Twilight Time Discussion Thread

[StarDestroyer52]

Originally Posted by jayembee

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mill_Creek_Entertainment

They've put out some interesting titles (I just bought a couple of their new Double Feature Blu-rays), but in the context of boutique labels they aren't much to get excited about.

There not in the upper echelons of the boutique labels but they do IMO serve an important niche. They put out a lot of Sony/Universal TV shows, did decent work with the Mothra Steelbook, the Ultraman series, and the Sidaris films. Of course, they are never going to be Criterion or even the same care that Twilight Time did, but I'm glad they are here.

[SeanJoyce]

Say what you will about Mill Creek, but their retro VHS edition of Silent Rage is one of my prized Blu-ray possessions.

[jayembee]

Originally Posted by StarDestroyer52

I must admit that I didn't understand what the one user meant when it would become like another Mill Creek.

It wasn't really intended as a slam. Well, maybe not as a SLAM!

I do have a selection of Mill Creek releases, and they aren't bad, exactly, and they do put out some interesting titles that might otherwise not see the light of day on Blu-ray. It's that their early days were spent as pretty much a Public Domain label, and while they've graduated beyond that, they still don't seem to put a lot of effort into their releases. The encoding on their discs is inconsistent -- sometimes awful, sometimes decent, never (from the ones I've seen) outstanding. Their TV sets (at least the two I have: The Rockford Files and Quantum Leap) are over-compressed. I'm glad I have the ones I have, because I might not otherwise have the films/shows on my shelf.

But bottom line, they are a far cry from Twilight Time. Or Indicator. Or Eureka. Or Kino. If SAE ends up releasing new discs under the TT banner, who knows what the results might be. They might put out the kind of product that the TT we all know and love put out, or they might just slap a film on a disc and call it a day, which IMHO is what Mill Creek does.

[StarDestroyer52]

Originally Posted by jayembee

It wasn't really intended as a slam. Well, maybe not as a SLAM!

I do have a selection of Mill Creek releases, and they aren't bad, exactly, and they do put out some interesting titles that might otherwise not see the light of day on Blu-ray. It's that their early days were spent as pretty much a Public Domain label, and while they've graduated beyond that, they still don't seem to put a lot of effort into their releases. The encoding on their discs is inconsistent -- sometimes awful, sometimes decent, never (from the ones I've seen) outstanding. Their TV sets (at least the two I have: The Rockford Files and Quantum Leap) are over-compressed. I'm glad I have the ones I have, because I might not otherwise have the films/shows on my shelf.

But bottom line, they are a far cry from Twilight Time. Or Indicator. Or Eureka. Or Kino. If SAE ends up releasing new discs under the TT banner, who knows what the results might be. They might put out the kind of product that the TT we all know and love put out, or they might just slap a film on a disc and call it a day, which IMHO is what Mill Creek does.

I agree, there are still some problems with a lot of their work like Miami Vice and if another label were to release a Mill Creek film I own then there's a high chance I would re-buy the new release. I think as for Twilight Time, what the press release really means is that SAE has the rights to the remaining stock if all 3,000 copies haven't been printed then it means SAE can print the remaining copies and that's it.

[jayembee]

Originally Posted by StarDestroyer52

I agree, there are still some problems with a lot of their work like Miami Vice and if another label were to release a Mill Creek film I own then there's a high chance I would re-buy the new release.

I've done that with several that I replaced with Indicator editions.

I think as for Twilight Time, what the press release really means is that SAE has the rights to the remaining stock if all 3,000 copies haven't been printed then it means SAE can print the remaining copies and that's it.

No doubt. But even in the updated version of the press release, the phrase "The agreement ensures that the Twilight Time label will continue indefinitely, according to the principals" sounds like more than that. The label will not "continue indefinitely" if it's just a matter of taking in all of the unsold stock. If that was the case, the label wouldn't continue past the point where all copies of all TT's releases are sold (unless SAE doesn't think they'll ever sell them all). That would still be the case whether they print more discs up to the 3000-copy limitation or not.

The only way the label continues on ("indefinitely" maybe be over-selling it) is if SAE does something new with it. That's why I said "It's certainly possible that SAE will end up buying the name and trademark, and continue the line." The "possible" was deliberately emphasized. "Possible" doesn't mean I think it will happen, just that there may be a non-zero chance of it happening.

And, with all due respect to Mill Creek, if SAE makes the same effort that MC does with any new releases, and does it under the "Twilight Time" name, it would be like Bruce Wayne retiring from crimefighting and letting Blue Beetle take over as Batman. Blue Beetle is a perfectly good Blue Beetle, and he has his place in the crimefighter community, but he'd be one lousy Batman.

