Terminator 2: Judgment Day (1991) (Skynet Edition)

[Gold Ranger]

Originally Posted by Patienceofkaori

What version is best for this is the skynet edition or the regular edition or should i just get the anthology set. I only really cared about the first 2 films not 3 or salvation, so any ideas would be greatly appreciated.

Skynet edition is in the Anthology set.

[Patienceofkaori]

So my best bet is to get the skynet edition and the new remaster of the terminator that was just released.

[GenPion]

Originally Posted by Patienceofkaori

So my best bet is to get the skynet edition and the new remaster of the terminator that was just released.

Yes, if you are sticking to domestic releases.

[Patienceofkaori]

yeah well i don't mind importing but i don't want it also to cost a huge fortune and i don't have a region free player yet.

[Brian81]

what makes the skynet edition better than the original north american bd? is it the lossless audio vs the dolby surround ex? the original us disc is far from great but it doesn't have all the skynet edition's extra noise reduction on top of it.

[GenPion]

Originally Posted by Brian81

what makes the skynet edition better than the original north american bd? is it the lossless audio vs the dolby surround ex? the original us disc is far from great but it doesn't have all the skynet edition's extra noise reduction on top of it.

Yes, the DNR on the Skynet edition is troublesome to have on the film... but the bit-rates, encoding method, and overall scan quality is not as good on this first issue of the film. And the audio is much better - true lossless audio on that release. So even with the flaws the Skynet edition is better than the standard US edition was. (There are more extras too, of course).

I still want the JP edition. The DNR really bugs me. But for someone sticking to the US editions it is the better of the two options.

[HD Goofnut]

Originally Posted by Brian81

what makes the skynet edition better than the original north american bd? is it the lossless audio vs the dolby surround ex? the original us disc is far from great but it doesn't have all the skynet edition's extra noise reduction on top of it.

The original BD is MPEG-2 and with only the theatrical cut. The Skynet release contains the theatrical, director's, and extended cuts.

[GenPion]

Originally Posted by HD Goofnut

The original BD is MPEG-2 and with only the theatrical cut. The Skynet release contains the theatrical, director's, and extended cuts.

I should have led with that info as to why the Skynet edition is better.

The Director's Cut is my favorite.

[nycomet]

I've watched T2 a million times and I cannot find a difference between the Skynet edition and the original version. What's the big deal with the Skynet version?

[HD Goofnut]

Originally Posted by nycomet

I've watched T2 a million times and I cannot find a difference between the Skynet edition and the original version. What's the big deal with the Skynet version?

https://forum.blu-ray.com/showpost.p...postcount=1034

[Brian81]

Originally Posted by GenPion

Yes, the DNR on the Skynet edition is troublesome to have on the film... but the bit-rates, encoding method, and overall scan quality is not as good on this first issue of the film. And the audio is much better - true lossless audio on that release. So even with the flaws the Skynet edition is better than the standard US edition was. (There are more extras too, of course).

I still want the JP edition. The DNR really bugs me. But for someone sticking to the US editions it is the better of the two options.

Ha...forgot about the extended edition bit.

Looking at Caps-a-Holic...the JP disc and the original US BD look pretty similar...more similar than the JP disc is to the US Skynet. Just better encoding.

I'm still with the original US for theatrical and UK HD DVD for the extended. Unfortunately the UK release was just for the extended (both BD and HD DVD) and by the time the UK theatrical came, it was the Skynet edition.

JP disc is so expensive - I'd have a hard time justifying it, for simply better encoding alone. Master used is the same for all of these. I've thought of just picking up the original AU BD so I can have both cuts on BD minus the additional DNR. All of these look lousy compared to the quality of the T1 restoration.

[nagysaudio]

Here's the deal:

All versions use the same DVD era dusty transfer with baked in EE, etc.

Original U.S. release is worthless. It has MPEG-2 encode. Lossy soundtrack. No extras, or alternate cuts. Skip it.

The UK release is also worthless even though it has an AVC encode and lossless sound. It's only the inferior extended cut. James Cameron's preferred and director's cut is the theatrical version as per Cameron himself. Skip it.

The JP release has the theatrical cut with an AVC encode and lossless sound. However, it has not been cleaned up, it's very expensive, and there are issued with the image being ever so slightly stretched. The encode is not the best either. Hardly a difference between the first U.S. MPEG-2 effort. Final nail in the coffin is the insanely expensive price, which makes it completely unworthy. Skip it.

And lastly we have the U.S. Skynet release. All three versions of the movie are present. It has the best encode by a mile. It has the best lossless sound. The image has no geometry problems. The entire transfer has been cleaned up from print damage, scratches, specs, etc. by Lowry. There are tons of extras on the disc. But... And it's a big but. The image has been moderately DNRed. Which sucks no doubt. Having said that and regardless of this unfortunate tinkering, this is still the best, most correct, and fullest presentation of Terminator 2: Judgment Day available on home video. This makes it a no brainer that the Skynet is the version to buy on Blu-ray currently, especially since it's dirt cheap. Buy it.

