Panasonic UB820/UB9000 4K UHD Blu-ray player

[FilmFreakosaurus]

Originally Posted by bizzle

As someone who has the UB-420 model, how much am I missing out by not having the option for Dolby Vision? Is this something I'm probably going to regret down the road?

I would get a player with DV... always... unless you have a 4k projector without 12 bit or greater internal processing. If you do then you can trick a DV player into low latency DV mode with an HD Fury device. You then can send true 12 bit video data to the projector because the player thinks it's talking to a low latency DV display and the player does all the processing internally.

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by FilmFreakosaurus

I would get a player with DV... always... unless you have a 4k projector without 12 bit or greater internal processing. If you do then you can trick a DV player into low latency DV mode with an HD Fury device. You then can send true 12 bit video data to the projector because the player thinks it's talking to a low latency DV display and the player does all the processing internally.

That could be done with any non-DV display device using a Fury to spoof the DV, not just a projektor.

[bizzle]

Originally Posted by FilmFreakosaurus

I would get a player with DV... always... unless you have a 4k projector without 12 bit or greater internal processing. If you do then you can trick a DV player into low latency DV mode with an HD Fury device. You then can send true 12 bit video data to the projector because the player thinks it's talking to a low latency DV display and the player does all the processing internally.

blah. kind of what I was expecting folks to say. No projector here, just a new 4K TCL tv. I went with the 420 about a year ago after some really good reviews and a black Friday sale. I mean to my eyes it looks great for the 4K discs I have and is killer for upscaling my Blu's. I just keep getting this sense that things could look just a little bit better if it had DV capabilities.

[FilmFreakosaurus]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

That could be done with any non-DV display device using a Fury to spoof the DV, not just a projektor.

Correct, but how many consumer flat panels have actual 12 bit video processing? I don't think you would need more than one hand to count. 4k projectors OTOH are more prevalent with better video boards.

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by FilmFreakosaurus

Correct, but how many consumer flat panels have actual 12 bit video processing? I don't think you would need more than one hand to count. 4k projectors OTOH are more prevalent with better video boards.

Why is that even worth mentioning then if a non-12-bit projektor is such a rare thing for the OP to have? And the point of the spoofed DV isn't really the 12-bit output at all IMO but the pre-tone-mapped HDR signal that bypasses the internals of the target display.

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by bizzle

blah. kind of what I was expecting folks to say. No projector here, just a new 4K TCL tv. I went with the 420 about a year ago after some really good reviews and a black Friday sale. I mean to my eyes it looks great for the 4K discs I have and is killer for upscaling my Blu's. I just keep getting this sense that things could look just a little bit better if it had DV capabilities.

There's a hell of a lot of hype and not many actual facts bandied around about Dolby Vision. The better your TV (or indeed the player, the 420 has the HDR Optimiser) is at handling HDR10 the less of an impact you will see with DV, it's not often providing a 'better' image in terms of grading so much as it is providing a better way of tone mapping that underlying image to a target display. DV does have a few other benefits but not what people think, they're of the nerdiest possible type of improvements so I won't bore you with them.

[bizzle]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

There's a hell of a lot of hype and not many actual facts bandied around about Dolby Vision. The better your TV (or indeed the player, the 420 has the HDR Optimiser) is at handling HDR10 the less of an impact you will see with DV, it's not often providing a 'better' image in terms of grading so much as it is providing a better way of tone mapping that underlying image to a target display. DV does have a few other benefits but not what people think, they're of the nerdiest possible type of improvements so I won't bore you with them.

Good perspective. Thanks!

[JohnCarpenterLives]

Originally Posted by JohnCarpenterLives

Apparently I am not the only one. At least two other people on the AVS Forum thread are having this problem.

https://www.avsforum.com/threads/off.../post-60181139

Mr. Zohn, have you heard anything about this? Or know if Panasonic has?

For anyone that cares: I had a live chat with Best Buy today. After verifying my personal info, and order number she created a store appointment for me. No other questions asked. I really love this player otherwise, so I hope this is a relatively uncommon issue.

[PUsokrJosh305]

Originally Posted by JohnCarpenterLives

For anyone that cares: I had a live chat with Best Buy today. After verifying my personal info, and order number she created a store appointment for me. No other questions asked. I really love this player otherwise, so I hope this is a relatively uncommon issue.

I take it you tried hooking it up to another power outlet and it didn't work??

[JohnCarpenterLives]

Originally Posted by PUsokrJosh305

I take it you tried hooking it up to another power outlet and it didn't work??

Yup.

[FilmFreakosaurus]

Originally Posted by JohnCarpenterLives

Yup.

Get it exchanged for a new one.

[PUsokrJosh305]

Originally Posted by JohnCarpenterLives

Yup.

