Blu-rays are 8 years old and DVDs still cling to them like a cancerous tumor. Why?

[octagon]

Originally Posted by Tok

DVD is a Toyota. Blu-ray is Lexus. Sure Toyota can get you there but going in a Lexus is a better experience.

Streaming is public transportation.

That assumes the Lexus can take you where you want to go. That's not always the case.

[UseY0ur1llusi0n]

Originally Posted by Tok

DVD is a Toyota.

Toyota makes me car sick.

[Dynamo of Eternia]

Originally Posted by Anthony P

that makes no sense and shows your complete ignorance

you can't move from "sometimes" to "just as often" without proving that both A and B have the exact same frequency.

I'm not ignorant at all and my point makes plenty of sense.

Frankly the problem here is how seriously and literally you took Octagon's statement of "just as often." It was more of an off the cuff general statement. It wasn't meant to be some deep, hard hitting statistic. Yet you've latched onto it as if it is the core point of all of this, which it was not.

This goes back to something I said to you previously in another thread a while back... you tend to respond to things like this like Sheldon from the Big Bang Theory. And no, not in terms of his intelligence, but rather his tendency to get hung up on petty details, figures of speech (taking them literally), and technicalities to the point of completely detracting from the main point of the conversation (i.e. when asked if he'd like some chili, and he sees there is beans in it, he gets hung up on it not technically being chili because of te beans, rather than simply answering yes or no).

And frankly this seems to be a case of OCD on your part since you getting hung up on these things has a negative impact on having a constructive conversation about the topic at hand. Regardless of whether someone watching content only available on DVD makes up 1%, 10%, 20%, 50%, or 80% of their overall home media viewing, the general point being made remains the same. All that you've managed to do with your moronic examples is detract from the point of the conversation at hand. Congtratulations.

3) as for OCD here is the definition
http://www.cmha.ca/mental_health/obs...sive-disorder/

"Many of us have small habits that make us feel better, but we can also live without them. For example, we might think of something as ‘lucky’ or have a routine that feels comforting. But for people who experience obsessive-compulsive disorder (OCD), these behaviours are much more intense and disruptive and are fuelled by unwanted thoughts that don’t go away. Obsessive-compulsive disorder is not always easy to understand, but it’s a real illness that causes difficulties in a person’s life"

so the question is can you live without it and does it disrupt your life.

If someone sais I don't care about quality and I want to watch X so I will watch X on DVD then there is (at least in the statement) no sign of disruption and so it is not a sign of OCD
.
If someone sais I care about quality and I want to watch X but I will watch Y instead since it will do the job of entertaining me just as well as X then it is not a sign of OCD since he can live without watching X at that point in time (i.e. possibly an example of what is described at first as "small habits that make us feel better" or as I called it earlier as "a bit of OCD" since it is more descriptive.

the issue tends to happen when someone cares about quality but often it must be an exact title. Then it shows that often the person isn't willing to live with a different title as well as a disruption in his life because the person is not getting the quality he said is important to him.

can't you see both of those options have negative impacts?

It depends on how you define negative, and the level of importance of the quality to the individual.

See, I care about quality (and willopt for it when available), but not so much that I'm overly bothered watching something in SD when it's the only option available for a particular piece of content. Whether or not there's other content that I like just as much, if not more so is neither here nor there. For the content that I enjoy that I have on Blu-Ray, I'll generally opt to watch it in tne best quality possible (and even then there are comprimises... i.e. occasionally opting to lay in bed and watch a blu-ray movie in the smaller bedroom tv instead of on my main set up), but I won't refuse to watch a movie or show that I like in SD when it's the only option available.

And let's remove the SD/HD issue from the equation for the moment, and focus on the content, itself.

I'm a fan of many different TV shows and movies. Some I like better than others. It doesn't mean that I never revisit and rewatch one piece of content just because there is another that I like better. Obviously I'm not going to make it a point to rewatch content that completely I hate, but not everything that I do like and revisit is necessarily liked equally.

But if we apply your OCD/negative argument about HD vs SD to the content, itself, then arguably no one should ever rewatch anything other than their absolute top favorite movies since spending time rewatching other movies that they still liked a lot, but not quite as much as others would be waste, based on your logic. But this is where the slope gets slippery. Even if someobe has a top 10 list of movies, this argument could be applied further to argue that watching anything other than their #1 film would be a waste. Of course if they did that, many people would likely get tired of that one film, and would want to watch other things. But that means comprimising. Trying out new things, even if they may not be good.... and revisting things that they do like, even if there are other things that they like better, since some degree of variety helps keep things interesting. Comprimising isn't necessarily a negative thing. It's a necessary and pretty much inevitable in most aspects of life, whether we are talking about basic needs or luxuries. If the trade off is within reason to the individual, then it's not negative.

