List of UHDs that contain HDR10+

[tyrok]

The average customer that goes to the store not knowing the exact model they want isn't going to care or notice the differences between HDR, HDR10+ and DV unless the sales person is demoing them side-by-side.

[Pieter V]

Samsung To Add HDR10+ Playback To 2017 4K Blu-ray Players

Samsung has confirmed to me at the CES that it is going to be rolling out firmware updates to its 2017 4K Blu-ray players enabling them to play films mastered in the new HDR10+ format.

The three players set to receive the HDR10+ update are the M9500, M8500 and M7500. Samsung wouldn’t put an exact date on when the firmware update might start to propagate, but it said it will definitely be in the first half of 2018 - maybe even towards the end of the first quarter.

Once the update has been installed, M9500, M8500 and M7500 4K Blu-ray players will be able to play the new generation of 4K Blu-rays from 20th Century Fox and Warner Bros that carry the HDR10+ dynamic metadata format. This delivers better picture quality results than the HDR10 industry standard currently used on most 4K Blu-ray discs by adding a layer of extra scene by scene picture information, to help TVs optimize the way they play the content back.

Before M9500, M8500 and M7500 owners get too excited, you should bear in mind that you will also need to own a TV that’s capable of playing HDR10+ pictures.

Also, while these players might be getting the new HDR10+ format, they will not also be getting support for the rival Dolby Vision dynamic metadata HDR system used on a growing number of 4K Blu-ray discs. Currently the only 4K Blu-ray player in the world that will play both formats is the recently announced Panasonic DP-UB820, set to go on sale in the spring. Though actually this dual format compatibility is something of a moot feature considering that at the time of writing no brand has announced a TV that will play both formats.

It’s worth adding, too, that this update news prompted me to ask Samsung for the umpteenth time if its 2016 TVs will be upgraded to handle HDR10+, as promised in the press release announcing HDR10+ that Samsung put out last April. Unfortunately I still wasn’t able to get a definitive answer; just another assurance that they’re still looking into it. But the vibe I’m getting isn’t positive.

Let’s not get too downbeat, though. The bottom line is that the M9500, M8500 and M7500 update is very good news, and raises hopes that other 2017 4K Blu-ray players from other brands might be able to follow suit.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/johnarc.../#87bdd49421a4

[brentsg]

I'll never own another Samsung display and Panasonic bowed out of the US TV scene, so it's a non-starter for me.

Honestly I'm realizing that I'm a relic of the old home theater days anyways. I may just bow out and read books, watch the occasional Netflix show. I had been planning a big overhaul but with all of the uncertainty I might just get off the bus.

I have a 3 year old Sony on the main floor of my home and it's nearly useless for current content already. I have a 2016 OLED and it's looking like it might be useless for at least a subset of disks in a year or two. Same with the OPPO player possibly. I'm not replacing stuff repeatedly, too much hassle and I don't care enough.

[nugget2016]

Originally Posted by Vangeli

"Hi BestBuy employee, I want a new TV and heard about HDR. What is it?"

"It makes bright things brighter and dark things darker."

"Oh, great. Which one do you recommend?"

"The Samsungs are the most popular but the Sonys are better overall."

"I see, what's Dolby Vision mean on this Sony?"

"An HDR format. Samsung uses HDR10+."

"What's the difference?"

"HDR10+ is like a free version of Dolby Vision but has less color information."

"Oh, how much does Dolby Vision cost?"

"Doesn't cost anything for you, the movie studios license it but movies still cost the same."

"Oh okay. I'll get the Samsung because even though you said it has less colors the in-store demo is oversaturated and looks prettier."

It's a shame that this fictional customer uses iTunes and will never get any use out of HDR10+. Probably won't change the color tone to Warm 2 like the monster they truly are, either.

i use standard on my js8500, warm 2 is just plain horrible imo, more accurate but i prefer standard.

