Twilight Time Discussion Thread

[klauswhereareyou]

Originally Posted by The Great Owl

For what it's worth, I think that the Twilight Time Blu-ray of Drums Along the Mohawk is a beautiful presentation, but I cannot give it the in-depth technical review that it deserves, given the limitations of my setup. Just the cursory "This Blu-ray looks great and sounds great to me." broad brush stroke, and that does not quite fly on this site.

No, thanks that helps. Like I said, I do prefer to get this site's reviewers input. Funny thing is that this site preaty much gave every TT disc high marks, so it's strange that TT no longer wants to send discs here to get an official review. Heck, I strongly disagreed with the PQ scores for the TT disc of The Fury that this site and others gave (I thought it wasn't very good), but still like seeing the screencaps and official reviews. If it wasn't for the reviews on here, I would not have gotten Hard Times or The Driver. I guess what I'm saying is that there will definitely be less of a likelyhood of me getting too many more TT titles in the future, especially on titles that I'm not already sold on before I see a review. I guess for those films, it'll just have to be DVD only for me. I guess if anything I'll save 20 bucks or more that way!

[tama]

I felt The Fury received an appropriate rating especially in the PQ department. I've disagreed more times then not with JMKs reviews however I never felt he was a shill. And at least with TT titles felt he was in an area of honesty and fairness with his reviews.

I won't mention another site as I'm sure people will know which site I'm referring to but I don't take stock in reviewers who praise disc such as Sword in The Stone and Earrings of Madame De... as having top notch film like transfers. That being said I also steer clear of places that are no better then political pundits these days creating echo chambers of like minded praise while vilifying those with opposing views. I appreciate that this community here allows for open discussion of the products being released whether you agree or not.

Once again TT, its owners, and over apologetic following show there thin skinned nature towards any disagreement or criticism with there products or business practices.

[NoirFan]

Originally Posted by JMK

yes, Twilight Time has stopped sending screeners. Mr. Redman has had issues with the fact that (in his perception) so many people here (including some Mr. Redman felt were posting as "official" representatives of the site) post negative comments about his label.

This is extremely childish and self-destructive behavior on their part, and will only hurt their bottom line in the long run. This (as far as I can tell) is the most popular Blu-ray review site/forum online, so they are just damaging themselves - numerous potential customers who may be considering purchases now will likely be far more reluctant to do so without access to an on-site review. Sure, there is plenty of TT-bashing here, of both the valid and the trollish variety, but is that really so different from the assumed behavior/responses at any other BD forum? If you charge a premium price and offer minimal, ported (or non-existent/incomplete) extras, you are going to receive criticism. That's just how it is. Yes, people do often post the same unconstructive complaints over and over, but is that any reason to pout and shout, 'No screeners for you! That'll teach you to be negative!' All that will do is give more ammo to those who already dislike the label's model, and in the process cut off a potentially sizable group of possible customers.

[Brad1963]

Originally Posted by klauswhereareyou

Kind of blows because I was considering getting Drums Along the Mohawk, but was waiting for a Blu-ray.com review with screen caps. I guess I can save the 29.99, plus whatever else I may have spent.

You can find other reviews (DVD Beaver etc) or read feedback by members of this board.

[MifuneFan]

Originally Posted by JMK

To those who have posted here and sent me so many emails and PMs, here's what's going on in a nutshell: yes, Twilight Time has stopped sending screeners. Mr. Redman has had issues with the fact that (in his perception) so many people here (including some Mr. Redman felt were posting as "official" representatives of the site) post negative comments about his label.

I find this particularly disheartening for several reasons, including the fact that I was among the first champions of the label, being one of the first journalists to interview Mr. Redman about the label and then covering each and every release (giving so many positive reviews that some of you here accused me of being a label shill ), and in fact every time Mr. Redman has brought something particularly objectionable to my attention (and there have been some posts here I personally feel have crossed the line), I've attempted to deal with it as quickly as possible.

This all of course ignores the fact that we live in a free society where dissenting opinion is constitutionally protected (even about Blu-ray releases LOL), and it also ignores the fact that the vast majority of posts here are "pro-Twilight Time", which I think ultimately is the real disservice that has been done to our readership. Unlike other sites that censor negative posts, we have a more liberal policy, though I will state up front we have a very active and professional moderation team that keeps things within the bounds of propriety. (The fact that I and the readership are being "punished" for other people's opinions is a bit strange, but I digress.)

