REDRAY 4K Player Unveiled.

[Spicoli]

REDRAY from the company that makes the RED camera has the first 4k media player. Looks to do what Blu can't .

Thoughts?


http://www.flatpanelshd.com/news.php...&id=1354605554
http://www.red.com/store/products/redray-player

[DavePS3]

I would imagine, that by the time 4K hits an actual disc, all newer players will make that change. Sony says that although many films are now shooting in 4 to 8K, getting that information onto a disc means the disc will need to be triple to quad' layered.

If you think about it, this is a pretty good reason to believe hard disc will continue for a long time. Even though many like to download movies these days, they wont be able to stream 4K any time soon because of the tiny pipe diameter of current bandwidth. Hell, they can barely get 1080p with 7.1 to stream properly.

(4K can also be run from a hard drive of course, like the material Sony is currently running on it's 84" LED)

[rdodolak]

Originally Posted by DavePS3

I would imagine, that by the time 4K hits an actual disc, all newer players will make that change. Sony says that although many films are now shooting in 4 to 8K, getting that information onto a disc means the disc will need to be triple to quad' layered.

If you think about it, this is a pretty good reason to believe hard disc will continue for a long time. Even though many like to download movies these days, they wont be able to stream 4K any time soon because of the tiny pipe diameter of current bandwidth. Hell, they can barely get 1080p with 7.1 to stream properly.

(4K can also be run from a hard drive of course, like the material Sony is currently running on it's 84" LED)

Didn't Blu-ray promise that back in 2005/2006.

[Kirk Out]

Damn that player above looks hidious. Yuck

[U4K61]

Originally Posted by Kirk Out

Damn that player above looks hidious. Yuck

[Show spoiler][/QUOTE]

And I thought it was a radar detector that went over the dash.

[5th Of November]

I'm not sure what to make of this. On one hand, it will be visually superior when compared to Blu-ray. On the other hand, getting content to the consumer isn't going to be an easy task. It's really just an exotic media player that plays a proprietary format. Will movies be sold on hard disks or flash drives? Do I have to download them from the internet? That won't be feasible for people with capped ISP's. Blu-ray is still evolving as well. I just don't see this being anything to worry about for awhile, if ever. RED cameras aren't going anywhere, but will there be enough demand for a media player like this in the home? It looks like something you'd find in Tony Stark's living room. I'll gladly adopt it if the content is there and it's affordable.

[frogmort]

It looks like HAL from 2001:

[pagemaster]

I highly doubt this will catch on.

[Quinthoopachiefy]

Originally Posted by frogmort

It looks like HAL from 2001:

It Does LOL!!

[Spicoli]

If we progress with technology and I am pretty sure we will, higher resolution images and screens will require much larger files which I doubt a disc will be able to handle.

[Prox]

Here's the part I'm iffy on:

But there is a twist. The Redray Player will only playback 4K content if it is encoded in RED’s own RED format that Hollywood already has access to. The RED format supports up to 4K resolution and 7.1 surround sound in 24-bit 48KHz. This requires approximately 2.5MB per second, according to RED which means that you can store around 100 hours of 4K content on the hard disc or stream in full quality from the Internet with an Internet connection faster than 25 Mbit/s.

I worry about their proprietary format because a) we don't know how good it will be and b) it may give them too much control over the price.

25 Mbps internet is crazy fast for most of the US. This is especially true when that's the minimum speed. Getting that level of download consistently for two hours is rough. ISPs have a ways to go before this is really usable.

Also, I just don't get the six HDMI out thing. How would this actually be used/wired up?

[Kirsty_Mc]

There is always the possibility that in future we will still be buying physical media (I've never been a strong believer in downloads and streaming for large video files). One way to cope with the data rate would be to load the physical media, this could be securely dumped to an internal hard drive and the file would be played from here rather than directly from the disc. This way existing blu ray technology could be used for 4K, you movie would maybe just come on four discs.

[Ascended_Saiyan]

Well, we know at least 1 or 2 (Sony and Disney) of the big 6 studios won't put content on it.

[vargo]

Originally Posted by Prox

Here's the part I'm iffy on:

I worry about their proprietary format because a) we don't know how good it will be and b) it may give them too much control over the price.

