"Club Penton" - Ask questions to Hollywood insider "Penton-Man"

[Jeff Kleist]

first person to guess correctly the number of times she gets kidnapped or held hostage next year gets a random blu from my pile. 2 blus if you can name the number of kidnappers and the circumstances

[SpaceDog]

Tony and the resurrected corpse of Nina will kidnap her in the first episode. A cougar in episode 15.

[wallendo]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

Perhaps you missed it, I mentioned way back on the subtitle poll thread or here in this thread that I would actively promote the notion of SPHE producing Blu-ray subtitles about equal to their theatrical equivalent, in size………and I really feel pretty confident that I will prevail in that endeavor.

- they certainly should not be noticeably larger in size than what is currently being done by other major studios which already have plenty of experience in the employment of the ‘all subtitle lines in the active picture all the time’ procedure.

As blu-Ray becomes more mainstream, it will be used often on modest sized sets . Please make sure that the subtitles are big enough to be read by normal people on modest sets at typical distances (frequently across the room).

I have a 120 inch screen at home, but also like to watch BD's on smaller sets .

[SquidPuppet]

Originally Posted by SpaceDog

Tony and the resurrected corpse of Nina will kidnap her in the first episode. A cougar in episode 15.

LOL....winner.

[SquidPuppet]

Originally Posted by wallendo

As blu-Ray becomes more mainstream, it will be used often on modest sized sets . Please make sure that the subtitles are big enough to be read by normal people on modest sets at typical distances (frequently across the room).

I have a 120 inch screen at home, but also like to watch BD's on smaller sets .

Who are you callin normal.

[wallendo]

Originally Posted by SquidPuppet

Who are you callin normal.

"Them". Them is the normal people. As opposed to "us" who is videophiles and movie lovers.

[Jeff Kleist]

Steven Soderbergh goes smackdown on cable pan n scan

http://www.dgaquarterly.org/BACKISSU...0/Default.aspx

[syncguy]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

Perhaps you missed it, I mentioned way back on the subtitle poll thread or here in this thread that I would actively promote the notion of SPHE producing Blu-ray subtitles about equal to their theatrical equivalent, in size………and I really feel pretty confident that I will prevail in that endeavor.

- they certainly should not be noticeably larger in size than what is currently being done by other major studios which already have plenty of experience in the employment of the ‘all subtitle lines in the active picture all the time’ procedure.

Thank you. That's the way forward.

IMO, if the size of the text is just large enough to be read within a distance where HD can be appreciated that would be the right size. A line has to drown somewhere to decide the viewing distance and the text size. HD appreciable distance would be a good measure I think.

[Bobby Henderson]

While I agree 100% with Soderbergh's disgust over the new flavor of 2.40:1 to 1.77:1 panning and scanning, I would have more respect for his stance if the 2.40:1 movies he has made were photographed in formats bound to a super-wide aspect ratio.

Anamorphic 35mm film and 5-perf 65mm film are two formats where the full frame yields a super-wide aspect ratio image.

The Super35 format is an arguably home video safe widescreen format. When HBO "pans and scans" a Super35 movie they may actually be showing the viewer more imagery than what they would see in the more severely cropped 2.40:1 version.

The same thing is true for movies shot with HD quality digital cameras. They're typically starting with a native 1.77:1 ratio and merely cropping downward into it. In my opinion it's a bunch of pretentious crap. There's a very nice TV camera pretending to be a Panavision camera with anamorphic lenses. Well, at least one has the Panavision name on it which I guess makes the crop from 1.77:1 to 2.40:1 more "authentic."

Red Digital Cinema's "Mysterium Monstro 617" sensor (currently in development and expected to ship in 2010) is the only one I know of that features a native aspect ratio much closer to 2.40:1. The sensor is a whopping 168mm X 56mm, which yields an overall ratio of 2.58:1. The "brain" for that system alone will cost over $50,000. It can support resolutions up to 28K at 1-30fps.

Given the sad fact 2K is still the de facto standard for CGI and digital intermediate, I think there is a better chance of pigs learning to fly than any Hollywood production actually making an entirely 28K-based movie any time soon. Same thing goes for the 5K, 6K and 9K resolutions boasted by certain other Red camera sensors.