The good news here is that I will be picking up occasional Twilight Time releases myself and posting reviews as I have the time. I truly appreciate all the inquiries I've had from those who prefer the Blu-ray.com reviews of this material. It means a lot to receive such generously positive feedback.

What a terrible decision. If it weren't for this site, and your reviews they likely wouldn't have as many sales as they have had. Redman has always come off as an arrogant jerk to me, so his attitude here isn't shocking to me, but it's still very disappointing.

If they're going to treat Blu-ray.com like that, this label doesn't deserve to be stickied in this section. The irony here is, his diss of the site will only bring on more criticisms of him and his label.

To the Mods/Admins: I highly encourage the mods to consider removing the sticky. It would at least be a symbolic move that they can't have their cake and eat it too. This site is essentially giving free advertising to the label by keeping it stickied above all other labels, and movies, don't give them business when they can't even give a screener to do a review.

[klauswhereareyou]

Originally Posted by NoirFan

This is extremely childish and self-destructive behavior on their part, and will only hurt their bottom line in the long run. This (as far as I can tell) is the most popular Blu-ray review site/forum online, so they are just damaging themselves - numerous potential customers who may be considering purchases now will likely be far more reluctant to do so without access to an on-site review. Sure, there is plenty of TT-bashing here, of both the valid and the trollish variety, but is that really so different from the assumed behavior/responses at any other BD forum? If you charge a premium price and offer minimal, ported (or non-existent/incomplete) extras, you are going to receive criticism. That's just how it is. Yes, people do often post the same unconstructive complaints over and over, but is that any reason to pout and shout, 'No screeners for you! That'll teach you to be negative!' All that will do is give more ammo to those who already dislike the label's model, and in the process cut off a potentially sizable group of possible customers.

Funny thing is that other then posters on here, most of the blu-ray.com staff has been really positive to TT and their output. The Digital Bits site did post a negative article about TT and their business model so I could see them being excluded from getting screeners (even though I still wouldn't agree), but this site's hasn't posted anything like that, or am I missing something?

I'll admit I've had some negative things to say about TT, but I've also had many positive things to say too. I've been generally impressed with the TT discs I've bought. I may not like how they must be purchased and think they are slightly overpriced, but overall I am glad to own Major Dundee, Christine, Hard Times, The Driver among others.

[AndersonVision]

While this isn't the first time that a boutique label has played favorites with reviewers/friendly sites; it reeks of cronyism and thin skinned independents trying to manipulate public opinion.


I support the unsticky effort too.

I would've never found out about TT if it wasn't for Blu-Ray.com; cut off the free advertising for them. A site of this size with its sizeable traffic should roadblock them in return.

Teach 'em something about the nature of e-commerce.

[NoirFan]

Another vote to un-sticky this thread.

[klauswhereareyou]

Originally Posted by Brad1963

You can find other reviews (DVD Beaver etc) or read feedback by members of this board.

True, but I've found that the official reviews on this site are preaty accurate. I don't really trust any of the other sites (I think DVD Beaver doesn't really do an accurate job with the screen grabs, and overpraises PQ, Home Theater Forum is too "insider" and I just don't trust their staff, especially when one guy on there posts a review and all the posters act as if the Messiah has risen!). The only thing I can't agree with this sites staff on in their reviews is of the actual films themselves, but I don't read this site for insightful film criticism.

[klauswhereareyou]

Yeah and BTW, I would probably have found out much later about TT had it not been for this site. I guess when I order my Salem's Lot soundtrack when it goes live next week, I'll be buying directly from Intrada. I was going to go through SAE and pick up a TT disc too. Forget it now.

[Akijama]

Originally Posted by NoirFan

Another vote to un-sticky this thread.

Now, that would be childish thing to do. No screeners - no sticky!

[NoirFan]

Originally Posted by Akijama

Now, that would be childish thing to do. No screeners - no sticky!

I'm sure the thread would still be a high-traffic one that would remain on the front page regardless. Un-stickying it would just be a symbolic act.

[AndersonVision]

Originally Posted by Akijama

Now, that would be childish thing to do. No screeners - no sticky!

It's not at all.

Tit for tat. TT wants and needs coverage, they just want to change the protocol when it doesn't go their way.

Fine. No problem.

It works for both sides.

[NoirFan]

I had a sudden image of Phoebe Cates in Fast Times, tearfully reading, 'But if you ask me, Twilight Time, you're the one being childish!"