25 Mbps internet is crazy fast for most of the US. This is especially true when that's the minimum speed. Getting that level of download consistently for two hours is rough. ISPs have a ways to go before this is really usable.

Also, I just don't get the six HDMI out thing. How would this actually be used/wired up?

LOL, they have shifted their goalposts again. Several years ago they talked about 10Mbps for 4K. Then it was 15Mbps. More recently it was 20Mbps. Now they are telling people 25Mbps.

It seems their codec is getting worse as it matures (!). Or more likely their original 10Mbps demos were falsified.

I can do great looking 4k right now using H.264 Hi10p @ 25Mbps for many source types.

[wormraper]

Originally Posted by vargo

LOL, they have shifted their goalposts again. Several years ago they talked about 10Mbps for 4K. Then it was 15Mbps. More recently it was 20Mbps. Now they are telling people 25Mbps.

It seems their codec is getting worse as it matures (!). Or more likely their original 10Mbps demos were falsified.

I can do great looking 4k right now using H.264 Hi10p @ 25Mbps for many source types.

ding ding ding, we have a winner!!!!, no way has HVEC that much better. I can see 20-25 mbps, but 10???? not unless you REALLY want it to look like a Divx file

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by wormraper

ding ding ding, we have a winner!!!!, no way has HVEC that much better. I can see 20-25 mbps, but 10???? not unless you REALLY want it to look like a Divx file

For HEVC, the French achieved 16.5 mbps for bitrate identical (to H.264/AVC) PSNR. See…
https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...ch#post6827608

Also, keep in mind that PSNR is an objective measurement. Subjective testing (and people do view movies subjectively, rather than with data analysis, waveforms, scopes, etc.) have shown even further efficiency in bitrate … http://infoscience.epfl.ch/record/18...SPIE2012_1.pdf

Because, amongst other things, it is believed by investigators that PSNR does not take into account the saturation effect of the human visual system.

[zx_6r]

double sided 2 layer bd = 100Gb - would that work?

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Prox

Here's the part I'm iffy on:...

Also, I just don't get the six HDMI out thing. How would this actually be used/wired up?

Some of the early 4K tvs need 4 HDMI 1.3 cables to connect to RED’s player. The newer (and better) 4K tvs use one HDMI 1.4 cable.

Whether congratulatory or dismissive of the RED effort, as this being a physical media forum, to be fair, one has to applaud the fact that the player has physical delivery built-in (USB stick or SD card), despite the encumberment of obvious rights and protection management.

The technical nuance of which I would personally like more information is in regards to the RED laser projector (pro model), for its claimed ability to play DCPs, that being a rather BIG deal….at least to other competitors. The RED team has been very guarded in their responses to this particular feature on the Q & A thread which they started over on their forum at the time of the announcement(s).

But whenever the projector actually does ship, there should be no delay in actually testing out the claim, almost immediately, with the availability of this free download (Dec. 16, 2011 news entry at the top of the page, as of today), which can be used and distributed freely for both commercial and private use….

http://www.sintel.org/

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Spicoli

REDRAY from the company that makes the RED camera has the first 4k media player. Looks to do what Blu can't .

Thoughts?...

Excuse me if I don’t retype things from over a month ago when the announcement came out and was reported on this forum but, nevertheless, start about here….
https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...gm#post6818119

and scan through the following pages for more thoughts from me and other members, up to about here…
https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...ce#post6954858

In terms of the later ^ (and vargo should love this), originally, that last ODEMAX link had timelines regarding availability (to distributors and consumers). Namely, something like this was originally listed on that ODEMAX page….

”Distributor Access – Jan. 2013
Home and Theatrical Service – March 2013”

Now, I notice that particular information has been removed from that webpage.

[morkys]

I already went through the dvd to bd thing. I bought HD-dvd first and ditched that for bd. How long before BD becomes the beta of formats and we're left with dvd and Redray? I personally don't want redray and 4k because although it is "better"...I have seen 1080p bd on a projector screen at home and it's good enough for me, better than DVD on a projector. DVD upscaled looks good, but bd does look better.

Should I stop buying bluray and wait for redray?
I don't want to for one very simple reason. I don't want to wait. I want to collect older movies now and watch them.

What are you doing?