Sony "Mastered in 4K" Blu-ray Titles May 14 and July 16

[MisterXDTV]

I think this is the best this film can look. To create this version must have used a new 4K scan of the negative. This movie is not good looking because of how it was shot and the CGI.
Nothing to do with the transfer by Sony...

[IndyMLVC]

Originally Posted by AlexBC

I'm really disappointed on this new MIB disc. It's definitely the worst catalog title on the MI4K line so far.

It still looks too much like the old transfer with even more sharpening applied to it and some small color change.

Contrast still seems boosted. EE is even worse this time.

http://www.caps-a-holic.com/hd_vergl...ss=1#vergleich

http://www.caps-a-holic.com/hd_vergl...ss=1#vergleich

Sorry. I think it looks a helluva lot better.

[HeavyHitter]

Originally Posted by IndyMLVC

Sorry. I think it looks a helluva lot better.

Agreed.

[Geoff D]

Yeah, it's a vast improvement. I think the EE is baked in. Men in Black wasn't given a DI finish but I think a good amount of it was scanned, worked on digitally and then filmed back out, much like Phantom Menace a couple years later. (Which, incidentally, still has noticeable EE on the Blu-ray even though it was derived directly from the digital files.)

[dvdmike]

Originally Posted by AlexBC

I'm really disappointed on this new MIB disc. It's definitely the worst catalog title on the MI4K line so far.

It still looks too much like the old transfer with even more sharpening applied to it and some small color change.

Contrast still seems boosted. EE is even worse this time.

http://www.caps-a-holic.com/hd_vergl...ss=1#vergleich

http://www.caps-a-holic.com/hd_vergl...ss=1#vergleich

Nope

[42041]

Originally Posted by MisterXDTV

I think this is the best this film can look. To create this version must have used a new 4K scan of the negative. This movie is not good looking because of how it was shot and the CGI.
Nothing to do with the transfer by Sony...

Does the shot with Will Smith against the sky have some VFX element in it? I can believe that the late-90s digital work would have some sharpening baked in, but if that shot is analog.. bad Sony

[dvdmike]

Originally Posted by 42041

Does the shot with Will Smith against the sky have some VFX element in it? I can believe that the late-90s digital work would have some sharpening baked in, but if that shot is analog.. bad Sony

Digital sky?

[Deciazulado]

Film stock has actually acutance enhancement build into it to make the emulsion sharper and sometimes it can show on contrasty edges. Been seeing it for years before films had anything "digital" on them.

[tylergfoster]

Originally Posted by Deciazulado

Film stock has actually acutance enhancement build into it to make the emulsion sharper and sometimes it can show on contrasty edges. Been seeing it for years before films had anything "digital" on them.

I suspect this is what people are seeing in The Fog, too.

[42041]

Originally Posted by Deciazulado

Film stock has actually acutance enhancement build into it to make the emulsion sharper and sometimes it can show on contrasty edges. Been seeing it for years before films had anything "digital" on them.

From my experience the edge contrast of films with that acutance boost has a rather different look, can't say I've ever seen ringing on a negative that looks like that... to my eye, it looks digital. Hopefully it's an anomaly in Sony's 4K remasters going forward.

[Blu-21]

The Mastered in 4K version of Men in Black looks terrific, a substantial upgrade over the previous Blu-Ray, yes it still has what looks like baked in EE, but the detail, colours, grain compression and sharpness is night and day different.

http://www.caps-a-holic.com/hd_vergl...ess=#vergleich

[Deciazulado]

Well you can see it is also there in the old scan just blurrier. The new scan looks sharper than the image I saw on the theater of this particular movie. You've never seen a negative unless you're Superman with telescopic vision. All you ever see is copies duplicated from them projected blown up through lenses with aberrations with every step blurring the negative a little something.

With ~4K scans you could more or less see what's on the negative with the scanner acting as the telescopic vision depending on the quality of the scan. The scan can then be made equal, less sharp or sharper than the real image exposed on the negative, but remember also, the image on the negative is less sharp than the image that's coming from the camera lens and the image coming from the cameral lens is also less sharp than the object in front of it (That's one reason film emulsions have acutance enhancing effects, to combat this) (You can see this on the MTF curve of a film where the frequency response is more than 100% on some frequencies acting like a photochemical sharpening filter instead of an electronic/digital one combating the natural blurring of lens/film exposure combination) .

