LG's new OLED TVs

[raygendreau]

Originally Posted by JimShaw

Why does V.E. need to be an online dealer? I live about 3,000 miles from V.E. and I purchased by phone and e-mail. I would rather buy and expensive TV from a brick and motor dealer.

Since they maintain a web presence, not being listed as an authorized online retailer could raise questions. However, it should not be an issue if the FTC regulations are complied with:

https://www.ftc.gov/tips-advice/busi...elephone-order

[JimShaw]

Originally Posted by raygendreau

Since they maintain a web presence, not being listed as an authorized online retailer could raise questions. However, it should not be an issue if the FTC regulations are complied with:

https://www.ftc.gov/tips-advice/busi...elephone-order

Doesn't raise questions. V.E. is smart to have a web site which helps promote the business but to purchase you have to call the retail store or stop by. If I remember correctly, a set cannot be purchase over their web site which makes them a brick and motor retail store only.


m

[raygendreau]

Originally Posted by JimShaw

Doesn't raise questions. V.E. is smart to have a web site which helps promote the business but to purchase you have to call the retail store or stop by. If I remember correctly, a set can not be purchase over their web site which makes them a brick and motor retail store only.


m

Correct. Just saying some may not understand that online retailer does not mean web presence only and must include online shopping cart and payment.

[Robert Zohn]

Originally Posted by raygendreau

I checked the LG and Sony authorized dealer lists. Value Electronics is listed as an authorized brick and mortar retailer for both, but is not listed as an authorized online retailer for either LG or Sony.

Originally Posted by JimShaw

Why does V.E. need to be an online dealer? I live about 3,000 miles from V.E. and I purchased by phone and e-mail. I would rather buy and expensive TV from a brick and motor dealer.

Originally Posted by raygendreau

Since they maintain a web presence, not being listed as an authorized online retailer could raise questions. However, it should not be an issue if the FTC regulations are complied with:

https://www.ftc.gov/tips-advice/busi...elephone-order

Originally Posted by JimShaw

Doesn't raise questions. V.E. is smart to have a web site which helps promote the business but to purchase you have to call the retail store or stop by. If I remember correctly, a set cannot be purchase over their web site which makes them a brick and motor retail store only.


m

Originally Posted by raygendreau

Correct. Just saying some may not understand that online retailer does not mean web presence only and must include online shopping cart and payment.

As I believe you concluded Value Electronics is authorized by Sony and LG, as well as most other major a/v brands. We operate out of a large Brick & Mortar a/v showroom in the downtown shopping section of Scarsdale, NY and we build specialty website for each major TV brand but do not sell on our websites. We take each order in-person or over the phone.

The bulk of our successful business is our local custom design and integration of high-end a/v equipment and systems. We build a lot of dedicated home cinemas, whole house distributed audio and surround sound with a large screen TVs wall mounted.

Everything is up and above board with our compliance in accordance to all of our dealer agreements and legal requirements for selling Nationwide.

A/V, photography, cinematography and all things scientific are my passion.

-Robert

[vinnie97]

Originally Posted by Blove23

I have to say just like the Pioneer Elite and Kuro's plasmas were not for everyone the same goes with the OLED. Soon to be the Holy Grail of television the OLED is not going to be for everyone. I would love everyone to have one, but like luxury cars not everyone can get one.
I can't stress enough if you want to see this television find out who has them on display and see if you can pre order the OLED. There are computer monitors with television tuners inside them LCDs, then you have an OLED a real television.
Find out who has them and go see it for yourself! The 4k OLED is simply amazing!

Already owning the first generation 55" 1080p, I know I'm in for a treat (I have seen the EC9700 demoed a few times as well). The prices will drop, as they always do.

[raygendreau]

Seems to me, the biggest concern is about the half life of the LG OLED panels. The limitation is the blue phosphor. Only time will tell. One year warranty for a product so pricey just doesn't cut it.

[vinnie97]

That limitation is largely mitigated by the white subpixel. All signs point to a half-life of 30k hours. I'm probably around 3k hours on the 9800 with no noticeable degradation. Depending on your viewing habits, even a 5-year warranty may not cut it if that's the looming fear you have.

[raygendreau]

Originally Posted by vinnie97

That limitation is largely mitigated by the white subpixel. All signs point to a half-life of 30k hours. I'm probably around 3k hours on the 9800 with no noticeable degradation. Depending on your viewing habits, even a 5-year warranty may not cut it if that's the looming fear you have.

The (guess)timates I have seen average around 7000 hours. What signs point to 30K hours? Also, does LG use a fluorescent blue pixel or a phosphorescent blue pixel?

[Robert Zohn]

LG is employing the patterned OLED display technology know as "Color By White", which is basically a large white only OLED with three colored sub-pixel RGB filters and one white only sub-pixel.

LG purchased the patterns from Eastman Kodak and as of today is the only methodology that can produce large screen OLED displays in high quantity with very good reliability and high yields.

No blue OLED is used so the lifespan of LG's OLED is estimated to be 30,000 hours to half life.

