Sony "Mastered in 4K" Blu-ray Titles May 14 and July 16

[HeavyHitter]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

It's not so much the '4K from scratch' aspect that 42041 is referring to, but rather the movies that have been finished on 4K Digital Intermediates. The DI is the finished digital record of the film, i.e. there's nothing to 're-scan'. The 4K source used for the new BDs of Battle LA or Amazing Spider-Man or Angels & Demons will be the exact same 4K source used for the old BDs. Ergo, any appreciable improvements in quality will be due to deficiencies in how the movie was originally mastered to Blu-ray (xv colour aside).

In some ways that's true even for the movies which have actually received new 4K scans; the blown out contrast of Ghostbusters and middling detail reproduction of Spider-Man haven't been 'fixed' via the magic of 4K, it's simply that they're brand new transfers with less fiddling. 4K is just a bonus.

Gotcha, makes total sense.

[HD Goofnut]

I figured I'd weigh in. From lots of reading, comparisons, and research I have deduced that the following on Sony's 4K so far:

Ghostbusters - Marginal improvement in colors and fine detail. Moderate improvement in contrast level.
Spider-man - Marginal improvement in colors and fine detail.
The Amazing Spider-man - Marginal improvement in fine detail.
Taxi Driver - Hardly any discernible difference.
Glory - Marginal improvement in fine detail. Moderate improvement in colors
Karate Kid (2010) - Avoid due to subtitle error.
Battle: Los Angeles - Unknown at this time.
Total Recall - No Extended Cut. No sale.
The Other Guys - Unknown at this time.
Angels & Demons - Unknown at this time.

I'd love for folks to weigh in on the unknowns if possible.

[The Rider]

Which mastered in 4K Blu-rays have different transfers than the normal Blu-rays ?
I think only Spider-Man and Ghostbusters.

It would be cool when all new upcoming catalog titles have a 4K transfer(not only the mastered in 4K series). For example Geronimo(no release date yet).

[42041]

Originally Posted by The Rider

Which mastered in 4K Blu-rays have different transfers than the normal Blu-rays ?
I think only Spider-Man and Ghostbusters.

Also Glory.
The rest are different encodes but the source for the HD version is the same.

[Dragun]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

It's not so much the '4K from scratch' aspect that 42041 is referring to, but rather the movies that have been finished on 4K Digital Intermediates. The DI is the finished digital record of the film, i.e. there's nothing to 're-scan'. The 4K source used for the new BDs of Battle LA or Amazing Spider-Man or Angels & Demons will be the exact same 4K source used for the old BDs. Ergo, any appreciable improvements in quality will be due to deficiencies in how the movie was originally mastered to Blu-ray (xv colour aside).

Well, they COULD rescan the film again at 4K with today's scanners and create a new DI that matches the DI. And maybe there's some new debayering algorithm for the digitally shot movies that could improve the image before re-grading. But that's a lot of work for marginal improvements that probably aren't worth the effort. 4K DIs are so recent that this probably wouldn't make sense unless the masters were messed up to begin with, or if it was several years from now and scanning technology improved a lot since the past few years.

I wonder how many films with 2K DIs will be reconstructed in such a manner.

[42041]

Originally Posted by Dragun

I wonder how many films with 2K DIs will be reconstructed in such a manner.

My guess is not many. Since the DI represents the finished version of the movie with all the artistic intent baked in, there's much less reason to re-do it than some stone age DVD perversion of an analog film's theatrical look. You'd have to re-render/re-composite the visual effects if you want end-to-end 4K, and I'm not sure how easy it'd be to re-do the digital color grading with all of its complexities.

[BozQ]

That's why it's good for us to know whether a movie's DI is in 2K or 4K. The point is to make an informed and educated choice when we purchase one of these products.

Movies are not even screened in 4K in most cinemas. So it's very unlikely we will see many 4K productions in the near future.

[marine92104]

So any news back from Sony on what they were going to do about the missing subtitles in the Karate Kid?

I know someone in the thread that had bought this said he had emailed Sony about it but no response as to what happened.

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by 42041

My guess is not many. Since the DI represents the finished version of the movie with all the artistic intent baked in, there's much less reason to re-do it than some stone age DVD perversion of an analog film's theatrical look. You'd have to re-render/re-composite the visual effects if you want end-to-end 4K, and I'm not sure how easy it'd be to re-do the digital color grading with all of its complexities.