Almost everything copied/scanned specially from a smaller format is "enhanced" (sharpened) in some measure to combat this lowering of response of photographic systems. I mentioned in another thread about the balance of grain and scanning, and, balancing the film (image) to look exactly flat (perfect straight line MTF response) is also as much an art as a science too. It even depends on how big you're watching the movie at when you do. That is why looking at that pic I conjectured that while on other less contrasty areas of the picture the general response/setting used might work, on that particular very contrasty black suit edge against bright sky (a kind of full on/full off situation) the acutance effect would be much higher than normal - near the extreme, and then it may be showing all too clearly. It could be lessened by lowering the sharpness in the transfer for that particular shot or area for a more consistent look (but then the shot wouldn't be sharp). Or someone make instead of manual wire removal filters, edge enhancement removal filters!

All I know is the sharper the projection, the easier it is to see these film haloes around contrasty edges, specially against something like a bright sky. But most theaters don't tend to focus as they used to do (or like I used to do, with emulsion in orientation winding and other projection sharpening tricks) anymore.

Originally Posted by Robert W Boyer , Shooting Film - Ilford HP5 plus

Pyro is high acutance, meaning it did not dissolve the edges of the film grain and exhibited the mackie effect to some degree (enhanced edges between areas of high contrast), sort of like an automatic unsharp mask. Last but not least the image densities were composed of both silver and dye stain. The reason I used HP5 plus with pyro was specifically for the staining characteristics that the film had relative to other films and the speed. Pyro was not really a high speed developer you could expect the films sensitivity to go down almost a stop compared with other developers.

The image staining was amazing in that it added to the acutance effects but masked the grain structure giving you a very smooth super sharp image effect. It also acted as a variable built in contrast mask as densities on the film when up the dye stain became stronger in proportion.

[Show spoiler]

http://photo.rwboyer.com/2009/06/02/...ford-hp5-plus/

[emgesp]

My eyes!!! How did we ever put up with DVD quality?

http://www.caps-a-holic.com/hd_vergl...ss=1#vergleich

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by tylergfoster

I suspect this is what people are seeing in The Fog, too.

I doubt it. As deci said, that effect tends to show on areas of very high contrast, whereas I can see haloes on the dimly lit two-shot of JLC and Tom Atkins in bed (as well as the brighter shots, natch). The EE on The Fog is probably there to sharpen up what is a very soft IP.

[dvdmike]

Originally Posted by Blu-21

The Mastered in 4K version of Men in Black looks terrific, a substantial upgrade over the previous Blu-Ray, yes it still has what looks like baked in EE, but the detail, colours, grain compression and sharpness is night and day different.

http://www.caps-a-holic.com/hd_vergl...ess=#vergleich

Already talked about this and last page

[lolwut]

Originally Posted by dvdmike

For fun:

http://www.caps-a-holic.com/hd_vergl...628&lossless=1

Now do VHS!

[The Fallen Deity]

Sony should stick to mastering titles in this series that weren't sourced from 4K scans originally. Re-releasing films which already have 4K scans on Blu-Ray is pointless.

It would be pretty amazing if other studios jumped on this. Universal I'm looking at you in particular.

A M4K release of the Back To The Future trilogy would be amazing.

[42041]

Originally Posted by The Fallen Deity

It would be pretty amazing if other studios jumped on this. Universal I'm looking at you in particular.

It would be, but they won't. Sony's the only studio that has any reason beside good will to push for 4K, since they make TVs, players, cameras, projectors, etc. For everyone else, it's just another expense. I'd be shocked if Sony's making a profit on these re-releases in the short term.

[dvdmike]

Originally Posted by The Fallen Deity

Sony should stick to mastering titles in this series that weren't sourced from 4K scans originally. Re-releasing films which already have 4K scans on Blu-Ray is pointless.

It would be pretty amazing if other studios jumped on this. Universal I'm looking at you in particular.

A M4K release of the Back To The Future trilogy would be amazing.

They did the others for cost reasons to bulk out the range

[BrandonJF]

Originally Posted by Blu-21

The Mastered in 4K version of Men in Black looks terrific, a substantial upgrade over the previous Blu-Ray, yes it still has what looks like baked in EE, but the detail, colours, grain compression and sharpness is night and day different.

http://www.caps-a-holic.com/hd_vergl...ess=#vergleich

That looks like the biggest difference I've seen so far with these "mastered in 4k" discs. I guess it speaks more to how bad the original transfer was...