First Blood / Rambo: First Blood Part II / Rambo III 4K UHDs (1982-1988)

[Telemachus]

Originally Posted by kashif

I bought them recently and now they are on sale. It looks like Amazon reads my mind lol. Its not the first time I miss a sale. Just when I buy a game it is on PlayStation plus for free next month and when I buy a movie it goes on sale soon lol.

They hit me with that too, I bought a new full set of speakers from them a couple months ago, now they're all on sale totaling around $100 off. I've seen weird crazy things happen with their movie prices though, I bought Mannequin on Blu Ray one night for $13, a few hours later it was $20 again, and it was $20 for weeks before going on sale randomly.

[zepol]

Originally Posted by kashif

Since you talking about watching them on your 80 inch tv and think that's why you find flaws in pic quality. I watched Rambo 1 and 2 on 75 inch and pic quality looks great. They are not amazing but they are great. You need to understand that it all depends on original film stock as well when it comes to restoration process. It's a good transfer. Not very vivid or vibrant but actually this is how I remember watching these movies from vhs to vcds to dvds era as well. Sometimes you don't need to tweak things too much or else you don't get the same feeling you remember for these movies. Just my opinion.

Ok, you admit they are not amazing and that's my point. You see I have had these movies on VHS, Laserdisc, beta, DVD, bluray and now 4k. So I expected BACK TO THE FUTURE quality 4k. I admit I am a bit to harsh but we are talking 4k.

[zepol]

Originally Posted by morris_schaffer

I liked the transfer of First Blood a lot. Only when Stallone is in the mine shaft and there is a fire source nearby, did I feel the black areas where grey rather than pitch black. Is that normal? Or is because it's a flick from nearly 40 years ago? I got an oled from 2016

Movie never gets old. Goldsmith's score is just so good.

I took a 2nk look of my 4k on that and yes. Ok, it's not trash it's a little but good. But not BACK TO THE FUTURE grade "A" quality.

[Telemachus]

I just ran through all these discs recently, besides having to re-calibrate brightness/contrast on all three, they looked pretty great to me, especially at under $30 for the set. I think Rambo III looked the best.

[zepol]

Originally Posted by Telemachus

I just ran through all these discs recently, besides having to re-calibrate brightness/contrast on all three, they looked pretty great to me, especially at under $30 for the set. I think Rambo III looked the best.

But with all that action in 3 it should have sounded a whole lot better for 4k.

[LexInHD]

Originally Posted by zepol

But with all that action in 3 it should have sounded a whole lot better for 4k.

Pretty much nothing from that time is going to sound great, without a new sound-mix that replaces the low-fi sound elements. You can remaster the picture all you want, but the sound doesn't improve unless it gets replaced. The proper way to present the original Rambo films in 4K is to do a new Atmos soundmix, replacing all of the old effects with newer ones that reflect the advancements in technology and fidelity, while remaining faithful to the original intent of each scene. Dolby Labs - yes, THAT company - did the sound work for 2 & 3, so imagine what they could do now and the first one certainly could use a better mix, with today's technology, since it was an indie film.

[Filmmaker]

Originally Posted by LexInHD

The proper way to present the original Rambo films in 4K is to do a new Atmos soundmix, replacing all of the old effects with newer ones that reflect the advancements in technology and fidelity, while remaining faithful to the original intent of each scene. Dolby Labs - yes, THAT company - did the sound work for 2 & 3, so imagine what they could do now and the first one certainly could use a better mix, with today's technology, since it was an indie film.

You drew first blood.

[Telemachus]

Originally Posted by zepol

But with all that action in 3 it should have sounded a whole lot better for 4k.

Yep that poor anemic sound. Really only the Arnold action movies from that era got great mixes later on DVD/Blu.

[DMRI2006]

The sound problems can be fixed by going back to the original 2-channel Dolby Stereo mixes for 1-3. They were last found on the first Studio Canal European Blu remasters from nearly a decade ago I believe.

Whenever the 5.1 soundtrack was produced (I think for that release), it screwed up much of the stereophonic fidelity of the source audio, most especially 2. There are a number of scenes in 2 where there should be discrete sound effects coming out of the rears, left and right hand sides, which you can hear in the original 2-channel mix (which remember is still full Dolby Surround when properly matrixed, as intended). But when the 5.1 track was produced, it folded much of those effects down into the center instead. It's a shame. The music also sounds "cramped" in comparison to the original mix.