[Vangeli]

Originally Posted by tyrok

The average customer that goes to the store not knowing the exact model they want isn't going to care or notice the differences between HDR, HDR10+ and DV unless the sales person is demoing them side-by-side.

When I was at BestBuy yesterday an older couple were actually getting an HDR explanation and it was enjoyable to watch. The employee explained it very well, I was merely twisting that type of situation into one pointing out that HDR10+ has no meaningful marketing possibilities. At least DV has brand recognition. (The couple ended up getting a 55" OLED panel, thankfully enough.)

HDR10+ UHD discs, what will they do to market HDR10+? It's really a tough situation. And it can't be all on Samsung; they brand every little thing and HDR10+ already sounds like it's "theirs," will non-Samsung customers even care? Will non-Samsung customers even hear about it?

HDR10+ is coming and here to stay but it's not on as easy a road as some would press you to believe.

[Hardback247]

Originally Posted by Pieter V

https://www.forbes.com/sites/johnarc.../#87bdd49421a4

That Forbes article was the only place I've heard of this news.

[nick4Knight]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

Crucially people didn't need a different TV and player to be able to take advantage of those PQ remasters of yore but that's what we're potentially looking at here, it's them releasing a technologically differentiated version literally months after the first that could be treading on dangerous ground if they don't want to piss off the already installed user base

That is the long sordid history of home video! There were blu-ray players that people bought in the beginning that didn't decode the lossless codecs (PCM was the early lossless audio format) hence after a couple years were 'obsolete'. I bought one in 2010 thinking I was getting a good deal on a player for 85$. Then had to upgrade my player to get the lossless audio to my 2006 receiver via hdmi. I'm sure many here had similar experiences with hardware upgrades.

And on and on and on. We are still in the early adopter phase of UHD. And people wanna pretend like this should all be polished and perfect. When no format has been, nor suffered an ending detriment because of it.

[TheSweetieMan]

Now that Heat is gone, and we can have a serious discussion about this, there was something he was conveniently leaving out in regard to Warner.

All of their UHD titles are still in Dolby Vision on both iTunes and Vudu. And, while we all prefer the disc format for experiencing this format, there's no doubt more effort being put into streaming from these studios. So, even with Warner joining the HDR10+ movement, they're obviously not moving away from Dolby Vision. In fact, you'd think he'd had realized this when Panasonic, who helped construct HDR10+ with Samsung, decided to announce a Dolby Vision compatible UHD player for 2018.

It's pretty obvious that while studios would like the convenience of a royalty free, dynamic metadata HDR format, they're also not interested in giving Dolby the bird. Some users on here, really do undermine the great relationship that Dolby shares with these studios in general.

I don't see any sort of real format war breaking out. Both are here to stay. I will concede, however, that Dolby Vision will likely remain the niche of these formats, since they do charge a fee.

[ronboster]

Originally Posted by BrownianMotion

Hopefully this thread will be less of a flame war now.

Just like the weather, the heat index will rise again...it just maybe called "greenhouse effect". Heat Equation's MO means he'll be back under another new name.

[LoSouL]

mfw HeatEquation comes back

[philochs]

Did anyone else notice that at CES LG said HDR10+ is totally irrelevant, because their tvs have HDR Pro processing, which adds dynamic metadata to static HDR10? lol, maybe, but I think I'd prefer genuine dynamic metadata to extra processing which fakes a similar effect.

If anyone was wondering the real reason why Sony and LG didn't adopt HDR10+ this year, we now have the answer:

"While they don’t charge a fee to license HDR10+ technology, according to a source at LG, they do ask that you join the HDR10+ Alliance, a group of manufacturers that share data points and technology advancements with one another. As you can imagine, in an industry as competitive as television manufacturing is, there aren’t many companies too keen on sharing their insider information. So for that reason, Sony (and LG) is out, or at least that’s our assumption." - techradar

So basically, the HDR10+ Alliance is a cult. It's free to join, but after you do, you have to eat out of dumpsters, and you can no longer communicate with your family. This is bad news for the alliance, the supreme leaders over at Samsung may not be too pleased.

