses
Domestic: $309,306,177 65.1%
+ Foreign: $165,800,000 34.9%
= Worldwide: $475,106,177

[Moviefan2k4]

Originally Posted by octagon

You can demand this all you want but I'm not obligated to do as you ask. None of your frustration or anger changes that - this is completely my call to make.

(sigh) I should've seen that one coming...particularly from you. Sometimes, I wonder why I even try, to attempt any kind of objective dialogue with the purists around here.

[KRW1]

The thing I hate most about the Mos Eisely changes is that I used to really dig how you had to assume that most of it was underground due to the heat. Gave it an extra sense of danger. For me. Actually that was how I rationalised it to myself, I think!

Anyhoo, as for supply and demand - where is the demand? I can't think of many people I've met in real life who want it, casuals don't know the difference and the 'hard core internet people' already have several versions to choose from.

Maybe they read these forums and think, well, shucks, everyone's already got it already and we still sell the special editions by the bucketload. Who actually wants it?

What I want is a Criterion spine no 1000 and a Star Wars box set with the unaltered film and the unseen workprint but I'm probably unlikely to get it.

[octagon]

Originally Posted by Moviefan2k4

(sigh) I should've seen that one coming...particularly from you. Sometimes, I wonder why I even try, to attempt any kind of objective dialogue with the purists around here.

Telling people to either boycott Disney or shut up isn't 'objective dialogue', it's rhetorical petulance.

We're consumers. Boycotts and silence are not our only options.

As for being a purist, if you look through my posting history - fair warning: you might have to go back two whole posts so get comfortable - you might see I'm at least somewhat willing to acknowledge that not all the changes to the OT are terrible.

[octagon]

Originally Posted by KRW1

Anyhoo, as for supply and demand - where is the demand? I can't think of many people I've met in real life who want it, casuals don't know the difference and the 'hard core internet people' already have several versions to choose from.

Agreed. I've said many times that the people who think a UOT release would be a license to print money are grossly overestimating the demand.

It would be an event and it would almost certainly generate some profits but huge profits? No, probably not. The people who want a BD release of the UOT are a fraction of a fraction of a fraction of an already shrinking physical media market.

[Moviefan2k4]

Originally Posted by octagon

Telling people to either boycott Disney or shut up isn't 'objective dialogue', it's rhetorical petulance.

We're consumers. Boycotts and silence are not our only options.

In the eyes of most businesses, that's the way it works. They understand one thing, above all else - money. If something produces a massive profit in a short amount of time, the studio heads are very happy...for about five seconds. After that, they're looking to do it again, as soon as possible. The more creative people may be willing to listen to the public...but most head executives don't seem to care. If you want to make an impact with the higher-ups, you have to hit them where it hurts the most - their wallets. So long as they keep making money at the same rate they expect, their decisions won't change very much.

In spite of its similarity to A New Hope, The Force Awakens still made $2 billion worldwide on a $245 million budget. By comparison, Rogue One made $1 billion on a $200 million budget. I think it was mostly redundant, and the numbers seem to suggest a lot of others felt the same way. The only way to keep the franchise going from a business standpoint, is to make sure every film has results comparable to The Force Awakens...but I think Solo will do less than Rogue One.

As for being a purist, if you look through my posting history - fair warning: you might have to go back two whole posts so get comfortable - you might see I'm at least somewhat willing to acknowledge that not all the changes to the OT are terrible.

I did notice, and I wasn't trying to pigeonhole you personally with my comments. But my overall point about the UOT still stands - Lucasfilm likely doesn't see much potential for profit in doing it. The anniversary was the perfect opportunity, but they focused instead on The Last Jedi and Star Wars Rebels. That's why I said in an earlier post myself, that if the UOT's not released by the 50th anniversary, it probably won't happen at all.

[steel_breeze]

Originally Posted by KRW1

The thing I hate most about the Mos Eisely changes is that I used to really dig how you had to assume that most of it was underground due to the heat. Gave it an extra sense of danger. For me. Actually that was how I rationalised it to myself, I think!