[Deciazulado]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

Perhaps you missed it, I mentioned way back on the subtitle poll thread or here in this thread that I would actively promote the notion of SPHE producing Blu-ray subtitles about equal to their theatrical equivalent, in size………and I really feel pretty confident that I will prevail in that endeavor.

- they certainly should not be noticeably larger in size than what is currently being done by other major studios which already have plenty of experience in the employment of the ‘all subtitle lines in the active picture all the time’ procedure.

Originally Posted by syncguy

Thank you. That's the way forward.

IMO, if the size of the text is just large enough to be read within a distance where HD can be appreciated that would be the right size. A line has to drown somewhere to decide the viewing distance and the text size. HD appreciable distance would be a good measure I think.

Well on an informal count we did here where people stated the size of their screen and sitting distance, they were sitting on average at 3.6 PH which is the recommended last row of a THX theater. Theatrical size subtitiles can be read from the last row. (Or even farther away, from the projectionist booth).

[wallendo]

Originally Posted by Deciazulado

Well on an informal count we did here where people stated the size of their screen and sitting distance, they were sitting on average at 3.6 PH which is the recommended last row of a THX theater. Theatrical size subtitiles can be read from the last row. (Or even farther away, from the projectionist booth).

If the average is 3.6 PH then about half of the people are sitting farther away than that. If your goal is for blu-ray to always remain a premium product (and DVD to serve the mainstream), the preserving subtitles at theatrical size may be reasonable. On the other hand, if blu-ray is to replace DVD, then appropriate adjustments may need to be made for the typical (non-home theater) user.

[Robert Siegel]

Originally Posted by SpaceDog

I'm looking forward to NxNW (and all Hitchcock), My Fair Lady, Wizard of Oz, To Kill a Mockingbird, and many others. Some I picked up on DVD and was blown away by the quality and attention to detail (wallpaper in MFL, as an example) others I've held off on hoping for a blu-ray edition.

The idea that some titles might only be available in roughshod burn as you go editions is quite upsetting to me.

I don't agree that classics have no future on home video as the above linked story states. Most people who own Blu-ray players now don't even know many of these older films, hopefully when the player base demographics get higher in age this will change. I don't think it helps that Warner is charging such high prices for Oz and Wind. It's fine for the collectors sets but there needs to be a single disc inexpensive release of these. What they are doing is treating Blu-ray like the laserdisc format over at Warner, with classics at least. Expensive sets were the only way to get the remastered editions on laserdisc as well. I can't afford those in these economic times. Oh, I know, classic pre-1970 films are much more expensive to restore for high-def, but there seems to be no shortage on Hdnet or Cinemax channels, I've seen beautiful transfers of Funny Girl, Oliver and hundreds of older films in high-def in the last several years on Dish Network. Hopefully one day there will be a Blu-ray market for them.

At least we get some new announcements occasionally like Agony and the Ecstasy and Dr. Zhivago. And that we can rejoice with such gems with beautiful transfers like South Pacific. But what about the missed opportunities? This year is the 45th anniversary of Mary Poppins and Disney released a 45th anniversary DVD but no Blu-ray. It is the 50th anniversary of Ben Hur and nothing has been scheduled for this year. I am really tired of seeing "Without a Paddle" and "Disaster Movie" bombs on the shelves. I wish we would see more films with substance.

[Jeff Kleist]

At least we get some new announcements occasionally like Agony and the Ecstasy and Dr. Zhivago. And that we can rejoice with such gems with beautiful transfers like South Pacific. But what about the missed opportunities? This year is the 45th anniversary of Mary Poppins and Disney released a 45th anniversary DVD but no Blu-ray. It is the 50th anniversary of Ben Hur and nothing has been scheduled for this year. I am really tired of seeing "Without a Paddle" and "Disaster Movie" bombs on the shelves. I wish we would see more films with substance

Mary Poppins I believe is supposed to be out before the end of the year. I know it's on the schedule, or was last I checked, and at the very least it's being worked on. Ben Hur had to be completely redone from scratch, but they were supposed to put it out this year originally, and I'm sure it's going to look absolutely fabulous when they're done with it. Anamorphic 65mm=resolution nirvana

I do think people have to face that outside of the top 2-300 films maybe, that in another 20 years there will be no market for the vast majority of pre-1960/70 films, because the people who grew up with them will be gone. The same thing will happen to the 80s in another 20 years. How much of a market is there going to be for Monster Squad, or even god forbid Goonies? A movie like Real Genius might survive, because it has the timeless nerd id going for it, but will the kids of 2025 really connect with the cold war mentality and antiquated tech of War Games?