I don't think that the grading would be a problem providing that records were kept, it's the visual effects. Movies these days tend to have a fair amount of digital manipulation, even if they're not effects-heavy epics. Given how upscaling gets better the higher up the food chain you go, I think a lot of future 4K redos from 2K DI's will have upscaled effects because redoing those from scratch will be prohibitively expensive.

They might get lucky and have CG models which were built at a higher than 2K resolution that could be re-rendered, but who's to say that a) that stuff has been archived properly, and b) that it can be redone with the software of the day?

[rickah88]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

Without revealing the proprietary algorithm, it means exactly what’s written in the second paragraph here - https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...hm#post7512866

The real-world significance of such will have to be determined by individual consumers.

Penton! Long time no post.
Glad to see you back!

[mzupeman]

Originally Posted by BozQ

That's why it's good for us to know whether a movie's DI is in 2K or 4K. The point is to make an informed and educated choice when we purchase one of these products.

Movies are not even screened in 4K in most cinemas. So it's very unlikely we will see many 4K productions in the near future.

You are right. Hell, I think even The Hobbit was only mastered at 2k. I could be wrong but, I thought I recalled reading that.

[MisterXDTV]

Originally Posted by mzupeman

You are right. Hell, I think even The Hobbit was only mastered at 2k. I could be wrong but, I thought I recalled reading that.

Yes, The Hobbit is 2K, even Star Trek Into Darkness has a 2K finish...

[dvdmike]

Originally Posted by HD Goofnut

I figured I'd weigh in. From lots of reading, comparisons, and research I have deduced that the following on Sony's 4K so far:

Ghostbusters - Marginal improvement in colors and fine detail. Moderate improvement in contrast level.
Spider-man - Marginal improvement in colors and fine detail.
The Amazing Spider-man - Marginal improvement in fine detail.
Taxi Driver - Hardly any discernible difference.
Glory - Marginal improvement in fine detail. Moderate improvement in colors
Karate Kid (2010) - Avoid due to subtitle error.
Battle: Los Angeles - Unknown at this time.
Total Recall - No Extended Cut. No sale.
The Other Guys - Unknown at this time.
Angels & Demons - Unknown at this time.

I'd love for folks to weigh in on the unknowns if possible.

I see those both as huge improvements

[JavaJulien]

So I can buy Ghostbusters, Glory, and Spider-Man, and ignore all the others. That's good to know.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by BozQ

That's why it's good for us to know whether a movie's DI is in 2K or 4K...

People have been working on that…at least in regards to the qualifier being film acquisition - https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread.php?t=218262

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by rickah88

Penton! Long time no post.
Glad to see you back!

Dude, I am not responsible for you being an Eagles fan nor, for your isolationism.

Been back since about last September and even had yet another surgery since then (they love cutting on me )…. https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...83#post6535183

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by mzupeman

You are right. Hell, I think even The Hobbit was only mastered at 2k. I could be wrong but, I thought I recalled reading that.

You think right.

Been even discussed prior to its theatrical release to help adjust the expectations of Hobbit fans – read the post just following the one linked to above...from last September.

And, reiterated comprehensively for non-believers just recently in a conversation with shrimp….https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...mp#post7536546

Which actually, even more recently, compelled a follow-up correspondence on the topic to a friend in New Zealand as posted here…https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...mp#post7542631

[rickah88]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

Dude, I am not responsible for you being an Eagles fan nor, for your isolationism.

Been back since about last September and even had yet another surgery since then (they love cutting on me )…. https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...83#post6535183

LOL! Excellent memory.
Well I'm glad to see you posting, even if I missed it back then.
Also glad to hear you are doing okay after surgury.

So these last couple pages are we talking about Sony offering opitmal 4k viewing only on Sony products? That's a scary thought!

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by rickah88

LOL! Excellent memory....

And if your wife is not just a football fan but also a hockey fan, I’m just now wondering if you got dinner last night….after the Pittsburgh Penguins loss in 2OT or….you munched on snack food to get through the night.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by rickah88

...So these last couple pages are we talking about Sony offering opitmal 4k viewing only on Sony products? That's a scary thought!

Hah, depends on one’s perspective. Are you a stakeholder?
http://www.media-server.com/m/p/5mpkzbfj

One way or another, gotta sell more Sony LCD’s - http://www.sony.net/SonyInfo/IR/fina.../12q4_sony.pdf
P.S.

Good luck in trying to hook up this hockey puck ….http://www.theverge.com/2013/4/7/419...k-media-player (and making it work) with a non-Sony tv, at least for the time being, unless plans change.