HDTVTEST (Vincent Teoh) Discussion Thread

[mrtickleuk]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

Nah, the Regular Dads™️ all bought the LGs because the marketing did its job perfickly, they’re the sort of people who wouldn’t know their VRR from their elbow

Oh, that's good. That's very good, I like it a lot. Bravo!

but they were told (prolly by YouTube, lol) that these features were incredibly important and that their lives wouldn’t be worth living without them. The power of FOMO (no, not the white gloved goober on YT) is stronger than ever.

Agreed. Not only a clown, but even dresses as one. Recently humiliated himself with speculation about LGD 3S4C panels used in LGE C1 TVs and being artificially "gimped". smh.

[MisterXDTV]

Originally Posted by wakka

I would say that the 2.1 features are genuinely very useful for gaming - 120hz support is growing rapidly, particularly on Xbox. And gaming is far from a niche pursuit these days. In fact, I'd wager most people buying an OLED are planning to do at least some gaming on it. Whether people know what the benefit of VRR or 120hz actually is or not, if they own a Series X or PS5 and they're in the market for a new TV, they'll want something that can use the new features those consoles offer.

The problem is, as you point out, Panasonic have compromised their primary USP in order to do it. That's a complete mistake - they should've waited until they could implement 2.1 features and maintain class-leading accuracy at the same time.

The point is Gamers don't buy a 65" OLED that costs 3800 € and that has a worse SoC than the LG C1...

Gamers are looking for compact OLEDs 48 inch now and 42 inch in a few months...

A 42" LG C1 is supposed to come out at around $1000. Panasonic can't compete with that...

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by wakka

If you want to compete in the mass market, I think you have to aim to offer sets that won't leave customers with FOMO. As you say, buying a TV is a box ticking exercise at most for the majority of people. If they're dropping 1k+, they're going to want all the boxes ticked.

I would say that the 2.1 features are genuinely very useful for gaming - 120hz support is growing rapidly, particularly on Xbox. And gaming is far from a niche pursuit these days. In fact, I'd wager most people buying an OLED are planning to do at least some gaming on it. Whether people know what the benefit of VRR or 120hz actually is or not, if they own a Series X or PS5 and they're in the market for a new TV, they'll want something that can use the new features those consoles offer.

The problem is, as you point out, Panasonic have compromised their primary USP in order to do it. That's a complete mistake - they should've waited until they could implement 2.1 features and maintain class-leading accuracy at the same time.

Just my two cents - I'm looking forward to a point in the future where Panny have got it sorted and I can get something that boasts the gaming features on top of a terrific picture. Until then I'm sticking with my GZ

If they wanted to compete in the mass market then they’d sell these TVs en masse in North America. But they don’t.

[wakka]

I do think Panasonic TVs are eminently mass market personally - they regularly hit just over a grand - but other than that I'm not sure if we're agreeing or disagreeing!

Is your position that Panasonic should not include HDMI 2.1 features at all?

Originally Posted by MisterXDTV

The point is Gamers don't buy a 65" OLED that costs 3800 € and that has a worse SoC than the LG C1...

Gamers are looking for compact OLEDs 48 inch now and 42 inch in a few months...

A 42" LG C1 is supposed to come out at around $1000. Panasonic can't compete with that...

I got my Panny for £1k, so they do hit those prices

I think my views are a bit unpopular in this thread!

I don't really agree that people who play games don't buy large, high end TVs - I think they definitely do.

For me, I can totally understand Panasonic's rationale in wanting to get HDMI 2.1 features in place - I think it makes complete sense, as I think you're removing a barrier to sales to a very important segment of the market that won't buy a TV that doesn't have those features.

Speaking as someone who both plays games and cares about picture accuracy, I'd love to have a set in the future from Panasonic that was very capable in both regards.

[Indiana Jonezzz...]

Originally Posted by wakka

When I upgraded from my old plasma last year, I chose to sacrifice 2.1 for the picture accuracy of Panasonic and got a GZ950.

What’s your opinion of the GZ950? I was close to buying one myself, but they’re sold out now.

[wakka]

Originally Posted by Indiana Jonezzz...

What’s your opinion of the GZ950? I was close to buying one myself, but they’re sold out now.

I'm a big fan. Used with the Professional 2 video setting, it gives a wonderfully rich, natural picture, right out of the box. It would look even better with professional calibration, I'm sure.

My only issue with it is the motion handling. It's not as good as my plasma was in that regard. Fine for the most part, but a little judder is detectable in some panning shots. I think this is to some extent a limitation of OLED though (at least that's my understanding - someone might be along with better information).

You could look at the HZ980 if that's still knocking around, which is very similar - it was released as the 2020 'budget' OLED, using the 2019 panel used in the GZ950, but with a couple of extra bells and whistles from the HZ line (Filmmaker Mode, mostly, I think).

[lgans316]

I hope we get a PRO non-gaming videophile grade TV for movies and one with all this HDMI 2.1 VRR nonsense.

[Indiana Jonezzz...]

Originally Posted by wakka

I'm a big fan. Used with the Professional 2 video setting, it gives a wonderfully rich, natural picture, right out of the box. It would look even better with professional calibration, I'm sure.

My only issue with it is the motion handling. It's not as good as my plasma was in that regard. Fine for the most part, but a little judder is detectable in some panning shots. I think this is to some extent a limitation of OLED though (at least that's my understanding - someone might be along with better information).

You could look at the HZ980 if that's still knocking around, which is very similar - it was released as the 2020 'budget' OLED, using the 2019 panel used in the GZ950, but with a couple of extra bells and whistles from the HZ line (Filmmaker Mode, mostly, I think).