These films should be preserved, and Hollywood should probably put together some kind of nonprofit whose job it is to maintain all this stuff that the studios don't want any more, but is part of history.

[Deciazulado]

Originally Posted by wallendo

If the average is 3.6 PH then about half of the people are sitting farther away than that. If your goal is for blu-ray to always remain a premium product (and DVD to serve the mainstream), the preserving subtitles at theatrical size may be reasonable. On the other hand, if blu-ray is to replace DVD, then appropriate adjustments may need to be made for the typical (non-home theater) user.

And half the people are sitting closer than that. I believe the average screen size slowly gets bigger every year too.

[Doctorossi]

Originally Posted by mntwister

At least we get some new announcements occasionally like Agony and the Ecstasy and Dr. Zhivago.

Wait- WHA?! WHA?! WHA?!

Are you being extremely loose with your examples here, or did I *somehow* miss something monumental?

[Deciazulado]

https://www.blu-ray.com/news/?id=3223

[sharkshark]

ridiculous... I've =NEVER= seen Zhivago, and it's sat on my shelf since that 2 disc was released... I've got no idea why, I'm just worried to watch it for some reason, that I might actually watch a Lean film and find it...well...not great.

So, so stupid. And now, after YEARS of not watching my perfectly fine disc, I'm sitting here contemplating selling it in favour of the forthcoming BD.

This, my friends, is a retarded hobby.

As for the classics not selling, this is something I've been entirely pessimistic about since the formats launched (and one this that, frankly, made me slightly reticent about a PS3-dominated format). Since day one I've lived a sort of "get 'em while you can" mentality that fueled my collection of SACD/DVD-A, with worries that at any time the various shoes (economic collapse, rise of download services, etc.) would drop. We'll see, but whatever these websites can do to encourage good catalogue titles, and whatever the studios can do to ensure that we're getting the best possible product with extras intact, means that we just might have a chance at making a go of such things.

Still, I worry.... Just how much longer are studios going to hemorrhage money supporting the small releases on this nascent format, when the only way they can make cash is with something shiny and new?

[Robert Harris]

Originally Posted by sharkshark

ridiculous... I've =NEVER= seen Zhivago, and it's sat on my shelf since that 2 disc was released... I've got no idea why, I'm just worried to watch it for some reason, that I might actually watch a Lean film and find it...well...not great.

If Zhivago were re-issued in 2009, it might well be the best picture released. Like many others, however, it is best viewed on a huge screen as intended.

RAH

[Robert Siegel]

Originally Posted by Jeff Kleist

Mary Poppins I believe is supposed to be out before the end of the year. I know it's on the schedule, or was last I checked, and at the very least it's being worked on. Ben Hur had to be completely redone from scratch, but they were supposed to put it out this year originally, and I'm sure it's going to look absolutely fabulous when they're done with it. Anamorphic 65mm=resolution nirvana

I do think people have to face that outside of the top 2-300 films maybe, that in another 20 years there will be no market for the vast majority of pre-1960/70 films, because the people who grew up with them will be gone. The same thing will happen to the 80s in another 20 years. How much of a market is there going to be for Monster Squad, or even god forbid Goonies? A movie like Real Genius might survive, because it has the timeless nerd id going for it, but will the kids of 2025 really connect with the cold war mentality and antiquated tech of War Games?.

Awesome about Mary Poppins and Ben Hur, thanks Jeff! Your other theory is quite sad but I can see what you are saying. If true, that gives me 20 years to enjoy Hollywood's classics in high-def, hopefully many will be released and I won't have to worry about it when I am 67 hehe.

[syncguy]

Originally Posted by Deciazulado

And half the people are sitting closer than that. I believe the average screen size slowly gets bigger every year too.

For sure the prices are coming down and the screen size in a typical lounge room is increasing. Today's high end system will be tomorrow's normal system. These days technology is changing so rapidly and it is becoming part of your life.

Really, seriously, people should not watch HD from the infinity. They really should enjoy and appreciate HD - so the subtitles should be tailored to content for these conditions. I think the culture is changing and people are indeed enjoying and appreciating HD.