4K Movies Releases

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Teazle

I'm sorry but this Luddism ascription is mere name-calling. Two thumbs down for the ad hom.

Although the amusingly ironic thing about this discussion between mike and Peter is that mike, being the proactive, outspoken native 4K advocate that he is,….is feverishly defending thee cinematographer, who has a history of not being much of a high camera resolution proponent….https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=00OG...utu.be&t=2m34s

I hope Roger becomes more amenable to HDR like he did with getting the step up in resolution by shooting Sicario Open Gate with the ALEXA XT, where he had otherwise lived and worked in 2.8K for years.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by PeterTHX

Calling it as I see it....

Some us do that even with people who work on the studio lot for corporate.

[ray0414]

I posted this in the other thread, but it doesnt look as active so ill post it here too to get your impressions.

I keep forgetting to share these pictures. i recommend saving them so you can make them larger and put them up side by side to compare.

but this is 4k vs 4k HDR. so they are BOTH 4k, yet extremely different!

Notice HDR has richer color, more depth, more dimension, better details in the background.

The texture of the smurfs face has lot more detail, and the grooves of his face has dimension and curves, giving it a more 3D look. The first time you see it, it's just insane looking.

the regular 4k version in comparison is flat looking, and the colors dont have as good seperation between each other. remember, with SDR, you only get 256 shades, while the HDR version you get over 1000 different shades of each color. the 4k smurf only appears to have 1 color of blue whereas the HDR smurf has multiples shades making up his "skin"

the blue is incredibly vibrant, look at the detail of the eyes and vibrancy of blue iris. 4k is good, but HDR is the real game changer.

By the way, Stacey Spears of Spectracal made some very good comments/statements about the state of 4k HDR over on AVS and where its heading. in Summary, he loves what HDR brings to the table and says the difference is clearly visible in color and contrast with the demos him and his team have been setting up. says his SDR versions look sabotaged in comparison to purposely look bad (which he knows it isnt since hes the one setting up the tvs). but he believes the 4k push right now is fraudulaent and wants "4k" removed from the boxes and players. But hes a big fan of the color vibrancy and grading.

[Geoff D]

Are you sure they're not both 10-bit sources? The amount of "shades" that are technically available for any gamut is related to bit depth, not whether it's simply HDR or SDR. That you're actually seeing more colour in the HDR version is to do with the increased colour volume.

[paperthin567]

Quick question: I want to future proof my receiver and projector and 4K bluray player. Should I wait for them all to come with Dolby Vision, or is that going to be a very limited thing studios do on 4K Blurays, if at all? Is HDR enabled discs good enough?

[dvdmike]

Originally Posted by PeterTHX

Calling it as I see it.


10 years from now when *everything* is HDR graded, he's going to look pretty foolish.

Like 10 years from 2006 when everyone is shooting digital

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by ray0414

....he believes the 4k push right now is fraudulaent and wants "4k" removed from the boxes and players. But hes a big fan of the color vibrancy and grading.

lol, Stacey has waaay too much time on his hands. The horse left the barn with regards to that topic long ago. If that sort of nomenclature means so much to him then he should start now in campaigning the powers-to-be for when consumer 8K displays come out to have all manufactures call and label them what ? 4320p? , yeah, the marketing people will just love that.

I truly admire Stacey’s intelligence and passion to image quality, not to mention that he bought a Playstation 3 for himself for which Amir (of AVS) wasn’t too happy about , but over the years I’ve heard disappointing reports that Stacey’s become way too *RED-centric*. On the other hand, I call ‘em as I sees ‘em and try to be as camera and company agnostic as much I can, for instance in regards to the CineAlta magazine article, which member eriau linked several pages back,

Originally Posted by eriaur

Been posted before, but some may have missed it.


https://pro.sony.com/bbsccms/assets/..._explained.pdf

I posted this a few days after it was published….

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...p#post10480414

A few updates/additions to the freebie article ^ in CineAlta magazine linked to in the 3rd paragraph (Amazing Spiderman 2) above….

1. As of Feb. 1, the new status of Colorworks - https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...e#post10368382

2. In fairness to the Red folks, I would say that independent observers (not working for either Sony or Red Digital Cinema Camera Company believe (thru testing) that the Red Dragon possess more visible stops of dynamic range than does the Sony F65 (which has a larger dynamic range than the F55).

3. Today, (while Sony doesn’t own it) there is content that was specifically shot from the outset of production with HDR capture and mastering in mind which was previewed (4 min. clip) at the SMPTE Tech conference in L.A. last fall and later discussed in the dez at the last HPA Tech Retreat. It’s since been submitted to an upcoming film festival in D.C. for consideration to their program.

Of course I guess since I’m not selling anything to anybody or trying to make friends, I have the liberty to be more unbiased than others. One good thing about Stacey is that he has finally discovered HPA .....and all the desert retreat offers.

Other than the imprecise ‘two thumbs rule’ introduced by Thomas (a V.P. of Engineering and Development at Fox, you’ll find his ‘in the trench’ insights into image quality regarding Ultra HD Blu-ray, streaming and broadcast to be quite valuable.