[hairlesswookiee]

Well that escalated quickly. I'm glad I missed out on the escalated trolling, definitely glad he's gone. I got tired of repeated fanboy crap in every thread.

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by philochs

Did anyone else notice that at CES LG said HDR10+ is totally irrelevant, because their tvs have HDR Pro processing, which adds dynamic metadata to static HDR10? lol, maybe, but I think I'd prefer genuine dynamic metadata to extra processing which fakes a similar effect.

If anyone was wondering the real reason why Sony and LG didn't adopt HDR10+ this year, we now have the answer:

"While they don’t charge a fee to license HDR10+ technology, according to a source at LG, they do ask that you join the HDR10+ Alliance, a group of manufacturers that share data points and technology advancements with one another. As you can imagine, in an industry as competitive as television manufacturing is, there aren’t many companies too keen on sharing their insider information. So for that reason, Sony (and LG) is out, or at least that’s our assumption." - techradar

So basically, the HDR10+ Alliance is a cult. It's free to join, but after you do, you have to eat out of dumpsters, and you can no longer communicate with your family. This is bad news for the alliance, the supreme leaders over at Samsung may not be too pleased.

LG and Samsung have the whole Korean rivalry going on so I'm not surprised that the former has poo-pooed the notion of HDR10+, and Sony have always marched to the beat of their own drum anyway. They did end up going for Dolby Vision, sure, but seeing as they've used Dolby's tools to master their HDR product from the start it was a logical choice to put into their TVs. They still don't want to certify their TVs under the UHD Alliance program though which shows how stubborn they can be.

[EbonDragon]

My guess is WB will favor DV for streaming, generally have HDR10+ as their second layer on many of their discs with DV being reserved for big budget releases. That way every disc has the benefit of a secondary premium layer. At least that’s my hope. Dynamic metadata is a must.

[Aidenag]

Originally Posted by philochs

Did anyone else notice that at CES LG said HDR10+ is totally irrelevant, because their tvs have HDR Pro processing, which adds dynamic metadata to static HDR10? lol, maybe, but I think I'd prefer genuine dynamic metadata to extra processing which fakes a similar effect.

If anyone was wondering the real reason why Sony and LG didn't adopt HDR10+ this year, we now have the answer:

"While they don’t charge a fee to license HDR10+ technology, according to a source at LG, they do ask that you join the HDR10+ Alliance, a group of manufacturers that share data points and technology advancements with one another. As you can imagine, in an industry as competitive as television manufacturing is, there aren’t many companies too keen on sharing their insider information. So for that reason, Sony (and LG) is out, or at least that’s our assumption." - techradar

So basically, the HDR10+ Alliance is a cult. It's free to join, but after you do, you have to eat out of dumpsters, and you can no longer communicate with your family. This is bad news for the alliance, the supreme leaders over at Samsung may not be too pleased.

Yeah hdr10+ alliance requires a lot for being "open source"... also, it's not actually free either, sure they dont charge per player, tv etc like dv does, BUT 10+ does require a yearly administrative fee that essentially goes into samsungs pocket... would love to find out how large that fee is, since 10+ promotors love saying how much cheaper it is for consumers than dv.

[CBCstillmatic]

Does the acquisition of Fox by Disney, a DV supporter, still not put uncertainty in Fox's HDR10+ future? Or are there signs Disney may also support HDR10+? I realize Fox jumped into bed with HDR10+ well before Disney and the deal may not be fully done, but is it not possible once it is, there may never be a Fox HDR10+ disc?

Will Fox still exist as a separate, but Disney owned, studio (ie Touchstone) and still put out it's own discs or will Disney just swallow it's properties and release under Disney branding?
Even if operated as a separate but Disney owned studio could Disney still not influence Fox over to DV if that is who they choose to support?

I realize there are no answers, unless I missed them, but just curious as to everyone's thoughts?