[bluknight1]

Originally Posted by klauswhereareyou

Kind of blows because I was considering getting Drums Along the Mohawk, but was waiting for a Blu-ray.com review with screen caps. I guess I can save the 29.99, plus whatever else I may have spent.

Originally Posted by The Great Owl

For what it's worth, I think that the Twilight Time Blu-ray of Drums Along the Mohawk is a beautiful presentation, but I cannot give it the in-depth technical review that it deserves, given the limitations of my setup. Just the cursory "This Blu-ray looks great and sounds great to me." broad brush stroke, and that does not quite fly on this site.

You can't only judge on screencaps. Just saying...

Originally Posted by NoirFan

This is extremely childish and self-destructive behavior on their part, and will only hurt their bottom line in the long run. This (as far as I can tell) is the most popular Blu-ray review site/forum online, so they are just damaging themselves - numerous potential customers who may be considering purchases now will likely be far more reluctant to do so without access to an on-site review. Sure, there is plenty of TT-bashing here, of both the valid and the trollish variety, but is that really so different from the assumed behavior/responses at any other BD forum? If you charge a premium price and offer minimal, ported (or non-existent/incomplete) extras, you are going to receive criticism. That's just how it is. Yes, people do often post the same unconstructive complaints over and over, but is that any reason to pout and shout, 'No screeners for you! That'll teach you to be negative!' All that will do is give more ammo to those who already dislike the label's model, and in the process cut off a potentially sizable group of possible customers.

Originally Posted by klauswhereareyou

Funny thing is that other then posters on here, most of the blu-ray.com staff has been really positive to TT and their output. The Digital Bits site did post a negative article about TT and their business model so I could see them being excluded from getting screeners (even though I still wouldn't agree), but this site's hasn't posted anything like that, or am I missing something?

I'll admit I've had some negative things to say about TT, but I've also had many positive things to say too. I've been generally impressed with the TT discs I've bought. I may not like how they must be purchased and think they are slightly overpriced, but overall I am glad to own Major Dundee, Christine, Hard Times, The Driver among others.

Any business has to listen to criticism and learn from it, not shun it entirely. I think that most of the criticism comes from the limited quantities. Once significant classics and horror titles started to get released, that's when the trolls came out. I must admit that I have always criticized the 3,000-unit limited edition, but never complained about the price or limited sale outlets. Twilight Time would recieve universal praise if they followed the model set by Criterion or Shout Factory and did not release titles as limited editions. I understand that they are a small business, but you have to start by appealing to the largest audience possible: TT' biggest flaw in this case. Twilight Time's sellout rates will go down in the future due to the lack of reviews on this site and Redman will have to deal with that. I knew he was very defensive of his label, but I didn't have any idea that he would make such an immature decision as this.

[Clark Kent]

It's a tough call for a small distributor like Twilight Time. This forum is the most visible to the public in the Blu-ray world and the discussion did become somewhat toxic regarding TT's releases, mostly due to a few concerned posters about the TT business model.

TT has been upfront and more honest than I would have allowed for a business regarding their internal affairs. There are good reasons why the major studios don't allow marketing reps on forums like this one, it's too hard to control the discussion.

While the lack of screeners is a problem, it can easily be overcome by Blu-ray.com. They can buy the disc like everyone else.

[MifuneFan]

Originally Posted by Akijama

Now, that would be childish thing to do. No screeners - no sticky!

As I addressed, they are essentially getting free advertising by having this thread stickied. Why should this site, who is very careful with who they promote/advertise, give this special attention to a company that treats them with such little respect?

Plus, If Redman wants to make generalizations that people here complain too much about his label, then by his own argument, removing the sticky will also give less attention to these so-call complainers

[Akijama]

I understand what you guys are saying, but the way I see it, it's an act of retaliation more than anything else. And that's kinda lame.

Just my cent, of course

[MifuneFan]

Originally Posted by Clark Kent

While the lack of screeners is a problem, it can easily be overcome by Blu-ray.com. They can buy the disc like everyone else.

If it weren't a limited model that would be more acceptable, but when it's something like The Blob, which will likely sellout within a few hours, it could be the difference between having a copy to review or not. Reviewers here shouldn't have to go through such hoops, especially when they've done absolutely nothing to deserve such treatment.

[charnier]

Originally Posted by Akijama

Now, that would be childish thing to do. No screeners - no sticky!

The fourth doctor said it best: "what's the point of being an adult if you can't be childish sometimes?".

Edit - unsticky it and give it to Drafthouse.