4K Movies Releases

[dvdmike]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

Helps to trim the highlights to achieve the final HDR look (grade)…..

Video Tutorial: Soft Clipping in DaVinci Resolve - YouTube

Exactly they are altering the film to give you the HDR look, that is supposed to "look more like what was actually there"
Or the other one "make it look at home more like film" rubbish if they have to alter what was actually there.

[bailey1987]

Originally Posted by dvdmike

Exactly they are altering the film to give you the HDR look, that is supposed to "look more like what was actually there"
Or the other one "make it look at home more like film" rubbish if they have to alter what was actually there.

Well compressing it down to 480p, 1080p or 2160p is doing the same thing. Or a better analogy would be to say changing its colour space from what ever film is to rec605 rec709 or rec2020 is the same.

[dvdmike]

Actually tthe compression of resolution can help due to down sampling

[spectre08]

I didn't realize it until I looked into it recently just how many movie even TODAY are being made with 2K digital intermediates.

Mad Mad: Fury Road
Avengers: Age of Ultron
Jurassic World


The age of the 2K DI is a dark period in this history of film technology, and one that needs to die FAST.


When UltraHD Blu-ray is in high gear there's going to be an interesting distribution of films that benefit from the format. With the exception of a few films from very recently that have been mastered in 4K DI, and a few films that were all film with no DI (pretty much just Christopher Nolan's films), the only releases that will be really good will be pre-2000.

George Lucas should be tarred and feathered.

[Spike M.]

Originally Posted by dvdmike

Exactly they are altering the film to give you the HDR look, that is supposed to "look more like what was actually there"
Or the other one "make it look at home more like film" rubbish if they have to alter what was actually there.

That's working under the false assumption that what's "naturally" shot is "better". The goal of any camera system is to give the filmmakers creative freedom, what the un-graded footage looks like doesn't matter. There's obvious creative miscalculations that can come about with this (hello Hobbit), but on the whole it's a massively dynamic way to get the director's vision for their film on screen with the upmost detail and precision.

It also seems like you don't really know much about how exposure works. Depending on the camera system, the information is there, it just hasn't been "brought out" because of how exposing highlights works. Saying it "isn't actually there" is wrong, since it is. Even in the small stuff I do as a film student, I expose the image knowing that I have X amount of stops I can bring out of the darks in post without noticeably reducing image quality or hurting the highlights. With this in mind I might underexpose something to bring out later; making the original footage I shot -not- what I intend to show. A captured image is like an onion, and just because the original negative doesn't visibly show something doesn't mean it isn't there. That's just the nature of how exposure works.

[PeterTHX]

Originally Posted by spectre08

George Lucas should be tarred and feathered.

[spectre08]

Originally Posted by PeterTHX

[Show spoiler]

I'm not wrong. How many filmmakers jumped on digital when it was still vastly inferior to film because Master Lucas told them it was the thing to do?

[dvdmike]

Originally Posted by spectre08

I didn't realize it until I looked into it recently just how many movie even TODAY are being made with 2K digital intermediates.

Mad Mad: Fury Road
Avengers: Age of Ultron
Jurassic World


The age of the 2K DI is a dark period in this history of film technology, and one that needs to die FAST.


When UltraHD Blu-ray is in high gear there's going to be an interesting distribution of films that benefit from the format. With the exception of a few films from very recently that have been mastered in 4K DI, and a few films that were all film with no DI (pretty much just Christopher Nolan's films), the only releases that will be really good will be pre-2000.

George Lucas should be tarred and feathered.

They are all 2k as they are 3d, same as it will be for all 3d shows.
There is no such thing as 4k 3d.

And Nolan shoots damn ugly films, huge magenta push and low detail.
People have been making films without di's for years and they can look a lot better.
Lucas deserves praise for a lot actually.

[spectre08]

Originally Posted by dvdmike

They are all 2k as they are 3d, same as it will be for all 3d shows.
There is no such thing as 4k 3d.

And Nolan shoots damn ugly films, huge magenta push and low detail.
People have been making films without di's for years and they can look a lot better.
Lucas deserves praise for a lot actually.

they don't have to be mastered in 2K in order to have 3D. In fact, all of those are 3D conversions, which means they went AFTER the master and made them 3D.

They could have just as easily used a 4K master, then cut it down to 2K for the 3D conversion.

[spectre08]

The Amazing Spider-Man both 1 & 2 are both 3D movies that used 4K DI

also:

Hunger Games: Mockingjay Pt. 1

[dvdmike]

Originally Posted by spectre08

The Amazing Spider-Man both 1 & 2 are both 3D movies that used 4K DI

also:

Hunger Games: Mockingjay Pt. 1

4k for the 2d versions as Sony mandaits a 4k finish on the flat versions.
Mockingjay is a 2d show converted to 3d for one territory, far from the same thing.