Lowry has been working on a new 4K scan from OCN which Cameron is still contemplating on converting to 3D. Whatever happens, we will be getting a definitive version of Terminator 2 in the near future. How near is relative. Cameron is busy, so it may be a number of years.

[nycomet]

^^^^^^
Thank you for explaining this.

By the way, what is Cameron busy doing? I'm guessing more Avatar movies.

He needs to get The Abyss out on blu.

[thebard]

Originally Posted by nagysaudio

Here's the deal:

All versions use the same DVD era dusty transfer with baked in EE, etc.

Original U.S. release is worthless. It has MPEG-2 encode. Lossy soundtrack. No extras, or alternate cuts. Skip it.

The UK release is also worthless even though it has an AVC encode and lossless sound. It's only the inferior extended cut. James Cameron's preferred and director's cut is the theatrical version as per Cameron himself. Skip it.

The JP release has the theatrical cut with an AVC encode and lossless sound. However, it has not been cleaned up, it's very expensive, and there are issued with the image being ever so slightly stretched. The encode is not the best either. Hardly a difference between the first U.S. MPEG-2 effort. Final nail in the coffin is the insanely expensive price, which makes it completely unworthy. Skip it.

And lastly we have the U.S. Skynet release. All three versions of the movie are present. It has the best encode by a mile. It has the best lossless sound. The image has no geometry problems. The entire transfer has been cleaned up from print damage, scratches, specs, etc. by Lowry. There are tons of extras on the disc. But... And it's a big but. The image has been moderately DNRed. Which sucks no doubt. Having said that and regardless of this unfortunate tinkering, this is still the best, most correct, and fullest presentation of Terminator 2: Judgment Day available on home video. This makes it a no brainer that the Skynet is the version to buy on Blu-ray currently, especially since it's dirt cheap. Buy it.

Lowry has been working on a new 4K scan from OCN which Cameron is still contemplating on converting to 3D. Whatever happens, we will be getting a definitive version of Terminator 2 in the near future. How near is relative. Cameron is busy, so it may be a number of years.

The stretching is so minimal as to be negligible. It bothers me much less than the dnr on the US version.

But yes, it has gone up in price and is currently only available through marketplace sellers; perhaps another reissue will remedy this and bring it back down in price soon.

[sackexchange]

Originally Posted by nagysaudio

Here's the deal:

All versions use the same DVD era dusty transfer with baked in EE, etc.

Original U.S. release is worthless. It has MPEG-2 encode. Lossy soundtrack. No extras, or alternate cuts. Skip it.

The UK release is also worthless even though it has an AVC encode and lossless sound. It's only the inferior extended cut. James Cameron's preferred and director's cut is the theatrical version as per Cameron himself. Skip it.

The JP release has the theatrical cut with an AVC encode and lossless sound. However, it has not been cleaned up, it's very expensive, and there are issued with the image being ever so slightly stretched. The encode is not the best either. Hardly a difference between the first U.S. MPEG-2 effort. Final nail in the coffin is the insanely expensive price, which makes it completely unworthy. Skip it.

And lastly we have the U.S. Skynet release. All three versions of the movie are present. It has the best encode by a mile. It has the best lossless sound. The image has no geometry problems. The entire transfer has been cleaned up from print damage, scratches, specs, etc. by Lowry. There are tons of extras on the disc. But... And it's a big but. The image has been moderately DNRed. Which sucks no doubt. Having said that and regardless of this unfortunate tinkering, this is still the best, most correct, and fullest presentation of Terminator 2: Judgment Day available on home video. This makes it a no brainer that the Skynet is the version to buy on Blu-ray currently, especially since it's dirt cheap. Buy it.

Lowry has been working on a new 4K scan from OCN which Cameron is still contemplating on converting to 3D. Whatever happens, we will be getting a definitive version of Terminator 2 in the near future. How near is relative. Cameron is busy, so it may be a number of years.

I wouldn't say the UK optimum is worthless. I prefer it over the others and I'm not alone.

[I KEEL YOU]

@ this DNR fest having "the best encode by a mile".

Also, I am pretty sure that of all the dozens of different version that have been released on blu ray (and HD-DVD) throughout the world, the Japanese version is the only one with the AVC codec.

None of the releases out there have a great transfer by 2014 standards. Not only that, but none of the releases get the most out of the current master, as outdated as it is. It is true that the Japanese is slightly stretched, otherwise it would have been as good as the current outdated master allows.

There are several factors to take into account when considering which version you should get:

1. Price
2. Region locked/free
3. How much you prefer the theatrical vs extended cut, or both

My opinion:

If the price isn't an issue at all, then get the Japanese version. I have it and I am quite happy with it. Has both cuts on two different discs. The picture quality is good (no DNR, AVC codec, decent bit rate), other than the stretching issue. The sound is great. It has a ton of extras, in 1080i. Excellent design on the steelbook and discs!

If the price is an issue, which it probably is because the Japanese version is quite expensive, but you have a region free player AND prefer the extended cut, then get the first UK release. It doesn't have the stretching issue, but the bit rate is 5 mbps lower than the Japanese edition, plus it is VC-1, which results in some compression arefacts at times. It only has the extended cut.

