4K Blu-ray Confirmed, Coming in

[Jimmy Smith]

Originally Posted by DoctorDan860

The good news is that it seems like existing Blu-ray players, such as the PlayStation 4, will be able to play these disks, if only with a downsampled to 1080p image (such as when you play those "Mastered in 4K" discs).

There is not the smallest chance any currently existing device will play these. They use new codecs and discs that current players can't read

[octagon]

Originally Posted by SkyAntoine

80% of the people I know will unknowingly watch SD TV when the HD channel is available. My family only purchased BR players because I told them to and so they can borrow from my library.

If the masses could care less about 1080p then what hope is there for 4k?

Over the course of its lifespan LD never broke 2% household penetration but it was a viable format. For a period of several years (ten or more?) players were readily available and titles were released.

No studio is going to say 'okay, the revenues we get from 4k BD sales will justify restoring and remastering this title so let's get on it'. What could (and likely will) happen is pretty much what's happening with BD now. Studios will release new titles in a way that's compatible with the best available format and remaster older titles as part of their ongoing library maintenance. As those older titles are restored and remastered they'll trickle out into the physical market, more as an afterthought but still.

As long as some number (and I don't know exactly what that floor would be) of people are interested there will likely be some level of support for 4k physical releases.

Will 4K BDs spread like wildfire? No, almost certainly not. But they won't have to in order to be viable.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by SkyAntoine

80% of the people I know will unknowingly watch SD TV when the HD channel is available. My family only purchased BR players because I told them to and so they can borrow from my library.

If the masses could care less about 1080p then what hope is there for 4k?

It's couldn't care less. If they could care less that means it's possible for that person to care less, meaning they care a little.

On the flip side of your comments, most people I know watch the HD channels, especially for movies and football.

[KRW1]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

It's couldn't care less. If they could care less that means it's possible for that person to care less, meaning they care a little.

On the flip side of your comments, most people I know watch the HD channels, especially for movies and football.

I wonder how long it'll be before someone tries to tell us it'll be obsolete in 2020?

[mredman]

slicks world just came crashing down by this news lol

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by mredman

slicks world just came crashing down by this news lol

[David M]

Originally Posted by Richard Paul

I was delighted to find out that 4K Blu-ray would support the BT.2020 (or Rec. 2020) color space and this is the first time that a wider color space has been used on a consumer video format.

Now all we need is a display to show it (professional and then consumer!)

Rec.2020 has all the makings of a mess waiting to happen. Right now it looks like the next NTSC. Hoping to be proven wrong, of course.

[Richard Paul]

Originally Posted by Lyris

Rec.2020 has all the makings of a mess waiting to happen. Right now it looks like the next NTSC. Hoping to be proven wrong, of course.

The NTSC color space was a problem since even after 40 years of development CRT displays couldn't get close to it. In the early 1990's it made sense to use a smaller color space for HDTV so that it would match CRT phosphors. Current quantum dot backlights can do 97% of the Rec. 2020 color space while current LED backlights can do 80% (which is about 170% of the Rec. 709 color space). It now makes sense for consumer displays to move to a wider color space. Also I expect that 4K Blu-ray will support gamut mapping (so that it will work with any UHDTV that supports HDCP 2.2) and that it will support video encoding to smaller color spaces (such as DCI P3 and Rec. 709).

[jlk5844]

I'm excited to see this format come to fruition, but will these even be in stores? The discs I mean, given how stock of DVDs and Blu-rays at B&M's are gradually dwindling. Maybe they'll have their own small little section off to the side.

[Teazle]

Originally Posted by pro-bassoonist

There are wild interpretations flying around the web, many from a few of the usual suspects a.k.a. "DVD is Dead" gurus, but some reputable sources have had this bit:



The direct quotes that hurt: ()

Victor Matsuda, global promotions chair for the BDA and VP of Sony Corp.’s Blu-ray group:



I am almost willing to spend about 30 minutes so that I can quote myself with two posts from a few years ago. But Penton has already patented this practice

Pro-B

"Dual sided" discs for back compat so presumably flippers.

[REPLAY]

Originally Posted by KRW1

I wonder how long it'll be before someone tries to tell us it'll be obsolete in 2020?

2018 you will see 8K

[mrpink134]

I'm happy about this but worried, will the new players support HDCP2.2? How about the receivers? Heck even the 4k TV'S. It's well known that they want better copy right protection than HDMI. Here's whats making me wait until they get the 4K standards set first.

Source http://www.cnet.com/news/hdcp-2-2-wh...-need-to-know/

Thought all you needed to get a 4K TV working is HDMI 2.0? Guess again. The next generation of content protection is called HDCP 2.2, and not only is it not backwards compatible, many new 4K devices don't even support it.

So it's possible that the 4K TV you bought last year, or even the receiver you buy this year, might not be able to receive/pass all future 4K content.

Sound crazy? Sadly, it's not. Here's the skinny.

What it is

Copy protection/content protection has been around since the VHS era, something anyone who tried to copy a Blockbuster rental can tell you. Back then it was called Macrovision, which evolved to CSS for DVD and finally HDCP, which stands for High-bandwidth digital Content Protection, for Blu-ray players and HDTV devices like satellite and cable boxes.

HDCP 2.2 is the latest evolution of copy protection. It's designed to create a secure connection between a source and a display. Ostensibly this is so you can't take the output from a source (a Blu-ray player, say) and plug it into some kind of recorder, to make a copy of the content. DRM, the encryption of the content itself, is a separate issue. HDCP doesn't care what goes across the cable, as long as that cable is secure.