That’s really good to hear that about the GZ950. I know that no TV is perfect, but for the money, I’d read very, very good things about it. Funnily enough, the HZ980 is exactly the TV I’m looking at now. I’d heard it was basically the same as the GZ950, but with a few tweaks, and it’s down to only £1399 now too for the 65inch model.

I’m still using my Panasonic plasma too, as it still gives me a really wonderful picture. I use a Panasonic UB820 4K player to convert 4K HDR discs to HD SDR, and they look really excellent after a few tweaks, pretty much always considerably better than playing the actual Blu-ray discs. But I’m itching to get an actual 4K TV now, I just didn’t want to end up disappointed, so your comments about your upgrade are good to hear.

[wakka]

No worries, glad it's helpful. I use a UB820 too as I missed the boat on the Oppo 203s (by about 5 years!).

£1399 for a 65" HZ980 is an absolute steal!

[Indiana Jonezzz...]

Originally Posted by wakka

No worries, glad it's helpful. I use a UB820 too as I missed the boat on the Oppo 203s (by about 5 years!).

£1399 for a 65" HZ980 is an absolute steal!

Yeah, that’s what I was thinking!

[unberechenbar]

Originally Posted by lgans316

I hope we get a PRO non-gaming videophile grade TV for movies and one with all this HDMI 2.1 VRR nonsense.

So a mastering monitor?

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by wakka

I do think Panasonic TVs are eminently mass market personally - they regularly hit just over a grand - but other than that I'm not sure if we're agreeing or disagreeing!

Is your position that Panasonic should not include HDMI 2.1 features at all?



I got my Panny for £1k, so they do hit those prices

I think my views are a bit unpopular in this thread!

I don't really agree that people who play games don't buy large, high end TVs - I think they definitely do.

For me, I can totally understand Panasonic's rationale in wanting to get HDMI 2.1 features in place - I think it makes complete sense, as I think you're removing a barrier to sales to a very important segment of the market that won't buy a TV that doesn't have those features.

Speaking as someone who both plays games and cares about picture accuracy, I'd love to have a set in the future from Panasonic that was very capable in both regards.

Yes, I’m saying Panny shouldn’t have used the tech until it was ready for prime time, but then tech history is littered with examples of companies doing just that and hey, there’s always next year.

But we’re not saying that no gamer ever bought a four grand 65” Pannysonic, we’re saying that as a user base that percentage is likely to be infinitesimal compared to the numbers that LG shift (again, bear in mind that Panny pulled out of North America years ago) so I don’t see the logic in catering for mass market appeal while undermining their core USPs on a specific TV that takes up a tiny slice of an already tiny market share. Heck, they could’ve put those chips into lower down models and kept the 2000 series free of these impurities, stating their exact reasons for doing so.

You seem to regard 2.1 as some kind of passport to mass-market fortune and glory, but that ain’t happening on a 65” TV that costs four grand, I don’t care what manufacturer it’s from. Of coursh, if the 2.1 implementation went without a hitch then we wouldn’t even be discussing this and laying bare our biases, but that it’s compromised picture quality means that I’m loving this chance to give 2.1 a good kicking

[wakka]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

Yes, I’m saying Panny shouldn’t have used the tech until it was ready for prime time, but then tech history is littered with examples of companies doing just that and hey, there’s always next year.

But we’re not saying that no gamer ever bought a four grand 65” Pannysonic, we’re saying that as a user base that percentage is likely to be infinitesimal compared to the numbers that LG shift (again, bear in mind that Panny pulled out of North America years ago) so I don’t see the logic in catering for mass market appeal while undermining their core USPs on a specific TV that takes up a tiny slice of an already tiny market share. Heck, they could’ve put those chips into lower down models and kept the 2000 series free of these impurities, stating their exact reasons for doing so.

You seem to regard 2.1 as some kind of passport to mass-market fortune and glory, but that ain’t happening on a 65” TV that costs four grand, I don’t care what manufacturer it’s from. Of coursh, if the 2.1 implementation went without a hitch then we wouldn’t even be discussing this and laying bare our biases, but that it’s compromised picture quality means that I’m loving this chance to give 2.1 a good kicking

I think we're in agreement, to be honest. They should've held off until they could do it right. This current 2000 set won't win fans from movie-focused buyers or ones who want gaming features (or ones looking for both!).

[I DO BLU]

55" Sony A90J vs 65" A80J Comparison - Does Picture Quality Trump Size? - YouTube

[LordoftheRings]

Go big or go home.

Get the best quality video display and enlarge it to your field of view and to your bank account's accommodation zone of comfort.

[DDH]

Is Vincent Teoh looking for a new form of monetization?

https://twitter.com/Vincent_Teoh/sta...57661977985033

https://twitter.com/Vincent_Teoh/sta...36055146962946

[wxman2003]

Originally Posted by DDH

Is Vincent Teoh looking for a new form of monetization?

https://twitter.com/Vincent_Teoh/sta...57661977985033

https://twitter.com/Vincent_Teoh/sta...36055146962946

He has taken a big hit with his calibration service due to Covid. I don't blame him for trying to find some more revenue.

[wakka]

Yeah, nothing wrong with him setting up a Patreon at all. It’s a good move.

[Waboman]

I’m holding out for Vincent’s Only Fans site. Where members only will have a whole new meaning. Ding

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by wxman2003

He has taken a big hit with his calibration service due to Covid. I don't blame him for trying to find some more revenue.

So he’s down to just the one Rolex now then? Poor lad.