That's so interesting. I never assumed there was a teeming underground to Mos Eisley -- but I love that idea. I just always thought it was a backwater city on a backwater planet. I loved the run-down ghost-town feel to the original Mos Eisley; very "old west", as originally intended. I cannot friggin' STAND the cartoony, bustling metropolis in the Special Editions, with all their little gags and extra creatures. Too much! Cartoony Mos Eisley is what bums me out the most, each time I watch those editions, and our heroes' extended drive into Cartoonland nearly stops the pace of the entire movie.

[Phobics]

Originally Posted by steel_breeze

That's so interesting. I never assumed there was a teeming underground to Mos Eisley -- but I love that idea. I just always thought it was a backwater city on a backwater planet. I loved the run-down ghost-town feel to the original Mos Eisley; very "old west", as originally intended. I cannot friggin' STAND the cartoony, bustling metropolis in the Special Editions, with all their little gags and extra creatures. Too much! Cartoony Mos Eisley is what bums me out the most, each time I watch those editions, and our heroes' extended drive into Cartoonland nearly stops the pace of the entire movie.

Yet I feel it was because of tech and money. The added things to ANH made sense but the song crap in ep6 was bs.

[steel_breeze]

Originally Posted by Phobics

Yet I feel it was because of tech and money. The added things to ANH made sense but the song crap in ep6 was bs.

Made sense how? We're never told Mos Eisley is a bustling center of Tatooine and then never shown it in the original. Mos Eisley COULD have been a ghost town, which is simply the nearest star-port to Luke's middle-of-nowhere homestead. There was no reason to make it into Toontown.

What's really a shame about the Special Edition additions is that they remain frozen in time when CGI was really terrible. At least if we're going to have them, let's update that cartoony stuff into something that looks more photo-realistic. And then ALSO give us the option to watch the original, unmolested AND the cartoony version, for people who grew up with that... of course.

[octagon]

Originally Posted by steel_breeze

That's so interesting. I never assumed there was a teeming underground to Mos Eisley -- but I love that idea. I just always thought it was a backwater city on a backwater planet. I loved the run-down ghost-town feel to the original Mos Eisley; very "old west", as originally intended. I cannot friggin' STAND the cartoony, bustling metropolis in the Special Editions, with all their little gags and extra creatures. Too much! Cartoony Mos Eisley is what bums me out the most, each time I watch those editions, and our heroes' extended drive into Cartoonland nearly stops the pace of the entire movie.

That was always my impression of Mos Eisley too. More Deadwood than Tombstone.

And yeah, I probably could have lived with turning it from a frontier town/trading post into more of an actual city if it weren't for all the cartoon goofiness that went along with that. Even some of the cooler looking additions are distracting because there's just too much.

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by steel_breeze

That's so interesting. I never assumed there was a teeming underground to Mos Eisley -- but I love that idea. I just always thought it was a backwater city on a backwater planet. I loved the run-down ghost-town feel to the original Mos Eisley; very "old west", as originally intended. I cannot friggin' STAND the cartoony, bustling metropolis in the Special Editions, with all their little gags and extra creatures. Too much! Cartoony Mos Eisley is what bums me out the most, each time I watch those editions, and our heroes' extended drive into Cartoonland nearly stops the pace of the entire movie.

Yes! For me it's not just about the content of the changes but the overall effect that they have on the pacing of the original film. There's so much stuff in those first few reels that's been tweaked or extended, not just the outright new material but all the subtle little camera moves and zooms that have been added in, it all mounts up and it's like death by a thousand cuts. When I watched the original again after years of SE viewing I was amazed at how it seemed to almost rocket along in comparison.

[Zivouhr]

Not a big deal, but the part where the Sand Speeder is first flying into Tattooine's Mos Eisley town, there's a clunky Robot standing there and hits another robot to the ground. The awkward animation on that could really use refinement since it's supposed to based on reality, but it was given the go ahead by George Lucas. Would be nice if that was cut from the film and just start the shot right afterwards.