But alas, you can’t have back-and-forth conversations with him if you require that sort of thing in order to be fulfilled. The panel discussion is the ‘brightcove’ link on this page - https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...271447&page=20

[Richard Paul]

To give a brief summary IMF (Interoperable Master Format) was developed to be the distribution format for video services (broadcast, cable, satellite, Blu-ray, DVD, iTunes, Netflix, etc...). DCP is the distribution format for movie theaters and the idea was that IMF would be the distribution format for video services. IMF also reduces costs since it allows for visually lossless compression (5:1 to 15:1) and allows the differences between versions (edits and/or languages) to be stored in a single IMF package instead of having to create a different video file for each version. IMF 1.0 was finished in 2013 and supported 10-bit Rec. 709 4K at up to 30 fps. IMF 1.1 will add several features (HDR, HFR, and WCG) and should be released in a few months.

[PeterTHX]

Originally Posted by dvdmike

Like 10 years from 2006 when everyone is shooting digital

What are you saying? Most everyone IS shooting digital.
Kodak had to be bailed out, and the film holdouts are more notable than who's shooting digital these days.

[dvdmike]

Originally Posted by PeterTHX

What are you saying? Most everyone IS shooting digital.
Kodak had to be bailed out, and the film holdouts are more notable than who's shooting digital these days.

Everything you said, everyone I said....
You can't downgrade your statement just because its convenient to

[PeterTHX]

Originally Posted by dvdmike

Everything you said, everyone I said....
You can't downgrade your statement just because its convenient to

I was commenting on YOUR comment, not "downgrading" anything.

[dvdmike]

Originally Posted by PeterTHX

I was commenting on YOUR comment, not "downgrading" anything.

I said everyone, you downgraded it to "most everyone"
You said everything will be HDR graded, this is rubbish.
What if something better comes along in a year?

[Richard Paul]

Originally Posted by dvdmike

What if something better comes along in a year?

HDR, HFR, and WCG have been in development for years and in terms of video quality what else is there? Also HDR in the movie theater only doubles the brightness and it is more about improving the low light details so once a new DCI standard is made why would a director stick with SDR?

[PeterTHX]

Originally Posted by dvdmike

I said everyone, you downgraded it to "most everyone"
You said everything will be HDR graded, this is rubbish.
What if something better comes along in a year?

First, spoiler or delete repeat images. Nobody needs to see the exact same thing 2 posts in a row.


Second I was making your sentence CORRECT. Most everyone IS shooting digital. Which would mean something if I had claimed, in 2006, "everyone" would be shooting digital in 10 years.


Fact is a large amount of major Hollywood releases are getting a HDR grade (Dolby Vision, etc). Eventually *every* film released will get a HDR grade. TVs have been shown that have an auto-HDR setting to "enhance" SDR content. Every UHD-BD announced has a HDR grade. So you tell me if my decade-hence prediction is out of line.

[ray0414]

Originally Posted by dvdmike

I said everyone, you downgraded it to "most everyone"
You said everything will be HDR graded, this is rubbish.
What if something better comes along in a year?

Originally Posted by PeterTHX

First, spoiler or delete repeat images. Nobody needs to see the exact same thing 2 posts in a row.


Second I was making your sentence CORRECT. Most everyone IS shooting digital. Which would mean something if I had claimed, in 2006, "everyone" would be shooting digital in 10 years.


Fact is a large amount of major Hollywood releases are getting a HDR grade (Dolby Vision, etc). Eventually *every* film released will get a HDR grade. TVs have been shown that have an auto-HDR setting to "enhance" SDR content. Every UHD-BD announced has a HDR grade. So you tell me if my decade-hence prediction is out of line.

HDR10 and dolby vision will be here for 10 years bundled with 4k resolution. Not changing anytime soon because they are not ditching 4k bluray after only a couple years.

The only thing that will change is the tvs, to take better advantage of the hdr metadata. Maybe eventually dolby vision wins out and every disc has DV as the main hdr, but hdr10 will always be underneath it for those with regular hdr10 tvs.

[dvdmike]

Lol

[MisterXDTV]

So every movie ever released in the last 120 years, should be re-graded in HDR because now SDR sucks? (but remember, it was fine till 6 months ago).

Thanks but no Thanks!

[dvdmike]

Originally Posted by MisterXDTV

So every movie ever released in the last 120 years, should be re-graded in HDR because now SDR sucks? (but remember, it was fine till 6 months ago).

Thanks but no Thanks!

But its the PeterTHX Dolby Vision future and everyone who says no is wrong and needs to be beaten

[PeterTHX]

Originally Posted by MisterXDTV

So every movie ever released in the last 120 years, should be re-graded in HDR because now SDR sucks? (but remember, it was fine till 6 months ago).

Thanks but no Thanks!

Originally Posted by dvdmike

But its the PeterTHX Dolby Vision future and everyone who says no is wrong and needs to be beaten

Again, you'd have a point if I'd actually said or indicated that sort of thing.

[dvdmike]

Originally Posted by PeterTHX

Again, you'd have a point if I'd actually said or indicated that sort of thing.

Maybe read your own post history once in a while and see how many times you said nearly exactly that