It does this by creating encrypted keys between the source and the display (called the sink). Enabled repeaters, like receivers, can be in the chain as well. The source and the sink need to be in agreement, understanding their keys, or no content gets transferred. If you've ever hooked up gear and gotten a blank screen (or turned on gear in the wrong order and gotten a blank screen), this HDCP "handshake" is usually the issue.

HDCP isn't solely over HDMI. It can be implemented to work over DVI, DisplayPort, USB, and more.

So what's new? The encryption on the keys in version 2.2 is more advanced than previous versions which, in theory, makes the whole chain harder to break. One other interesting change with 2.2 is a "locality check." The source sends a signal to the sink, and if the sink doesn't get that signal within 20ms, the source kills the connection. In theory, this shouldn't cause any issues in home setups, even over long HDMI runs (unless you have more than 3,740 miles of cable). This is about UltraHD 4K

You don't need to ditch your gear just yet. HDCP 2.2 is essentially about UltraHD 4K copy protection. So for now anyone with (or buying) a non-4K 1080p TV doesn't need to worry. Once we start seeing more widely available 4K content, it will be more of an issue.

Which leads us to...

Your current gear is not 2.2-upgradable, but that's probably OK

There's no firmware upgrade that will get 2.2 working on a non-2.2 product. At least, not on a product that wasn't designed with at least some idea about 2.2. For the time being, as we've said, it's not a big deal if you're planning on sticking with 1080p.

Your current devices will work fine with new HDCP 2.2 devices, presuming you're not trying to send content with 2.2. As in, your current Blu-ray player will send 1080p to a 2.2-enabled receiver, or to a 4K TV, with no issues.

Wireless

You may also "see" HDCP 2.2 in new wireless gear, like those with Miracast or WirelessHD. Since wireless 4K has only recently been announced at all, this isn't an immediate issue. It's safe to assume, though, that to get the content to and from the wireless transmitter and receivers, you'll still need HDCP 2.2 on your receiver/source and display (so the whole chain is 2.2).

What TVs?

The current crop of 4K TVs from Samsung, LG, Panasonic, and Sony, etc. list HDCP 2.2 compliance in their specifications. This is a good sign. If you have a 4K TV already, or are looking at a non-tier 1 brand, make sure you scour the specs for HDCP 2.2. If it's not 2.2-compliant, you might be out of luck as this new encryption is rolled out.

As in, if you bought one of the first 4K TVs, generally released in 2013, it may not work with whatever dedicated 4K content comes out in the near future.

Not Just TVs

The problem extends throughout the chain. Run your HDMI through a receiver or soundbar? They'll need to be HDCP 2.2 compliant as well. It's important to note, there are many receivers shipping this year that have HDMI 2.0, but are not HDCP 2.2 compliant. That might be an issue eventually, as we've discussed.

To put it another way, all HDCP 2.2 devices will have HDMI 2.0, but not all HDMI 2.0 will have HDCP 2.2. Very few receivers have 2.2 right now.

This is important to consider, since most people hold on to receivers a lot longer than than any specific TV.

Resistance is Futile

In reality, HDCP 2.2 will be broken, just like all its predecessors (including 2.0 and 2.1). Such is the nature of codes and codebreaking. So why bother? To make casual copying difficult, for one, and to appease shareholders on the other. The movie industry is a big, publicly traded, business, and it's any CEO fiduciary responsibility to do everything they can to make sure their product is as profitable as possible (i.e. not easily stolen).

The result, unfortunately, is a potential hassle for those of us not trying to steal content, and just trying to set up a new TV.

For now, HDCP 2.2 is something to have in the back of your head, but not something worth worrying about. That is, unless you're planning on making the move to 4K, or buying something that will last a while, like a receiver. Then it's worth making sure it has HDCP 2.2 just to make it as "futureproof" as possible.

[HD Goofnut]

I knew that one day I would have to change my name to UHD Goofnut.

[crazyBLUE]

Originally Posted by HD Goofnut

I knew that one day I would have to change my name to UHD Goofnut.

We don't do that anymore HD

[jlk5844]

Originally Posted by crazyBLUE

We don't do that anymore HD

I wish I could change my name. I wasn't even thinking about it when I signed up for this site.

[Richard Paul]

Originally Posted by Teazle

"Dual sided" discs for back compat so presumably flippers.

My guess is that the website which posted that it was backward compatible made a mistake.

Originally Posted by mrpink134

I'm happy about this but worried, will the new players support HDCP2.2? How about the receivers? Heck even the 4k TV'S.

4K Blu-ray, and future premium UHDTV services, will most likely require HDCP 2.2.

[HD Goofnut]

Originally Posted by crazyBLUE

We don't do that anymore HD

Oh, well.

[mrpink134]

Originally Posted by Richard Paul

My guess is that the website which posted that it was backward compatible made a mistake.


4K Blu-ray, and future premium UHDTV services, will most likely require HDCP 2.2.

That is what I am saying? How many receivers out now have HDCP 2.2? How many TV'S. The only thing that's stopping me from buying a new receiver and a TV is because of HDCP 2.2

[blurayjunkie]

I am excited about this news, as one day I will have a 4KTV and will buy Blu-Ray 4K media. What I am not so excited about is the 66-100GB disc limit, I thought the disc space limit would be bigger. Why even bother with a 66GB disc? Why not have 100GB as the bare min for 4K video and bump it up from there.

[luis figo]

Originally Posted by blurayjunkie

I am excited about this new, as one day I will have a 4KTV and will buy Blu-Ray 4K media. What I am not so excited about is the 66-100GB disc limit, I thought the disc space limit would be bigger. Why even bother with a 66GB disc? Why not have 100GB as the bare min for 4K video and bump it up from there.

I agree, seems small for the amount of storage and technology available nowadays.