The Anime Blu-ray Video Quality Thread - Page 208 - Blu-ray Forum

professorwho · 08-02-2019, 07:40 PM

You never stop b*tching about Robot Carnival, do you, Gouki? It was remastered that way and that’s what Discotek was given. I agree it’s annoying but when there’s explanations about it from the people who worked on it, I’d stop complaining as it’s all done and nothing can be done about it.

I think the OAR is very important, but my issue with you using the same screenshots every time is that it gets old and it’s been explained before. Either buy it or don’t. Discotek won’t be loosing money on one less sale so it’s no real difference in the end.

Steve Freeling · 08-02-2019, 07:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by professorwho

That's unacceptable. I don't know what they were even thinking. There's practically nothing that destroys video quality like glitched frames and I'm sorry to say the folks at Pony Canyon should be ashamed for letting this piece of crap eke by quality control.

Dailyan · 08-02-2019, 07:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve Freeling

That's unacceptable. I don't know what they were even thinking. There's practically nothing that destroys video quality like glitched frames and I'm sorry to say the folks at Pony Canyon should be ashamed for letting this piece of crap eke by quality control.

It’s a glitch from VirtualDub.

professorwho · 08-02-2019, 07:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve Freeling

That's unacceptable. I don't know what they were even thinking. There's practically nothing that destroys video quality like glitched frames and I'm sorry to say the folks at Pony Canyon should be ashamed for letting this piece of crap eke by quality control.

I’m starting to think it was a problem with the screenshots I took, as it only happened when I played the film in Virtual Dub 2. I checked VLC and my other BD players (Xbox One S, PS4, region free Seiki) and the glitched frames didn’t show up.

Steve Freeling · 08-02-2019, 08:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by professorwho

I’m starting to think it was a problem with the screenshots I took, as it only happened when I played the film in Virtual Dub 2. I checked VLC and my other BD players (Xbox One S, PS4, region free Seiki) and the glitched frames didn’t show up.

So it was the type of thing that happens when Samsung Blu-ray players cause Fox Blu-rays to skip?

Dailyan · 08-02-2019, 08:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve Freeling

So it was the type of thing that happens when Samsung Blu-ray players cause Fox Blu-rays to skip?

What releases are you specifically talking about? I’ve played plenty of Fox/MGM mastered discs on my region free Samsung player and never had a problem.

NLScavenger · 08-02-2019, 08:21 PM

Those glitched frames appear when an unindexed stream is fed through VirtualDub2, but jumping a few frames back and trying again usually helps. Feeding an indexed stream via an Avisynth script to VirtualDub2 should fix the problem completely, but indexing takes time. Other software have no problem with unindexed streams.

I use DGAVCIndex now to take screenshots from the m2ts, so I don't encounter this problem, but sometimes I do use VirtualDub2.

-----------------------------------------

Speaking of aspect ratios, I dislike it when video is cropped to create a faux widescreen picture, but in some cases it's perhaps possible to open up 1.33:1 to 1.66:1 without losing top and bottom information.

Example: Il était une fois... la vie (Once Upon a Time... Life), French series animated by the Japanese studio Eiken

Steve Freeling · 08-02-2019, 08:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dailyan

What releases are you specifically talking about? I’ve played plenty of Fox/MGM mastered discs on my region free Samsung player and never had a problem.

Just about all of them I've played on my J5100 within the past couple years. The only ones that haven't are my X-Files Blu-rays, Working Girl, Predator, Commando, and Conan the Barbarian, though for the first few months I had the player, that wasn't an issue.

Dailyan · 08-02-2019, 08:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve Freeling

Just about all of them I've played on my J5100 within the past couple years. The only ones that haven't are my X-Files Blu-rays, Working Girl, Predator, Commando, and Conan the Barbarian, though for the first few months I had the player, that wasn't an issue.

That’s the same one, I believe, I have my region free player and have never noticed that when playing Fox mastered discs (and I have own a lot of Fox discs).

professorwho · 08-02-2019, 09:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dino-Killer 912

I noticed Eleven Arts uploaded a re-release trailer of Millennium Actress:

I made some comparisons between this trailer and Taiwanese Blu-ray, which uses the same remaster as the Japanese Blu-ray.

Finally got to look at these.

Huh, well I certainly prefer the look of the TW/JP BD over the new remaster, but it's possible that the video was uploaded with poor SDR conversion or something of the sort. Obviously the artifacts will be gone because YouTube compression is what it is, but I'm hoping this gets a UHD from Bandai in Japan so the restoration can be seen in its full glory.

I'm curious if the Eleven Arts BD will retain the 96kHz TrueHD 5.1 audio mix (or re-encode it to DTS HD-MA) or just keep it at 48kHz like the LPCM stereo downmix. Regardless, I'm very much looking forward to their eventual release.