Then again, SAE might do better than any of us expect.

[marblearch]

Originally Posted by drownsoda

I don't mean SAE just purchasing the remaining stock of TT's discs (or whatever is left after TT's online store goes offline). I was referring to SAE's first newsletter from yesterday that indicated they would be reprinting select titles from TT and that the TT would continue "indefinitely" through them. They subsequently sent out a second newsletter that excised any mention of reprinting though, so it does seem kind of odd. If they're only acquiring the leftovers from TT's stock to sell, that's not "indefinite"—all that means is they're selling off the crumbs left behind once TT ceases operations.

The first version of the newsletter certainly generated a bit of debate. They removed the line pretty quickly. Personally i think once these titles are gone thats it as SAE are just selling off the stock. Whoever has written the newsletter certainly does not understand the meaning of the word indefinite.

[hariseldon]

Originally Posted by jayembee

I've done that with several that I replaced with Indicator editions.



No doubt. But even in the updated version of the press release, the phrase "The agreement ensures that the Twilight Time label will continue indefinitely, according to the principals" sounds like more than that. The label will not "continue indefinitely" if it's just a matter of taking in all of the unsold stock. If that was the case, the label wouldn't continue past the point where all copies of all TT's releases are sold (unless SAE doesn't think they'll ever sell them all). That would still be the case whether they print more discs up to the 3000-copy limitation or not.

The only way the label continues on ("indefinitely" maybe be over-selling it) is if SAE does something new with it. That's why I said "It's certainly possible that SAE will end up buying the name and trademark, and continue the line." The "possible" was deliberately emphasized. "Possible" doesn't mean I think it will happen, just that there may be a non-zero chance of it happening.

And, with all due respect to Mill Creek, if SAE makes the same effort that MC does with any new releases, and does it under the "Twilight Time" name, it would be like Bruce Wayne retiring from crimefighting and letting Blue Beetle take over as Batman. Blue Beetle is a perfectly good Blue Beetle, and he has his place in the crimefighter community, but he'd be one lousy Batman.

Then again, SAE might do better than any of us expect.

The other thought about the phrase Indefinitely means that legally they will keep the Name Alive at least until the last of those 3 year exclusive periods ends. I think if TT just folded their tent without some continued existence all those exclusive periods would become null/void.

After that indefinitely could mean 1 day after the last day of the exclusive period, after than period and all the discs are gone, or I guess any time period afterwards to keep somebody from 'reclaiming' the name and using Nick's credibility to build their own name regardless of quality or ability. They could probably go on for 10 years as a technical legal Zombie business entity and not sell/release a single item. I don;t know what that would entail legally or financially or if it's anything other than paying for the Business License annually

I don't we'll know what it means until either they decide to close up or say something publicly

[SonnybytheSea]

Originally Posted by StarDestroyer52

I don't really understand a lot of the hate that comes their way. Of course, they put out their fair share of crap at times, but I've been impressed with the mass majority of films and TV shows that I have bought from them. They serve an important niche in the market releasing many films that wouldn't get released or upgraded TV shows that never would've hit BluRay. I must admit that I didn't understand what the one user meant when it would become like another Mill Creek.

My biggest complaint with Mill Creek is their William Castle films! Instead of having a Box Set with each film given some TLC and loaded with extras. We were given bare-bones double feature Blus!! I'm holding out hope that SF or Kino get the license for those films and gives them the proper releases they deserve.....

[BuraddoRun]

Well, I just placed what is likely my last Twilight Time order. My time with them was short-lived, but I appreciate what they did for us very much. This is a very small order, just 2 titles.

[Aclea]

Originally Posted by SonnybytheSea

My biggest complaint with Mill Creek is their William Castle films! Instead of having a Box Set with each film given some TLC and loaded with extras. We were given bare-bones double feature Blus!! I'm holding out hope that SF or Kino get the license for those films and gives them the proper releases they deserve.....

That said, at least they released Castle's Hollywood Story on Blu: it's a decent little noir B-movie inspired by the once-notorious unsolved murder of silent film director William Desmond Taylor that is too niche for most labels and too hard a sell for labels like Shout because it's not one of his horrors. They're not ideal, but they can be useful for those kind of films that fall through the cracks.

