Prometheus (2012)

[jala12]

Originally Posted by raygendreau

[Show spoiler]“Originally known as the Ultramorph, this final incarnation of the PROMETHEUS mutations was always intended to be a missing link of sorts between this film and the other entries in the ALIEN series.
Effectively the unholy offspring of all the infected victims who came before it, Ridley Scott dubbed this creature The Deacon based on the pointed shape of its head, similar to a Bishop’s head-dress. This creature was originally intended to have more screen time, pursuing Shaw and David to the second Juggernaut ship, narrowly missing them as they leave the planet.
The original Alien’s trademark secondary jaw can be found in more undeveloped form with The Deacon. Based on the long protrusible jaws of the deep sea Goblin Shark, The Deacon’s secondary jaw ends the film with a nightmarish hint of possible horrors to come.” (Demons in the Dark: Creature Design, The Furious Gods: making of Prometheus)
Conclusion: The Deacon is not a queen. There is no queen in Alien. Neither Ridley Scott nor Giger created a queen. The queen was a creation of James Cameron for Aliens. Giger did not work on Aliens.

I was saying that it was NOT a queen. But if that information is meant to back up my post, then thanks.

[raygendreau]

Originally Posted by jala12

I was saying that it was NOT a queen. But if that information is meant to back up my post, then thanks.

Yes. Backup.

[nycomet]

Originally Posted by jala12

I was saying that it was NOT a queen. But if that information is meant to back up my post, then thanks.

It can't be a queen because using a corolation with bees, a queen can only come from another queen unless you're saying David is a queen. David did not spawn with the alien DNA and even if he did he has no DNA -- unless part of his biomechanism was generated from Weyland, in which case the queen-like spawn was actually part engineer, part Weyland. The new-born alien that emerged from the engineer did appear to have an egg sack, but I believe that was just the placenta. Despite the fact that it had a multi-mouth, it was very different from the alien species seen in the familiar alien movie series. I am now wondering if the PREDATOR species is somehow an off-shoot of the engineer life forms since they seem to be in a never-ending battle with the alien genus. Will a future Prometheus sequel suggest that the engineers evolved (or devolved) into the so-called predators? If that happens my nipples will dry up and fall off.

[snakemaster7]

Originally Posted by nycomet

I am now wondering if the PREDATOR species is somehow an off-shoot of the engineer life forms since they seem to be in a never-ending battle with the alien genus. Will a future Prometheus sequel suggest that the engineers evolved (or devolved) into the so-called predators? If that happens my nipples will dry up and fall off.

Oh hell no!

[raygendreau]

Originally Posted by nycomet

It can't be a queen because using a corolation with bees, a queen can only come from another queen unless you're saying David is a queen. David did not spawn with the alien DNA and even if he did he has no DNA -- unless part of his biomechanism was generated from Weyland, in which case the queen-like spawn was actually part engineer, part Weyland. The new-born alien that emerged from the engineer did appear to have an egg sack, but I believe that was just the placenta. Despite the fact that it had a multi-mouth, it was very different from the alien species seen in the familiar alien movie series. I am now wondering if the PREDATOR species is somehow an off-shoot of the engineer life forms since they seem to be in a never-ending battle with the alien genus. Will a future Prometheus sequel suggest that the engineers evolved (or devolved) into the so-called predators? If that happens my nipples will dry up and fall off.

Yes. It was confirmed on the Prometheus bonus disc that the Deacon was born with a umbilical cord/placenta.

Scott has described the Predator/Alien films with a four letter word, so anything he is involved with in the future will not include the Predator.

Your nipples drying up and falling off would be a bad thing, right?

[s2mikey]

One thing I will say is that I hope that the Xenomorphs dont just turn out to be some science experiment as oppopsed to an evolving, developing creature. That would dumb it down and really ruin the whole enigma/intrigue of the Alien species.

I just hope they do this the right way in the second Prometheus film. Im not really that fond of even finding out that much about the Xenomorphs. Its almost as if Prometheus is trying to fill in some backstory that some of us didnt want to know about. Like some people here say - we dont want to be spoon fed everything. Well, I dont want them to turn my beloved xenomorphs into some engineering project. Or, even worse, some "science project gone wrong" which has been the basis for umpteen horror films and would relegate the Alien to B-grade bad guys instead of one of the greatest creations ever.