You buy a lot of movies, presumably with the intent of rewatching at least some of them, and you likely don't enjoy all of the ones tat you rewatch equally, but you still do so anyway. Is that 'OCD,' or is it just a reasonable comprimise that is necessary for ypu to enjoy your hobby? I would say it's the latter.

Taking this back to the quality topic, for me watching certain content in SD is a reasonable comprimise. It doesn't bother me to the extent that it does you. It's a trade off, sure, but most things are to some extent or another.

Heck, while I appreciate the quality of my newer TV and HDTVs in general, I'm really not a fan of the degree of noticable motion judder that is common with standard HDTV technologies. That was never really noticable to me (certainly not to this degree) on old SD CRT TVs. But since I absolutely hate those smooth motion features on modern sets and the 'soap opera' effect that goes with them, and since in pretty much all other respects HD technology is superior, I put up with the trade off when watching HD content. But I enjoy many old TV shows, particularly sitcoms. It really doesn't bother me to comprimise on the size or type of tv that I watch them on (the lack of noticable judder on an old crt tv is actually nice in these instances). So I deal with it. That may be a negative from your perspective, and therefore you don't make that choice. For me the negative would be in the reverse scenario... not having the content at all.

Also, watching some SD content here and there, whether on my main tv or another tv (whether it be a maller HTDTV or an old CRT TV) has a round bout positive effect for me when it comes to watching HD content. When I watch a lot of HD content on my main display, after a while the initial 'wow' of the size and quality starts to wear off and it becomes a common place standard. But when watching some SD content when the mood strikes, when I then go back to watching something in HD, it kind of helps bring that 'wow factor' back again. Perhaps not to the same extent as when it was new, but still more so than the case would have been otherwise. So I consider that to be a positive.





And frankly your position on this can have potential negarives depending on how far you take it. For example, if you are going to watch a movie with friens and/or family, and they really want to watch something that is only availabe on DVD (or may be available on Blu-Ray, but maybe they only have the DVD on hand at the time of deciding to watch it), do you put up a stink about not wanting to watch it since it's not in HD? Do you detract from everyone else's good time because of your OCD of only ever watching anything in HD?

What if someone recommends a movie that they thught was really good and would be something that (content wise) would be very, very much up your alley, but it's only on DVD? Sure, there may be other movies on BD that you haven't seen yet that you can spend your time watching, and you may even enjoy some f them, but perhaps not as much as you would this particular movieif ypu gave it a chance. Wouldn't cutting yourself off from a potentially great experience because of your arbitrary, self imposed HD only rules be a negative, and therefore by your standards cobstitute OCD?

And for that matter, since you fel no one should ever watch SD content in the age of HD, since we've had color tv for decades now, should no one ever watch a black and white movie?

And what about particularly bad HD transfers, or ones that are DNRed to death? What is your cut off point there? Or is your 'minimum' just simply the content being on BD and 'technically' being in HD, even if handled terribly?






And since you say that putting up with negatives constitutes OCD, I guess this means that I should give up on my quest for quality considering the headache it has been giving me since about mid summer.

I've posted in detail of the issues I've had in the Plasma TV section of the forum, but I'll summarize it here.

Up until this past summer, my main tv was a 37 inch 720p set that I've had for several years. I waited a long time to upgrade to get something really nice, because in the past other expenses kept coming up and getting a new TV would have meant comprimising on something of lesser quality than I would prefer.

Since Plasma has the better picture over LCD/LED, but is being discontinued, I decided to get one while they are still available. I decided to go with the Samsung F8500, which comes in 3 sizes... 51 inch, 60 inch, and 64 inch.

I initially got the 51 inch, figuring I'd be satisfied with the size upgrade since it was bigger than my previous set. It was nice, but not as much of an increase as I was hoping for. Since the store that I bought it from has a 2 week exchange window, I upgraded to the 60 inch. I was happy with the size, but the thing buzzed like crazy. I knew about plasma buzz, but this was distracting. I could hear it over the sound of anything I was watching.

Having found out that for some reason the 64 inch sets tended to not buzz as loudly as the 60s, I reluctantly upgraded. I say reluctantly because it was a good jump in price for what for me wasn't a major size increase.

I got it and it was great... at first. While in general the PQ was great, the buzzing wasn't at problematic levels, and I was very careful with breaking it in, the set developed many darkened areas on the screen that became noticable during normal viewing. I contacted Samsung customer service, and long story short, they changed out the panel on my set. And the new panel looked great.