The overall "imaging" on the 5.1 tracks is poor -- and it didn't need to be. The original Dolby Stereo tracks have a nice soundstage for the music and effects, and could've been just fine "as is" had they only included them. Sadly on the 4K UHD's they just re-used this same crappy 5.1 track, leaving off the original 2.0 Dolby mixes.

As much as I like the UHD transfers the audio is a major problem for me. I ended up tracking down those Blu-Rays that have the original audio again (I had sold them off) because the 5.1 tracks are a real detriment to the overall presentation of those films.

[Markgway]

Original mixes sound the best?

Whoda thunk it??

[King O.A.]

Rambo: Last Blood's extended cut is only available digitally right?

[DR Herbert West]

Originally Posted by King O.A.

Rambo: Last Blood's extended cut is only available digitally right?

There's a German (I think) release of it.

[BladeRunner2007]

Originally Posted by DR Herbert West

There's a German (I think) release of it.

Correct.

[Sky_Captain]

And a great disc it is too.

[King O.A.]

Originally Posted by BladeRunner2007

Correct.

is there a link to purchase?

[BladeRunner2007]

Originally Posted by King O.A.

is there a link to purchase?

https://www.amazon.de/Rambo-Blood-Bl...s%2C183&sr=1-6

[BNex99]

Originally Posted by DMRI2006

Whenever the 5.1 soundtrack was produced (I think for that release), it screwed up much of the stereophonic fidelity of the source audio, most especially 2. There are a number of scenes in 2 where there should be discrete sound effects coming out of the rears, left and right hand sides, which you can hear in the original 2-channel mix (which remember is still full Dolby Surround when properly matrixed, as intended). But when the 5.1 track was produced, it folded much of those effects down into the center instead. It's a shame. The music also sounds "cramped" in comparison to the original mix.

It's definitely 2 that's the worst. I have the late-90s Artisan DVD, and the 2.0 Dolby Digital track on that sounds better than the 5.1 on later discs.

Incidentally, Part 2 is the only film in the series to get a 70mm six-track release. I wonder if maybe whatever went wrong actually went wrong at that stage, and then the 5.1 was taken from that.

Analog Dolby mixing and re-recording during the early-to-mid-80s was not without its hiccups.

[DMRI2006]

Originally Posted by BNex99

It's definitely 2 that's the worst. I have the late-90s Artisan DVD, and the 2.0 Dolby Digital track on that sounds better than the 5.1 on later discs.

Incidentally, Part 2 is the only film in the series to get a 70mm six-track release. I wonder if maybe whatever went wrong actually went wrong at that stage, and then the 5.1 was taken from that.

Analog Dolby mixing and re-recording during the early-to-mid-80s was not without its hiccups.

No, for sure, and neither are modern 5.1 remixes which somehow screw things up more than "enhance" upon their original sources! This issue where a matrixed sound field was directed into the center in some mucked-up 5.1 tracks, almost creating a mono sound field, has happened on so many tracks, it's just bizarre. And also inexplicable why it kept happening for so long (some audio house that was handling them?)

2 is the worst of the three by far. 3 is the least affected. 1 seems a little cramped in general but it's not horrific.

There is, admittedly, also an issue with the 2.0 track from 2 on the Studio Canal Blu-Rays, where some of the front soundfield is repeated. Thus, some of the dialogue inexplicably ends up coming out of all speakers (like when Rambo is with the girl on the boat), which can't possibly be accurate either. Maybe there was an issue there, but it's unfortunate because much of the stereo effects are gone in that 5.1 track in the process.

[LexInHD]

Many DVDs had 5.1 tracks minted from up-mixed 2.0 tracks, via Chace Digital Stereo, a process which is still used today. Those of you who remember Anchor Bay Entertainment's glory days will remember the logo that was plastered on their DVD cases and the pre-film trailer that served as a way to ensure your audio was properly working, ala the THX, Dolby Digital, and DTS trailers. The results were hit/miss, though it often depended on the source material and how proficient the re-mixer was.

[DR Herbert West]

Originally Posted by LexInHD

The results were hit/miss, though it often depended on the source material and how proficient the re-mixer was.

Miss in the case of Halloween 4.