You could also consider the first French release. I am not 100% sure, but I believe that it is the exact same release as the HD-DVD, which is on caps-a-holic. As you can see, the Skynet also has a stretching issue (although slightly less stretching than the Japanese version) compared to this French HD-DVD. The French release has both cuts, but the problem is that it has forced French subtitles, at least on the theatrical cut I believe. I don't know if they are entirely on the black bars since this is a 2.35:1 release.

The first US MPEG2 release (only the theatrical cut) has less DNR than the Skynet releases, but it has compression issues. Pick your poison between these two.

I still don't know how the first Australian release looks like.

In the end, study the caps of the many (not quite all) editions on caps-a-holic.com, and make your own decision:

http://caps-a-holic.com/hd_vergleich...hd_multiID=262

[Geoff D]

I dunno where nag got the 'Lowry' part from either. AFAIK they've never touched T2.

[MisterXDTV]

The transfer for this movie has been the same since 2003 when Artisan released the "Extreme DVD": it's an outdated 1080p telecine that is no longer good by today's standards.

All the existing HD-DVDs and Blu-rays (and even Disc 2 of the DVD version, WMV-HD) come from that same (old) transfer.

Until there's a proper remaster from a new scan, keep what you have and save your money!

This comes from the Extreme DVD Manual and explains why this transfer has stretching problems and is not good anymore 11 years later...

"The previous transfer of T2 (the version that appeared on T2 The Ultimate Edition DVD) was created at the highest quality available at that time. However, since that time, many improvements have taken place in the realm of film-to-video transfers (also known as telecine).

Upon evaluation of the 1997 master elements, THX and Artisan determined that the picture quality and format of the high-definition (HD) images might not meet today's standards for HD distribution in the future. While video processing on this older master could have created a good quality image for DVD, time and effort would be spent on a master that had little future. THX is proud to take part in Artisan's decision to retransfer T2 using the latest telecine and post production technologies. This new film transfer has resulted in the superior images you will find on this DVD release.

Starting from the same interpositive (IP) print created from the original negative of the film used in 1997, THX supervised the transfer of the film into HD video. This new HD master could be called an "electronic film master" since it is an exact representation of the film recorded onto HD-D5 videotapes. The transfer and subsequent mastering were performed at International Video Conversions (IVC) in Burbank, California.
The technical format for the T2 electronic film master is 1920x1080 24PsF.

Because of letterboxing, in a frame size of 1920x1080, a 2.35:1 picture would have used the entire resolution width of 1,920 pixels, but would only use approximately 815 lines of the 1,080 available lines. The rest of the 265 lines would be used and wasted by the black mattes. A decision was made early to optimize the new master by transferring the movie FULL FRAME by scanning each film frame so that it filled the entire 1920x1080 area, thus increasing the resolution of the image. While this master is not formatted properly, it utilises every single line for the actual picture content and maximises the ability to perform needed restoration.

[Brian81]

Originally Posted by nagysaudio

Here's the deal:

All versions use the same DVD era dusty transfer with baked in EE, etc.

Original U.S. release is worthless. It has MPEG-2 encode. Lossy soundtrack. No extras, or alternate cuts. Skip it.

The UK release is also worthless even though it has an AVC encode and lossless sound. It's only the inferior extended cut. James Cameron's preferred and director's cut is the theatrical version as per Cameron himself. Skip it.

The JP release has the theatrical cut with an AVC encode and lossless sound. However, it has not been cleaned up, it's very expensive, and there are issued with the image being ever so slightly stretched. The encode is not the best either. Hardly a difference between the first U.S. MPEG-2 effort. Final nail in the coffin is the insanely expensive price, which makes it completely unworthy. Skip it.

And lastly we have the U.S. Skynet release. All three versions of the movie are present. It has the best encode by a mile. It has the best lossless sound. The image has no geometry problems. The entire transfer has been cleaned up from print damage, scratches, specs, etc. by Lowry. There are tons of extras on the disc. But... And it's a big but. The image has been moderately DNRed. Which sucks no doubt. Having said that and regardless of this unfortunate tinkering, this is still the best, most correct, and fullest presentation of Terminator 2: Judgment Day available on home video. This makes it a no brainer that the Skynet is the version to buy on Blu-ray currently, especially since it's dirt cheap. Buy it.

Lowry has been working on a new 4K scan from OCN which Cameron is still contemplating on converting to 3D. Whatever happens, we will be getting a definitive version of Terminator 2 in the near future. How near is relative. Cameron is busy, so it may be a number of years.

I'd hardly call the original US BD 'worthless'....it still has the best PICTURE QUALITY if you are NOT looking to import. And the UK BD is about as good as you are going to get for the Extended Cut. Yes, it is NOT James Cameron's version of the film, but it is an alternate version available for fans of the film who want to see the additional footage that was cut for various reasons.

But then again, I shouldn't be arguing this since you seem to prefer moderate DNR when it comes to titles using older masters.

[HD Goofnut]

Originally Posted by Brian81

I'd hardly call the original US BD 'worthless'....it still has the best PICTURE QUALITY if you are NOT looking to import.

For the theatrical cut only.