NLScavenger · 08-02-2019, 09:58 PM

Castle of Cagliostro 4K UHD .png screenshots, not mine

https://ptpimg.me/hee3us.png
https://ptpimg.me/kpz2ck.png
https://ptpimg.me/0iom8e.png
https://ptpimg.me/0hp4ps.png
https://ptpimg.me/4yq205.png
https://ptpimg.me/d3scbr.png
https://ptpimg.me/35d5i1.png
https://ptpimg.me/ur9igc.png
https://ptpimg.me/37n9p8.png
https://ptpimg.me/9jue9k.png

Quick comparison

#1
4K UHD: https://ptpimg.me/hee3us.png
From left to right: BD bicubic upscale to 2160p, BD 1080p

#2
4K UHD: https://ptpimg.me/kpz2ck.png
From left to right: BD bicubic upscale to 2160p, BD 1080p

professorwho · 08-02-2019, 10:13 PM

On the colour: It's obviously a converted to SDR image, and possibly a bad one at that, so unless someone here gets it and confirms how bad the image is converted, than I'm not gonna judge it based on colour alone.

On the detail: The 1080p BD used (the Miyazaki Box set/Discotek one) was fairly grain-managed already, but it was done in such a way where detail wasn't lost, and there still was actual grain in the image. Look at Comparison #1- the car seats have some noticeable grain that adds texture to the shot. The UHD eliminates it completely. Move to the left side of the shot and some detail on the cloud in the background is gone, and Lupin's hair is less refined due to the DNR.

If you ever wanted Castle of Cagliostro to look like a painting with blotchy smears, then this is for you. If you want a faithful representation of a 35mm film from 1979, than the Discotek BD is the way to go.

kevers7290 · 08-02-2019, 11:32 PM

Does anyone have a direct comparison of the two US releases of Maquia (Shout vs Nozomi)?

professorwho · 08-02-2019, 11:33 PM

I think there may have been one some pages back... but I'm not sure. I'll go check.

professorwho · 08-02-2019, 11:38 PM

Nope. But, here's Nozomi screenshots I found. I'm a bit lazy to not find the Shout ones, but maybe someone else will.

bensunt · 08-03-2019, 06:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by professorwho

If you ever wanted Castle of Cagliostro to look like a painting with blotchy smears, then this is for you. If you want a faithful representation of a 35mm film from 1979, than the Discotek BD is the way to go.

I own all 3 and frankly the UHD doesn’t look like a painting with blotchy smears at all. My projector is calibrated and it doesn’t look like these screenshots at all. What comes from a computer screenshot doesn’t look the same on a TV or projector screen, even calibrated. Any TV or projector has a video processor that will always change what is on disc. Change the settings of your TV from standard to vivid to cinema,... and it will change contrast, colors, resolution,...

Everybody does what he wants with his money, but the UHD has no lack of details and there is in fact a light layer of grain present throughout. My only doubt comes from, what appears to me, as a different color scheme for some scenes compared to the Miyazaki Collection/Discotek bluray.

Naiera · 08-03-2019, 10:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bensunt

Any TV or projector has a video processor that will always change what is on disc.

They're not supposed to change anything, they're supposed to present what's on the disc as accurately as possible.

Enigmo_1 · 08-03-2019, 08:09 PM

Just watched the Japanese BD for 4K Cobra remaster.

When I saw the screenshots last year (https://imgbox.com/g/vVn74xizni) I was in utter despair that future 4K remasters of anime would be totally unwatchable. But these screenshots made it look worse than it is; might be bad HDR to SDR tonemapping idk.

But yeah, sitting a resonable distance away from my TV, the lines were black and there weren't those weird pale colours. It was probably the closest I've ever seen an old Anime release resemble the raw animation cels.

But yeah, that is of course just when I'm sitting a resonable distance away (not that far away btw, like probably less than 2 meters away) from my 50 inch tv. If you sit close or are inspecting the video itself then yeah, there's a very gross roughness about it.

Anyway yeah, for purists and archivists, it's probably a nightmare regardless.

Ccharmanderk · 08-03-2019, 09:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cfx

While I think it's the wrong thing to do, I've been thinking and wondering if that is what they're trying to accomplish on these by wiping out the grain like they are doing.

Almost certainly but the issue with that is that's not how it's supposed to be presented. Features produced on film should ideally be presented as such.

professorwho · 08-03-2019, 09:23 PM

Cobra looks arguably worse than the Lupin UHDs, at least from the screencaps I’ve seen.

Now, the idea of making it look more like the animation cels is nice in theory, but not a good decision in the end. Grain produces detail and it adds texture to an image, so when missing, it looses a charm to its quality that was made only by the technology of the era. But if that’s the case- why do we see filmmakers add digital grain to their films? There is an appeal of what is technically a flawed image, but one where it’s flaws actually create character and charm.

It is almost impossible to describe the appeal of film grain, so I’ll leave it there before I get more pretentious than I have already.