Hope this helps.

-Robert

[Robert Zohn]

Regarding the price; I don't see much price erosion on LG's 65EC9700.

The successor model, 65EG9600 will launch in a few weeks at $8,999 UPP and you will see some dealer incentives to add value.

-Robert

[JimShaw]

Originally Posted by Robert Zohn

LG is employing the patterned OLED display technology know as "Color By White", which is basically a large white only OLED with three colored sub-pixel RGB filters and one white only sub-pixel.

LG purchased the patterns from Eastman Kodak and as of today is the only methodology that can produce large screen OLED displays in high quantity with very good reliability and high yields.

No blue OLED is used so the lifespan of LG's OLED is estimated to be 30,000 hours to half life.

Hope this helps.

-Robert

Let's see...

If I watched an OLED 12 hours a day, that's about 7 years to half life. For one who changes TV's every two years, there is no concern on my part regarding the blue having problems.


m

[spectre08]

Originally Posted by JimShaw

Let's see...

If I watched an OLED 12 hours a day, that's about 7 years to half life. For one who changes TV's every two years, there is no concern on my part regarding the blue having problems.


m

I don't know if the chemistry is the same though, but assuming we can calculate half-life the same way a 7 year half-life would mean that after 2 years the OLEDs would still have decayed almost 20% (17.966% actually). that's not nothing.

[Robert Zohn]

Actually the half life is estimated at 30,000 hours so if it were linear and you used Jim's example of 7 days a week 12 hrs per day you would see about a 9% drop in peak luminance, not 17-20% after two years of very heavy use.

More importantly is that the luminance reduction is not linear and even more importantly is that you could increase the OLED light to compensate for the very slight drop in peak luminance.

I have one client who purchased LG's very first OLED TV, 55EA9800 and they use it every day very heavily. No one has noticed any change in the picture performance in anyway whatsoever.

Finally, when PDP first came to market they had a much lower life span and it never effected anyone that I know of.

I don't think lifespan is an issue for OLED TVs that use the WRGB technology.

Hope this helps.

-Robert

[raygendreau]

So, the trade off is longer life but less color accuracy for OLED WRGB vs RGB? Has this been improved with the 2015 LG line up?

http://www.digitaltrends.com/home-th...t-tv-for-2014/

[spectre08]

Originally Posted by Robert Zohn

Actually the half life is estimated at 30,000 hours so if it were linear and you used Jim's example of 7 days a week 12 hrs per day you would see about a 9% drop in peak luminance, not 17-20% after two years of very heavy use.

More importantly is that the luminance reduction is not linear and even more importantly is that you could increase the OLED light to compensate for the very slight drop in peak luminance.

I have one client who purchased LG's very first OLED TV, 55EA9800 and they use it every day very heavily. No one has noticed any change in the picture performance in anyway whatsoever.

Finally, when PDP first came to market they had a much lower life span and it never effected anyone that I know of.

I don't think lifespan is an issue for OLED TVs that use the WRGB technology.

Hope this helps.

-Robert

half life isn't linear though, it's exponential. It drops more quickly at the beginning than at the end.

[Robert Zohn]

Originally Posted by raygendreau

So, the trade off is longer life but less color accuracy for OLED WRGB vs RGB? Has this been improved with the 2015 LG line up?

http://www.digitaltrends.com/home-th...t-tv-for-2014/

Good question and thanks for linking to our 2014 TV Shootout results.

Color accuracy has improved very nicely with LG's OLED TVs. They now come out of the box very acculturate and a 2 point CMS adjustment dials it in very accurately.

-Robert

[spectre08]

the percent drop over two years would be calculated as 1 - (1/2)^(2 years/7 years)

[Spartan21]

OLED tvs are amazing and I hope they catch on with the general public. I just despise LCDs and their gray blacks. The prices will have to come down in order for that to happen though. I really hope LG will be successful with it's efforts because if they quit, then OLED tvs will be no more.

[Robert Zohn]

Originally Posted by spectre08

half life isn't linear though, it's exponential. It drops more quickly at the beginning than at the end.

From what I've been told OLED bulbs stabilize within 400 hours and then decay very gradually over their lifespan. After the initial 400 hours they decay very gradually and after the half life they decay faster. So if what I am told is correct the lifespan is not exponential.

Very respectfully, OLED lifespan is not an issue to be worried about.

-Robert

[JimShaw]

Originally Posted by Robert Zohn

From what I've been told OLED bulbs stabilize within 400 hours and then decay very gradually over their lifespan. After the initial 400 hours they decay very gradually and after the half life they decay faster. So if what I am told is correct the lifespan is not exponential.

Very respectfully, OLED lifespan is not an issue to be worried about.

-Robert

Interesting

Which brings to mind, if the bulbs stabilize after 400 hours, would you recommend calibrating after the 400 hour break in? Like the 150 hours for Samsung plasma and 300 hours for Panasonic's.

If so, will you be doing the break in/calibration package as you did the plasmas?



m