BUT... after this repair occurred, the TV started having a problem where intermitently it wouldn't display a picture. Days could go by between occurances, but it happened. A tech was here last night looking at it, and thankfully it acted up while he was here. He swapped out some boards, but it was a no go, and the problem remained. He ended up taking it back to his shop with him, and I'll be following up with them this week. For now my old 37 inch set is bck in the living room until I get the new set back or replaced under warranty.

The level of frustration that I've gone through is beyond description. In addition to the details above, there was more than one occasion of the retailer screwing up the delivery scheduling of the TVs when being exchanged. Also, they kept puttig the wrong address down. I've previously ordered things like Blu-Rays from this retailler online and had them shipped. My wife and I live in a condo and have difficulty receiving packages through UPS and even the mail for anything that won't fit in our small mail box. So we ship everything to her grandmother's house. Well, as a result, despite me repeatedly stating and correcting the address to my home address (which is the billing address when placing such orders), they keep putting the wrong one down. In fact last night the tech went to the wrong address before coming to the correct one. It's all just been one cluster-f*** after another.

It's pretty much been a case of what can go wrong will go wrong, and every attempt to fix it seems to make the situation worse. And considering the money that I've spent, it's SUPER frustrating. It almost makes me not want to ever buy a big ticket luxury item like this again, and just stick with cheaper, lower level options. While the quality of my old 37 inch set is no where near that of the new set, at least it works as intended. After all of the BS that I've gone through, there's something almost refreshingly liberating about having the old lesser quality, but properly functioning TV back in the living room. Sure, it may just be a bunch of coincidental bad luck and HOPEFULLY all will be well soon once the repair company is done with the set, but it does raise the question of how much further should I take this before just getting a refund on the newer TV? My determination to have a nice quality set it what has kept me going forward with this despite all of the issues, but I'm just about at my wits end. This has been having a negative effect on me... FAR more so than watching The Cosby Show on DVD possibly ever could. I almost wish I had never attempted to upgrade at all.

So, by your estimation, is it OCD for me to continue the quest for quality? Or are you going to selectively apply your arguement only to certain things in a very decriminatory way?

agree, but you were the one that raised a stink about it ourt of the blue, for some it is realy disturbing you that others can more easily pick what the watch on given day and so they go with what looks better.

My point was about what the OP said elsewhere. And while I feel that it's silly to skip content due to it not being the absolute top quality, it's not so much that it bothers me if an individual chooses it for themselves, but when the OP stated i, he did so acting like everyone else is completely indsane for not prioritizing things in te exact manner that he does. That was my issue with it.

[Tok]

OCD is writing an essay on a topic that matters little.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by Tok

OCD is writing an essay on a topic that matters little.

Or........feeling the need to comment on someone who has wrote something that matters little to one's self.

[KelsieKatt]

As far as I'm concerned they should have stopped printing new releases on DVD a while ago. By all means keep selling older DVDs (especially for stuff not available on blu-ray), but there's really no good reason for new releases to continue to have them.

Blu-rays and players have been just as affordable as DVDs were for quite a while now, but the problem is no matter how many times blu-ray shifts the goal post, DVD always has to be cheaper because it's an inferior product and the ignorant masses will keep insisting that "blu-ray is too expensive and I can't afford it."

Even if you're still using an old CRT you can still use adapters to hook up a blu-ray player (assuming it doesn't include a composite connection already.) You obviously won't get any benefit from the picture or sound quality, but there's plenty of special features that aren't possible on DVD and the Pop Up Menu is a god send.

[eiknarf]

Originally Posted by KelsieKatt

As far as I'm concerned they should have stopped printing new releases on DVD a while ago. By all means keep selling older DVDs (especially for stuff not available on blu-ray), but there's really no good reason for new releases to continue to have them.

Blu-rays and players have been just as affordable as DVDs were for quite a while now, but the problem is no matter how many times blu-ray shifts the goal post, DVD always has to be cheaper because it's an inferior product and the ignorant masses will keep insisting that "blu-ray is too expensive and I can't afford it."

Even if you're still using an old CRT you can still use adapters to hook up a blu-ray player (assuming it doesn't include a composite connection already.) You obviously won't get any benefit from the picture or sound quality, but there's plenty of special features that aren't possible on DVD and the Pop Up Menu is a god send.