They better not fock it up. Evolution, not engineering.

[raygendreau]

Originally Posted by s2mikey

One thing I will say is that I hope that the Xenomorphs dont just turn out to be some science experiment as oppopsed to an evolving, developing creature. That would dumb it down and really ruin the whole enigma/intrigue of the Alien species.

I just hope they do this the right way in the second Prometheus film. Im not really that fond of even finding out that much about the Xenomorphs. Its almost as if Prometheus is trying to fill in some backstory that some of us didnt want to know about. Like some people here say - we dont want to be spoon fed everything. Well, I dont want them to turn my beloved xenomorphs into some engineering project. Or, even worse, some "science project gone wrong" which has been the basis for umpteen horror films and would relegate the Alien to B-grade bad guys instead of one of the greatest creations ever.

They better not fock it up. Evolution, not engineering.

Seems to me you have both. The Deacon is the product of serendipitous evolution. Under normal circumstances, an Engineer would not have had his dna introduced into the mix.

The weaponized (bio-mechanical device called the ampule) black goo (see chart previously posted for chemical name) is clearly engineered. It is used to wipe a planet clean of sentient life in 5-6 months to prepare it for the ritualistic reseeding. (this is stated in one of the selectable segments in the Furious Gods).

The probability that the Deacon will play a part in the sequel is close to 100% based on some text statements in selectable segments on the Furious Gods.

[BouCoupDinkyDau]

I still haven't had a chance to have a go at any of the special features yet. I was just about to listen to the commentary when my brother walked in and said, "What 'cha watchin?" ...so I had to show it to him.

[chip75]

Originally Posted by frogmort

I blind-bought this about a week ago after trying my best to avoid all spoilers, and in my opinion this is the best dark/serious sci-fi movie that has come out in several years. I've seen it twice now and I really love it.

I'd managed to do the same until the week of BD release in the UK. I was literally spoiler free then this treat popped up. Spoilers galore obviously!

Prometheus Blu-Ray Features, Alternative Endings and Bonus - YouTube

Originally Posted by BouCoupDinkyDau

I was just about to listen to the commentary when my brother walked in and said, "What 'cha watchin?" ...so I had to show it to him.

That just doesn't sound right....

[BouCoupDinkyDau]

Originally Posted by chip75

That just doesn't sound right....

Well, we are talking about horror.

[johnstrk]

Ok I'm now officially obsessed with this movie!! Can't get enough. I've watched it 2.5 times since the release last week, with my recent full viewing having the surround sound cranked up a little louder. Got about an hour left on the fantastic documentary. This is rapidly becoming one of the best releases & movie in my Blu-ray collection so far.

One note: in Alien, LV-426 is orbiting a giant planet with rings. LV-223 looks the same now that I think about it. Coincidence? Or do the Engineers just like testing their biological warfare projects out on moons that orbit giant planets with rings?

[ToEhrIsHuman]

Originally Posted by johnstrk

One note: in Alien, LV-426 is orbiting a giant planet with rings. LV-223 looks the same now that I think about it. Coincidence? Or do the Engineers just like testing their biological warfare projects out on moons that orbit giant planets with rings?

[Show spoiler]Same planet - different moons.

Glad you enjoyed the flick!

[s2mikey]

Originally Posted by johnstrk

Or do the Engineers just like testing their biological warfare projects out on moons that orbit giant planets with rings?

Ya know, I always wondered exactly how weapons like the Xenomorphs could be used against an enemy? I know they are bad ass and all that but I dont quite get how it would work? Do you drop a bunch of eggs somewhere near their base? Wouldnt they see them and be onto it quickly? Do you just drop a few Aliens into their jungles/outskirts and let them propogate?

Usually when I hear about bilogical warfare, I think of germs/diseases/plagues and stuff like that. Microscopic things that are very stealthy. There aint nothing stealthy about octopuses, xenomorphs, or any of the other creatues I saw in Prometheus.