Dang it! That sucks!! I hope Best Buy comes through and replaces the unit. The 820 is a great player and I hope you can still have it!

[Oscarilbo]

Hi guys... needing some quick advice here
I can notice a bit of dark crush with my panny and benQ projector. Which slider is better to compensate this on the HDR optimizer, Black Tone Curve or Brightness?

The thing is, even with that dark crush (all sliders on 0) it feels like the most natural look, beautiful contrast in my fairly blacked out man's cave. The moment I rise brightness or black curve it loses some of that contrast. So I don't know, maybe is really a matter of dark crush vs accuracy.

Btw, my projector is Rec709 native, and can't access BT2020 in SDR mode, only HDR.

What do you think? Thank you in advance

[FilmFreakosaurus]

Originally Posted by Oscarilbo

Hi guys... needing some quick advice here
I can notice a bit of dark crush with my panny and benQ projector. Which slider is better to compensate this on the HDR optimizer, Black Tone Curve or Brightness?

The thing is, even with that dark crush (all sliders on 0) it feels like the most natural look, beautiful contrast in my fairly blacked out man's cave. The moment I rise brightness or black curve it loses some of that contrast. So I don't know, maybe is really a matter of dark crush vs accuracy.

Btw, my projector is Rec709 native, and can't access BT2020 in SDR mode, only HDR.

What do you think? Thank you in advance

You have to run your projector in "HDR mode." You will then have to adjust the optimizer accordingly. I know in the 420 you can set the average target of the display in the video settings... like switch it to projector mode, for a lower nit range.

[Oscarilbo]

Originally Posted by FilmFreakosaurus

You have to run your projector in "HDR mode." You will then have to adjust the optimizer accordingly. I know in the 420 you can set the average target of the display in the video settings... like switch it to projector mode, for a lower nit range.

Thank you. I use it with the HDR optimizer on, that's why I want advices about the sliders. Is a bit of dark crush really a bad thing?

[FilmFreakosaurus]

Originally Posted by Oscarilbo

Thank you. I use it with the HDR optimizer on, that's why I want advices about the sliders. Is a bit of dark crush really a bad thing?

Not really, unless it is truly smooshing details in the shadows. That's probably your projector and its ability to tone map HDR to a range it can handle. JVC has one of the better HDR tone mapping modes of the current 4k projectors on the market. They can be more expensive, but sometimes authorized dealers like AV Science have new factory refurbed Reference Series 4k JVC's at a very reasonable price. JVC tends to be more careful with their refurbs as they don't want to sully their premium reputation.



It's really too bad that more projectors don't have laser light sources rather than bulbs as you can really micro target the image contrast and make HDR content really sing.

[panasonicst60]

Originally Posted by Oscarilbo

Thank you. I use it with the HDR optimizer on, that's why I want advices about the sliders. Is a bit of dark crush really a bad thing?

Turn up the Black Tone Curve a click or two will help with black crush. be careful not to raise it too high as it may raise your black level.

[Oscarilbo]

Originally Posted by panasonicst60

Turn up the Black Tone Curve a click or two will help with black crush. be careful not to raise it too high as it may raise your black level.

Thank you. yes I notice If i click it too much... But from what I've seen, no more than 1-2 clicks on black tone curve reveals a bit more details in shadows without starting to rise black levels, right?

I remember someone suggesting turning up brightness slider, but I don't think its precisely for black crush that one, isn't it?

[Oscarilbo]

Originally Posted by FilmFreakosaurus

Not really, unless it is truly smooshing details in the shadows. That's probably your projector and its ability to tone map HDR to a range it can handle. JVC has one of the better HDR tone mapping modes of the current 4k projectors on the market. They can be more expensive, but sometimes authorized dealers like AV Science have new factory refurbed Reference Series 4k JVC's at a very reasonable price. JVC tends to be more careful with their refurbs as they don't want to sully their premium reputation.



It's really too bad that more projectors don't have laser light sources rather than bulbs as you can really micro target the image contrast and make HDR content really sing.

Yeah, one of those JVC is my dream, some people call them the equivalent of "oled" for projectors.

[JohnCarpenterLives]

Originally Posted by JohnCarpenterLives

For anyone that cares: I had a live chat with Best Buy today. After verifying my personal info, and order number she created a store appointment for me. No other questions asked. I really love this player otherwise, so I hope this is a relatively uncommon issue.

Update: The online chat rep was 100% wrong in everything she did. When I got to Best Buy they were expecting SOMETHING to do with a TV.
There is no Magnolia warranty swap, and that other person must have had a Geek Squad warranty. That's the only time they'll do it in-store.

The most Best Buy could do for me is ship it to Panasonic, and I'd be looking at 4-6 week turnaround. Not happy with Best Buy Geek Squad chat at all.

I will update with info on my inevitable Panasonic experience, unless this is considered off-topic?