It's just annoying to still see DVDs because, well, like everything else, when a new thing comes out, it eventually replaces the previous thing.
Are we still taking a horse to work? No, we drive a car.
Are we still putting our food in an icebox? Nope, we use an electric powered refrigerator.
Do people still wear their jeans up to their bellybutton? No. Its not the 80's.
Do people still use rotary telephones with a long cord? No, they're push button, wireless, and mobile.
And so on.
okay guys I gotta go. I gotta hand write a letter, seal it with my own wax, and have a messenger deliver it on horseback across country. bye

[ashedmaniac]

Originally Posted by eiknarf

Do people still wear their jeans up to their bellybutton? No. Its not the 80's.

I still wear my...um...

okay guys I gotta go. I gotta hand write a letter, seal it with my own wax, and have a messenger deliver it on horseback across country. bye

You old romantic, you.

[Liverpool Red]

At least I can still play DVD's on my craptastic blu-ray player. The quality of players the past few years is sad. Would love to get a Oppo, but really can't afford one

[jscoggins]

Originally Posted by Liverpool Red

At least I can still play DVD's on my craptastic blu-ray player. The quality of players the past few years is sad. Would love to get a Oppo, but really can't afford one

Be glad that you didn't spend the money on an Oppo as there are some update/upgrade problems.

[Movie shy]

I just got a blu ray player in late March of this year. For years I had been buying dvd's . I stopped buying DVD's a few years ago when I realized my dvd's looked awful on my HD Vizio TV that I have. My tv is only 26 or 32 inches but because it's HD it just didn't make sense for me to keep buying dvd's. When the blu ray format came out it made no sense for me to buy a blu ray since I had an old analog tv and the cost of blu ray players and blu ray disks were way out of my price range. I've always been a film buff and love nothing more than watching a good film especially on blu ray. When I got my Sony BDP 3200 player this year I started buying lots of cheap blu rays. Over the summer I bought many 5 dollar blu rays at Best Buy which included 9 james Bond films, The Hustler etc. I got the Back to the Future trilogy for 14.99 at target over the summer. My first blu ray I bought was the combo pack of The ten Commandments with Ben Hur. Those movies looked stunning even on my small Vizio HD TV. I am someone who likes it when a blu ray comes with a dvd in the package because I have a portable dvd player that I got years ago that still works. My best blu ray purchase is the complete Twilight Zone on blu ray. I had always loved that show and the black and white episodes look so good on blu ray. I wasn't sure how black and white films or tv shows would look on blu ray but after watching The Twilight Zone on blu ray I'm a believer that you don't just need to have something filmed in color look great on blu ray.

[Geoff D]

The Oppo's can be fiddly little ****ers re: firmware niggles but they're great machines, if only for the build quality.

[jscoggins]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

The Oppo's can be fiddly little ****ers re: firmware niggles but they're great machines, if only for the build quality.

Once upon a time, I bought an Oppo region-free DVD player. It cost me quite a bit of money. Not long after, I went to China and found out that Oppo was one of many companies selling hardware on the cheap. The same machine could be had in China for about an eighth of what I paid.

Oppo = never again.

[Mansinthe]

well OPPO like many high end player (azur?) are made in china or the parts come from china and they are only assembled somewhere else. thats not really a secret.

you would most likely get the same results if you are not much into high end analog audio output by just using a cheap 70$ player and having that one made region free (chip or software)

[Anthony P]

Originally Posted by octagon

1) Do lossy audio tracks meet the minimum acceptable quality standards you've been talking about?

honestly audio is more complicated. For example if there is a monologue there is no difference between a lossy and a lossless track at that time because the lossy will have enough BW to losslessly portray that speech. Even if there is a loss in a lossless track (maybe a very silent dialogue with a lot of ambient noise that is not easily compressed) there won't be a loss that truly affects the experience (i.e. you will get 100% of the content) it really only becomes an issue if there is an overly complex musical score where the BW in the lossy is not enough for all the necessary data and you lose a tiny fraction of the richness of the sound.

I prefer lossless since it guarantees that nothing will be lost but there is also a good chance that with a good lossless (which is also usualy better than the DVD when they don't go lossless) nothing will be lost anyways.

2) Is watching the Goodfellas BD a waste of time for somebody who cares about quality?

I watched it a long time ago (got into 2007 because in the 90's my Bill was a big fan of the film and it would be a good film to watch when they are here visiting) Since I have not seen it since then (not a big fan of the film and there are much better mob films to watch out there) it is hard for me to comment on it.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by DetroitSportsFan

Look at the Black Friday ads. DVD is still king, and not going anywhere anytime soon.

Come next June 20th, please change the title of this thread to “Blu-rays are 9 years old and DVDs still cling to them like a cancerous tumor. Why?”.

If there still be whining then...the whining should be accurate , in the later half of 2015.

[Anthony P]

Originally Posted by Dynamo of Eternia

I'm not ignorant at all and my point makes plenty of sense.