And, none of these weapons seem to have answer for long range attacks - you can mow down xenomorphs at will with a good machine gun.

[raygendreau]

Originally Posted by johnstrk

One note: in Alien, LV-426 is orbiting a giant planet with rings. LV-223 looks the same now that I think about it. Coincidence? Or do the Engineers just like testing their biological warfare projects out on moons that orbit giant planets with rings?

In an early draft and for much of the production phase, the planet was going to be LV-426. It was never confirmed, once the change to LV-223 that it is in orbit around the same ringed gas planet that LV-223 orbits, but the inference is there. (This is discussed in detail on the Furious Gods).

Originally Posted by s2mikey

Ya know, I always wondered exactly how weapons like the Xenomorphs could be used against an enemy? I know they are bad ass and all that but I dont quite get how it would work? Do you drop a bunch of eggs somewhere near their base? Wouldnt they see them and be onto it quickly? Do you just drop a few Aliens into their jungles/outskirts and let them propogate?

Usually when I hear about bilogical warfare, I think of germs/diseases/plagues and stuff like that. Microscopic things that are very stealthy. There aint nothing stealthy about octopuses, xenomorphs, or any of the other creatues I saw in Prometheus.

And, none of these weapons seem to have answer for long range attacks - you can mow down xenomorphs at will with a good machine gun.

How it works: There are microscopic organisms in suspension in the black goo. The black goo is placed in ampules. The ampules are dropped on a planet. The organisms are released. They infect the sentient life. The sentient life is morphed into xenomorphs. The xenomorphs eradicate all indigenous sentient life on the planet in 5-6 months. It is more epidemic than warfare in the conventional sense.

[johnstrk]

So then what about all the vases of black goo? There were hundreds of them. I guess they could drop them off on planets for different species to find and become infected. I wonder why they were stockpiling so many of them. So many questions....

[johnstrk]

Originally Posted by ToEhrIsHuman

[Show spoiler]Same planet - different moons.

Got it thanks!

So then why didn't the human colonists visit this moon (LV-223) when they set out to terraform LV-426 just prior to Aliens? It would have had a better atmosphere for sustaining life and they might have found the Engineers & their pyramids.

Hope we find out a lot more about both moons in the sequels!!!

[johnstrk]

Originally Posted by raygendreau

The sentient life is morphed into xenomorphs. The xenomorphs eradicate all indigenous sentient life on the planet in 5-6 months. It is more epidemic than warfare in the conventional sense.

At least until the Predators come to hunt them or Colonial Marines arrive to kick their asses!!!

[raygendreau]

Originally Posted by johnstrk

So then what about all the vases of black goo? There were hundreds of them. I guess they could drop them off on planets for different species to find and become infected. I wonder why they were stockpiling so many of them. So many questions....

No need for indigenous life to find the ampules. The infection spreads through the air and the water.

Originally Posted by johnstrk

Got it thanks!

So then why didn't the human colonists visit this moon (LV-223) when they set out to terraform LV-426 just prior to Aliens? It would have had a better atmosphere for sustaining life and they might have found the Engineers & their pyramids.

Hope we find out a lot more about both moons in the sequels!!!

Trying to tie in Alien and Aliens films with Prometheus will lead to frustration, since the only relationship between Prometheus and Alien is the DNA of the Alien. As Scott said, you can see the DNA of the Alien in the Deacon. Nothing in Aliens is canon and very little in Alien is canon.

[BouCoupDinkyDau]

Originally Posted by johnstrk

At least until the Predators come to hunt them or Colonial Marines arrive to kick their asses!!!

All they need to know is one thing:
WHERE. THEY. ARE.

[johnstrk]

Originally Posted by raygendreau

Nothing in Aliens is canon and very little in Alien is canon.

Oh I seriously hope not. If there are indeed one or two sequels to Prometheus, then the closing scene of the final movie had better end with the The Derelict ship landing/crashing on LV-426 and the Engineer/Space Jockey sending out the distress call/warning just before a true Xenomorph bursts from his chest!!!