Again, no big deal as the movie outshines those minor adjustments George made. I'm still very surprised he didn't address the faint blocks surrounding the Tie fighters in the darkness of outerspace if you raise the brightness on your TV. The faint, gray boxes surrounding the ships ruin the effect, though if it was in the theater, the brightness would be correctly calibrated so they wouldn't be seen. Even so, editing/color matching those blocks out wouldn't be too tough with the editing software of today.

[stvn1974]

What Lucas did to THX-1138 is even worse, IMO.

[chip75]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

Yes! For me it's not just about the content of the changes but the overall effect that they have on the pacing of the original film. There's so much stuff in those first few reels that's been tweaked or extended, not just the outright new material but all the subtle little camera moves and zooms that have been added in, it all mounts up and it's like death by a thousand cuts. When I watched the original again after years of SE viewing I was amazed at how it seemed to almost rocket along in comparison.

Star Wars has always been a bit slow to restart after the exhilarating opening with the capture of Princess Leia, but the new bits do drag it down a bit Imagine what the Biggs and Cammie scenes would have done). I think Marcia would have trimmed them down a bit.

[Ernest Rister]

Originally Posted by Moviefan2k4

You can demand all you want, but they're not obligated to do as you ask. None of your disappointment or anger changes that - it is completely their call to make. If you're not prepared to boycott them, then quit complaining about how they do business.

Hey...here's a wacky idea...talk "with" people, not "at" them. Meaning, be positive and actually do something constructive and talk "with" LucasFilm and ask for what you want. They have a phone number, social media is kinda a thing these days, and it's not expensive. Just get your friends together and make some positive noise, don't get people back on their heels, and ask for what you want. Talk with people, not at them. How did people ranting and raving at Mr. Lucas work out? You guys get together, make a groundswell on twitter or facebook or what have you, and be nice about it. Amazing what could happen.

[JimSmith]

Originally Posted by steel_breeze

That's so interesting. I never assumed there was a teeming underground to Mos Eisley -- but I love that idea. I just always thought it was a backwater city on a backwater planet. I loved the run-down ghost-town feel to the original Mos Eisley; very "old west", as originally intended. I cannot friggin' STAND the cartoony, bustling metropolis in the Special Editions, with all their little gags and extra creatures. Too much! Cartoony Mos Eisley is what bums me out the most, each time I watch those editions, and our heroes' extended drive into Cartoonland nearly stops the pace of the entire movie.

I agree with several people on here that Mos Eisley is way more interesting when it is more of a ghost town and not cartoonville. The special editions for the most part of course are crap. And the added windows on Cloud City in The Empire Strikes Back actually creates a blooper in one scene involving the stormtroopers showing up right after Han tries to shoot Vader. Just look at the window behind the stormtroopers in that one shot and compare it to how that very same window looked a moment before when the gang with Lando walked past it.

[Moviefan2k4]

Originally Posted by Ernest Rister

Hey...here's a wacky idea...talk "with" people, not "at" them. Meaning, be positive and actually do something constructive and talk "with" LucasFilm and ask for what you want. They have a phone number, social media is kinda a thing these days, and it's not expensive. Just get your friends together and make some positive noise, don't get people back on their heels, and ask for what you want. Talk with people, not at them. How did people ranting and raving at Mr. Lucas work out? You guys get together, make a groundswell on twitter or Facebook or what have you, and be nice about it. Amazing what could happen.

I agree...but I'm not the one whining about the theatrical cuts not being available. Rather, I was trying to explain to others why, in my view, Lucasfilm hasn't released them yet.

[Ernest Rister]

LucasFilm Facebook Page:
https://www.facebook.com/pages/Lucas...19254538127249

LucasFilm Address:
1110 Gorgas Ave
San Francisco, California 94129

LucasFilm Phone Number:
(415) 623-1000

That took me 60 seconds.

[SarahS]

Originally Posted by Moviefan2k4

You can demand all you want, but they're not obligated to do as you ask. None of your disappointment or anger changes that - it is completely their call to make. If you're not prepared to boycott them, then quit complaining about how they do business.

You really going here again?