08-02-2019, 07:40 PM	#4141
professorwho Blu-ray Champion Top contributor Member since:Apr 2017 4K collection:229 Blu-ray collection:982 Blu-ray reviews: 64 Trading Score:7	You never stop b*tching about Robot Carnival, do you, Gouki? It was remastered that way and that’s what Discotek was given. I agree it’s annoying but when there’s explanations about it from the people who worked on it, I’d stop complaining as it’s all done and nothing can be done about it. I think the OAR is very important, but my issue with you using the same screenshots every time is that it gets old and it’s been explained before. Either buy it or don’t. Discotek won’t be loosing money on one less sale so it’s no real difference in the end.

08-02-2019, 09:58 PM	#4151
NLScavenger Blu-ray Ninja Top contributor Member since:Dec 2013 Location:Netherlands 4K collection:20 Blu-ray collection:831 Trading Score:9	Castle of Cagliostro 4K UHD .png screenshots, not mine https://ptpimg.me/hee3us.png https://ptpimg.me/kpz2ck.png https://ptpimg.me/0iom8e.png https://ptpimg.me/0hp4ps.png https://ptpimg.me/4yq205.png https://ptpimg.me/d3scbr.png https://ptpimg.me/35d5i1.png https://ptpimg.me/ur9igc.png https://ptpimg.me/37n9p8.png https://ptpimg.me/9jue9k.png Quick comparison #1 4K UHD: https://ptpimg.me/hee3us.png From left to right: BD bicubic upscale to 2160p, BD 1080p #2 4K UHD: https://ptpimg.me/kpz2ck.png From left to right: BD bicubic upscale to 2160p, BD 1080p

08-02-2019, 10:13 PM	#4152
professorwho Blu-ray Champion Top contributor Member since:Apr 2017 4K collection:229 Blu-ray collection:982 Blu-ray reviews: 64 Trading Score:7	On the colour: It's obviously a converted to SDR image, and possibly a bad one at that, so unless someone here gets it and confirms how bad the image is converted, than I'm not gonna judge it based on colour alone. On the detail: The 1080p BD used (the Miyazaki Box set/Discotek one) was fairly grain-managed already, but it was done in such a way where detail wasn't lost, and there still was actual grain in the image. Look at Comparison #1- the car seats have some noticeable grain that adds texture to the shot. The UHD eliminates it completely. Move to the left side of the shot and some detail on the cloud in the background is gone, and Lupin's hair is less refined due to the DNR. If you ever wanted Castle of Cagliostro to look like a painting with blotchy smears, then this is for you. If you want a faithful representation of a 35mm film from 1979, than the Discotek BD is the way to go.

08-02-2019, 11:32 PM	#4153
kevers7290 Blu-ray Samurai Member since:Jun 2009 Trading Score:257	Does anyone have a direct comparison of the two US releases of Maquia (Shout vs Nozomi)?

08-02-2019, 11:33 PM	#4154
professorwho Blu-ray Champion Top contributor Member since:Apr 2017 4K collection:229 Blu-ray collection:982 Blu-ray reviews: 64 Trading Score:7	I think there may have been one some pages back... but I'm not sure. I'll go check.

08-02-2019, 11:38 PM	#4155
professorwho Blu-ray Champion Top contributor Member since:Apr 2017 4K collection:229 Blu-ray collection:982 Blu-ray reviews: 64 Trading Score:7	Nope. But, here's Nozomi screenshots I found. I'm a bit lazy to not find the Shout ones, but maybe someone else will.

08-03-2019, 08:09 PM	#4158
Enigmo_1 Active Member Member since:Jul 2018	Just watched the Japanese BD for 4K Cobra remaster. When I saw the screenshots last year (https://imgbox.com/g/vVn74xizni) I was in utter despair that future 4K remasters of anime would be totally unwatchable. But these screenshots made it look worse than it is; might be bad HDR to SDR tonemapping idk. But yeah, sitting a resonable distance away from my TV, the lines were black and there weren't those weird pale colours. It was probably the closest I've ever seen an old Anime release resemble the raw animation cels. But yeah, that is of course just when I'm sitting a resonable distance away (not that far away btw, like probably less than 2 meters away) from my 50 inch tv. If you sit close or are inspecting the video itself then yeah, there's a very gross roughness about it. Anyway yeah, for purists and archivists, it's probably a nightmare regardless.

08-03-2019, 09:23 PM	#4160
professorwho Blu-ray Champion Top contributor Member since:Apr 2017 4K collection:229 Blu-ray collection:982 Blu-ray reviews: 64 Trading Score:7	Cobra looks arguably worse than the Lupin UHDs, at least from the screencaps I’ve seen. Now, the idea of making it look more like the animation cels is nice in theory, but not a good decision in the end. Grain produces detail and it adds texture to an image, so when missing, it looses a charm to its quality that was made only by the technology of the era. But if that’s the case- why do we see filmmakers add digital grain to their films? There is an appeal of what is technically a flawed image, but one where it’s flaws actually create character and charm. It is almost impossible to describe the appeal of film grain, so I’ll leave it there before I get more pretentious than I have already.

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