[SonnybytheSea]

Originally Posted by Aclea

That said, at least they released Hollywood Story on Blu: it'sa decent little noir B-movie inspired by the once-notorious unsolved murder of silent film director William Desmond Taylor that is too niche for most labels and too hard a sell for labels like Shout because it's not one of his horrors. They're not ideal, but they can be useful for those kind of films that fall through the cracks.

I think you nailed it with "kind of films that fall through the cracks" it's the only reason I wouldn't trash them because of films that might not have a release other wise!

[UnionJackMix]

Funny, I haven't seen anyone (unless I missed it) saying they purchased Bob & Ted & Carol & Alice
Im not singling this one out and a stroll through what's left in the store brings up the fact that some titles are apparently not on anyone's list.

[jayembee]

Originally Posted by UnionJackMix

Funny, I haven't seen anyone (unless I missed it) saying they purchased Bob & Ted & Carol & Alice
Im not singling this one out and a stroll through what's left in the store brings up the fact that some titles are apparently not on anyone's list.

I would've purchased it, but it was sold out at TTM when I was placing an order. I will be ordering it from SAE at a later point.

[Shanew800]

I already made an order last Sunday but I think I'm making another for those titles I've been curious about for a while. Can anyone give me any input on these titles, I'm trying to narrow it down to 3 and I've never seen any of them. Thanks!
The Incident
The Hospital
New Centurions
The Seven-Ups
The Chase

[belcherman]

I need someone to talk me into or out of Lawman. It has a great cast, but I haven’t seen much love for it here. Worth $12?

[Aclea]

Originally Posted by belcherman

I need someone to talk me into or out of Lawman. It has a great cast, but I haven’t seen much love for it here. Worth $12?

Not the greatest transfer - though an improvement over the DVD - but a rare Michael Winner film you don't have to make apologies for:



If nothing else, Lawman proves that there is such a thing as a script so good that not even Michael Winner could screw it up, although having an excellent cast doesn't hurt. Burt Lancaster is the lawman of the title, determined to bring in several cattlemen (Robert Duvall among them) only to find that the local boss Lee J. Cobb owns the town and its once famous, now cowardly world-weary sheriff Robert Ryan, who all but steals the film. Curiously, Ryan far preferred this film to The Wild Bunch, though that may be down to Winner's deference to his stars compared with the thoroughly miserable time he had working with Peckinpah (there's another Peckinpah connection in composer Jerry Fielding, who contributes a good, brooding score). Joseph Wiseman, Richard Jordan, Albert Salmi and Sheree North are also thrown into the mix, and surprisingly all of them have well defined characters in what becomes an increasingly complex morality play about the void between what's legal and what's practical as Lancaster begins to realize that his strict adherence to the letter of the law has left him with nothing else in his life.

At times Gerald Wilson's script is perhaps a tad overwritten - everyone gets their big scene explaining their worldview, with no-one truly bad, merely weak - but it's a forgivable weakness. Winner's not quite as overly reliant on crash zooms as usual, though his characteristic laziness does manifest itself in one scene that has characters ride up to Cobb's house in darkness and come into the room in daylight, but for someone like Winner that's almost verging on the competent by his standards.

[Gunsnroses092789]

Plus, how can you beat Lancaster, Ryan and Cobb?

[SeanJoyce]

Another vote for Lawman. I'm not a passionate defender of Michael Winner, but that guy had something going in the 70s with a streak of interesting and well-made films.

I'm going to toot the Chato's Land trumpet one final time for anybody looking for a relatively-obscure western title to add to their haul. I think it's better than Lawman, and one can see its DNA in Death Hunt (also Bronson) and First Blood. (Ryan was Winner's first choice to play the detestable Jubal Hooker, but he graciously declined the part due to his battle with cancer.)

[ASAPadam]

Originally Posted by Shanew800

Can anyone give me any input on these titles, I'm trying to narrow it down to 3 and I've never seen any of them. Thanks!
The Incident
The Hospital
New Centurions
The Seven-Ups
The Chase

If you like gritty '70s cops-on-the-beat movies (and why wouldn't you?!), go with New Centurions and Seven-Ups — they're keepers. (Though the region-free Indicator edition of New Centurions has a 2016 making-of doc, which is why I got that release instead). I didn't like The Incident (it felt stagey and overacted to me) but I'm in the minority and it's probably worth a watch just for its concept and execution. I haven't seen the other two, but I ordered The Hospital this week -- it's the only film on your list that doesn't have a release elsewhere in the world, as far as I can tell.

[BagheeraMcGee]

Dammit, you guys are talking me into placing another order! I'm going to need a support group (or at the very least, debt relief counseling) once this is all over.