Frankly the problem here is how seriously and literally you took Octagon's statement of "just as often." It was more of an off the cuff general statement. It wasn't meant to be some deep, hard hitting statistic. Yet you've latched onto it as if it is the core point of all of this, which it was not.

This goes back to something I said to you previously in another thread a while back... you tend to respond to things like this like Sheldon from the Big Bang Theory. And no, not in terms of his intelligence, but rather his tendency to get hung up on petty details, figures of speech (taking them literally), and technicalities to the point of completely detracting from the main point of the conversation (i.e. when asked if he'd like some chili, and he sees there is beans in it, he gets hung up on it not technically being chili because of te beans, rather than simply answering yes or no).

And frankly this seems to be a case of OCD on your part since you getting hung up on these things has a negative impact on having a constructive conversation about the topic at hand. Regardless of whether someone watching content only available on DVD makes up 1%, 10%, 20%, 50%, or 80% of their overall home media viewing, the general point being made remains the same. All that you've managed to do with your moronic examples is detract from the point of the conversation at hand. Congtratulations.

no I just post with integrity and hope that others do the same. If he seriously exaggerated just to make a point that does not actually help with making the point and there is nothing wrong with calling it out

As for Sheldon if you mean extremely knowledgeable, that is true. But I would rather be like Sheldon than Zack (being ignorant while other intelligent people need to pretend the comments are not ignorant just to be nice.)

But if we apply your OCD/negative argument about HD vs SD to the content, itself, then arguably no one should ever rewatch anything other than their absolute top favorite movies since spending time rewatching other movies that they still liked a lot, but not quite as much as others would be waste, based on your logic.

not at all, why would that be true there are many reasons to watch a particular title. For example You yourself mentioned previously your wife watching a title your wife likes, since you went out of your way to mention it is a title your wife really likes, I am guessing it might not end up as high on your list.

You buy a lot of movies, presumably with the intent of rewatching at least some of them, and you likely don't enjoy all of the ones tat you rewatch equally, but you still do so anyway.

I buy lots of movies with the intent that someone watches them (mostly me but there were some titles I bought that I really did not care for and they were bought so others would enjoy) nothing further. Some people are renters while others, like myself, are buyers. Only renters have that notion of "more than once" built into their psyche.
Even though some films I will watch again, I just see it as an added bonus if I do.

Is that 'OCD,' or is it just a reasonable comprimise that is necessary for ypu to enjoy your hobby?

none, it is a fact of life some films you want to re-watch and some you don't because they were not that good.

Taking this back to the quality topic, for me watching certain content in SD is a reasonable comprimise. It doesn't bother me to the extent that it does you. It's a trade off, sure, but most things are to some extent or another.

but isn't that the point? the minute you say it is a trade off you lost the argument because it should be does there need to be a trade-off and why?

And frankly your position on this can have potential negarives depending on how far you take it. For example, if you are going to watch a movie with friens and/or family, and they really want to watch something that is only availabe on DVD (or may be available on Blu-Ray, but maybe they only have the DVD on hand at the time of deciding to watch it), do you put up a stink about not wanting to watch it since it's not in HD? Do you detract from everyone else's good time because of your OCD of only ever watching anything in HD?

not at all, the issue is you are still pretending it is 2006 when your point might have been somewhat valid. We are 2014 all my friends have BD players and my DVDs have been moved to bins a long time ago because the shelf space was needed for my BDs. Why do you assume that in 2014 the only film a group of people can agree will make all of them happy can only be found on DVD?

Also for the most part when there is movie watching at someone's home it is at my place in my HT on my 10' wide screen. And when I am invited elsewhere and we will be watching movies usualy I am asked to bring them since most people are not collectors/buyers.

So, by your estimation, is it OCD for me to continue the quest for quality? Or are you going to selectively apply your arguement only to certain things in a very decriminatory way

no just shows that you have a gift for bad decisions and self delusion since you would rather blame "quality" than bad choices.

[Anthony P]

Originally Posted by Tok

OCD is writing an essay on a topic that matters little.

lol

[jono3000]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

Come next June 20th, please change the title of this thread to “Blu-rays are 9 years old and DVDs still cling to them like a cancerous tumor. Why?”.

If there still be whining then...the whining should be accurate , in the later half of 2015.

Out of interest, what happened on June 20th? First retail BD release?

[Anthony P]

Originally Posted by jono3000

Out of interest, what happened on June 20th? First retail BD release?

it was when the first BD films where released (50 First Dates, The Fifth Element, Hitch, House of Flying Daggers, Underworld: Evolution, xXx, and The Terminator in the US)