[Aidenag]

Originally Posted by CBCstillmatic

Does the acquisition of Fox by Disney, a DV supporter, still not put uncertainty in Fox's HDR10+ future? Or are there signs Disney may also support HDR10+? I realize Fox jumped into bed with HDR10+ well before Disney and the deal may not be fully done, but is it not possible once it is, there may never be a Fox HDR10+ disc?

Will Fox still exist as a separate, but Disney owned, studio (ie Touchstone) and still put out it's own discs or will Disney just swallow it's properties and release under Disney branding?
Even if operated as a separate but Disney owned studio could Disney still not influence Fox over to DV if that is who they choose to support?

I realize there are no answers, unless I missed them, but just curious as to everyone's thoughts?

No way disney eats fox name, too much value and history in the brand. Hdr10+ is def up in the air for fox though with the disney ownership. My guess is disney and fox will utilize both formats and do it in a manner that just pisses people off with confusion.

[PeterTHX]

Originally Posted by philochs

"While they don’t charge a fee to license HDR10+ technology, according to a source at LG, they do ask that you join the HDR10+ Alliance, a group of manufacturers that share data points and technology advancements with one another. As you can imagine, in an industry as competitive as television manufacturing is, there aren’t many companies too keen on sharing their insider information. So for that reason, Sony (and LG) is out, or at least that’s our assumption." - techradar

So basically, the HDR10+ Alliance is a cult. It's free to join, but after you do, you have to eat out of dumpsters, and you can no longer communicate with your family. This is bad news for the alliance, the supreme leaders over at Samsung may not be too pleased.

I tried to tell you guys I couldn't see Sony, LG, etc weren't going to do Samsung any favors.

[PeterTHX]

Originally Posted by CBCstillmatic

Does the acquisition of Fox by Disney, a DV supporter, still not put uncertainty in Fox's HDR10+ future? Or are there signs Disney may also support HDR10+? I realize Fox jumped into bed with HDR10+ well before Disney and the deal may not be fully done, but is it not possible once it is, there may never be a Fox HDR10+ disc?

Will Fox still exist as a separate, but Disney owned, studio (ie Touchstone) and still put out it's own discs or will Disney just swallow it's properties and release under Disney branding?
Even if operated as a separate but Disney owned studio could Disney still not influence Fox over to DV if that is who they choose to support?

I realize there are no answers, unless I missed them, but just curious as to everyone's thoughts?

Originally Posted by Aidenag

No way disney eats fox name, too much value and history in the brand. Hdr10+ is def up in the air for fox though with the disney ownership. My guess is disney and fox will utilize both formats and do it in a manner that just pisses people off with confusion.

Disney has a very good relationship with Dolby, they often get first crack at their new tech (Atmos, Vision). If they bring Fox's titles under their authoring I would not expect HDR10+

Full consolidation will still take at least a year so whatever is in Fox's pipeline will not be affected.

[gkolb]

Originally Posted by philochs

Did anyone else notice that at CES LG said HDR10+ is totally irrelevant, because their tvs have HDR Pro processing, which adds dynamic metadata to static HDR10? lol, maybe, but I think I'd prefer genuine dynamic metadata to extra processing which fakes a similar effect.

If anyone was wondering the real reason why Sony and LG didn't adopt HDR10+ this year, we now have the answer:

"While they don’t charge a fee to license HDR10+ technology, according to a source at LG, they do ask that you join the HDR10+ Alliance, a group of manufacturers that share data points and technology advancements with one another. As you can imagine, in an industry as competitive as television manufacturing is, there aren’t many companies too keen on sharing their insider information. So for that reason, Sony (and LG) is out, or at least that’s our assumption." - techradar

So basically, the HDR10+ Alliance is a cult. It's free to join, but after you do, you have to eat out of dumpsters, and you can no longer communicate with your family. This is bad news for the alliance, the supreme leaders over at Samsung may not be too pleased.

And at this point in the presentation, LG and Sony get up and exit the building...