[spectre08]

Originally Posted by dvdmike

4k for the 2d versions as Sony mandaits a 4k finish on the flat versions.
Mockingjay is a 2d show converted to 3d for one territory, far from the same thing.

the point is the same though. Once a movie is finished in 2K it's done. the only way to ever restore it to 4K for UltraHD blu-ray would be to go back and do the DI process all over again, which would likely cost more than they would ever make back from the sale of UltraHD blu-rays.

on the other hand, if the film is finished in 4K then downsampling to 2K for the 3D conversion is a simple matter.

the point is that 2K DI needs to stop.

and Lucas still needs to be tarred and feathered

[spectre08]

Originally Posted by dvdmike

And Nolan shoots damn ugly films, huge magenta push and low detail.
People have been making films without di's for years and they can look a lot better.

other than Nolan's movies, what "blockbusters" in the last 15 years didn't have a DI?


Harry Potter 1 & 2 (everything after had 2K DI)
Pearl Harbor
The Fast & Furious 1 & 2 (everything after had 2K DI)
Signs
Men in Black II
X2: X-Men United
War of the Worlds


that's all I can turn up.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

Helps to trim the highlights to achieve the final HDR look (grade)…..
Video Tutorial: Soft Clipping in DaVinci Resolve - YouTube

Originally Posted by dvdmike

Exactly they are altering the film to give you the HDR look, that is supposed to "look more like what was actually there"
Or the other one "make it look at home more like film" rubbish if they have to alter what was actually there.

Mike, I don’t think you understood, as perhaps I didn’t make myself clear with my previously rushed post which you quoted above. My point was that after you do the Dolby Vision conversion to get your basic HDR grade to work on, the highlights may appear a little too bright than what the filmmaker desires, so a little tweaking with a tool like the Soft clip feature in Resolve can help in the trim pass for final look of the HDR DCP.

I was way beyond the classic film (photochemical) vs. digital finishing advocacy thing and more into describing the refinement of the final HDR grade.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by spectre08

DI

On a historical note as to how it all began - https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...ne#post9213621

[PeterTHX]

Originally Posted by spectre08

I'm not wrong. How many filmmakers jumped on digital when it was still vastly inferior to film because Master Lucas told them it was the thing to do?

Wrong-o. You're angry about DIs being finished at 2K.


The first film with a complete DI was O Brother, Where Art Thou? in 2000.


Which had absolutely nothing to do with George Lucas.


It had to do with an industry moving towards the goal of digitizing the negative as soon as possible. You could even argue Disney's CAPS system was the first. Again: nothing to do with Lucas.


And how is Lucas keeping the pipeline at most post houses at 2K?


So your Lucas derangement syndrome has no place here.

[dvdmike]

Originally Posted by PeterTHX

Wrong-o. You're angry about DIs being finished at 2K.


The first film with a complete DI was O Brother, Where Art Thou? in 2000.


Which had absolutely nothing to do with George Lucas.


It had to do with an industry moving towards the goal of digitizing the negative as soon as possible. You could even argue Disney's CAPS system was the first. Again: nothing to do with Lucas.


And how is Lucas keeping the pipeline at most post houses at 2K?


So your Lucas derangement syndrome has no place here.

Lucas's biggest mistake was the cameras they shot clones with

[spectre08]

Originally Posted by PeterTHX

Wrong-o. You're angry about DIs being finished at 2K.


The first film with a complete DI was O Brother, Where Art Thou? in 2000.


Which had absolutely nothing to do with George Lucas.


It had to do with an industry moving towards the goal of digitizing the negative as soon as possible. You could even argue Disney's CAPS system was the first. Again: nothing to do with Lucas.


And how is Lucas keeping the pipeline at most post houses at 2K?


So your Lucas derangement syndrome has no place here.

regardless of whether other people were doing it first Lucas was a HUGE early proponent of digitizing films for editing and VFX and shooting big mainstream films entirely digital.

You don't think it sent a HUGE message to the filmmaking community when the father of Star Wars opted to shot the newest installments entirely digital, and even went though the effort of working with Sony to develop the first "cinema quality" digital cameras?

He even held a conference at skywalker ranch to try and sell other filmmakers on the "benefits" of editing and doing post in digital!

He may not have been the first, but he was without question the biggest cheerleader, and the most influential person in hollywood championing this inferior garbage. long before it was ready for primetime.

[PeterTHX]

Originally Posted by spectre08

He may not have been the first, but he was without question the biggest cheerleader, and the most influential person in hollywood championing this inferior garbage. long before it was ready for primetime.

It still has nothing to do with your complaint of DIs still being 2k!

[spectre08]

Originally Posted by PeterTHX

It still has nothing to do with your complaint of DIs still being 2k!

true, it doesn't. My complaint with Lucas is that many films that could and should have been finished on film were rushed into DI, and many more began using HD digital cameras, because of his lobbying.