"Club Penton" - Ask questions to Hollywood insider "Penton-Man"

[PeterTHX]

Originally Posted by sharkshark

Doc, that's it... I hereby demand another (good) hint. 1991 film that uses a "reverse" dolly-zoom.

Give it.

The Rocketeer?

[sharkshark]

Originally Posted by Doctorossi

Oh, shark... you started so strong and have fallen so hard. We've gone over so much of this before (my geography, etc.). Here I thought you'd exhausted the available research to get as far as you did, but maybe you just got lucky.

So, I'm now debating whether to toss out another bit of chum or send you back to the archives and tell you to "go fish".

Oh, you're taunting me... will think

I know it's not this... http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0093300/

[Penton-Man]

I had better reboot this topic with a visual aid so that you two guys don’t confuse other folks as it all started many pages back with me talking about Vertigo and Jaws having trombone shots...as a tangeant to our discussion of Road to Perdition.

One moment.

[sharkshark]

Originally Posted by Doctorossi

One of my buddies from the set in question was locked in for the lead in an indie a couple years later, until one of the stars of your first guess knocked him out of the role by virtue of his name value.

And the same thing had happened to him (by way of a different actor with name value) on the movie in question.

If you get anything from that hint, I'll move to another planet.

Yeah, I'm dredging this up again. You've given two hints, one that it was 19 years ago (and I hope that means the film came out in 1991, not shot in 1991), and that your friend has bad luck in being replaced.

If I'm still reading this correctly, your friend was an actor in a film that was to be released in 1991, but was replaced. So, you were on set on a film he ended up not being in.

Secondly, the only relevant film I can think for Furlong (who was the guy replaced in T3/T4) is American History X, and there's no indication that there was anybody else officially attached to the film. This is one of the earlier references to the film (http://www.variety.com/article/VR111...&query=furlong) and it already had EF attached.

Obviously you don't want me to guess...

At any rate, here's the list:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1991_in...leased_in_1991

There are a number of strong contenders - I'm sure that Backdraft uses some sort of dolly/zoom move to indicate the fear of fire, so that'd be by a decent guess, but that clearly was shot in Hollywood. I love that Barton Fink won the Palme D'Or that year, I actually didn't know that 'till I dug up that list! (Watched A Serious Man again for the gazillionth time a couple days back, what a flick)

There's lots of films out that year that don't seem as old as that - Cape Fear, Delicatessen. 1991 was the year of my first year of university. I'm old.

So, given that I stumbled on 12 Monkeys by accident, the Gilliam film that I was actually thinking of that came out in 1991, one shot in and around NYC, is Fisher King.

I'm slightly annoyed that it's clear you're not going to tell me, even if I'm right...

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Vincent Pereira

I've never heard of this type of shot referred to as a "trombone". I've always heard it referred to as a stretch. It's achieved rather simply, either by dollying in while zooming out at the same time, or vice versa (i.e., dolly out, zoom in). Scorsese actually does BOTH versions during the same shot with no cuts in GOODFELLAS when during the final act of the film Liotta meets up with DeNiro in the diner. When we did a variation of this kind of shot (using a hand-held camera no less) for my own itsy-bitsy 16mm movie A BETTER PLACE, we lovingly referred to it as "the Scorsese stretch".

Vincent

Vincent, it has many names but, I always liked the term “trombone shot”.

Here you go with a YouTube link to boot!
http://www.brokenprojector.com/wordpress/?p=21

[sharkshark]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

I had better reboot this topic with a visual aid so that you two guys don’t confuse other folks as it all started many pages back with me talking about Vertigo and Jaws having trombone shots...as a tangeant to our discussion of Road to Perdition.

One moment.

Already done: here's the wiki page

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dolly_zoom

and here's the youtube I linked to before

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y48R6-iIYHs

Now, what do you think a "reverse spielberg" would entail? Certainly not a "reverse Hitchcock", since the "Vertigo Shot", or dolly/zoom, actually goes in AND out at the top of the staircase

[Penton-Man]

Carry on gents.

[sharkshark]

Here's where I linked to it before, P-man.

Originally Posted by sharkshark

OK, so you're saying that Edward Furlong replaced your friend in an indie, and then was himself replaced? So I'm looking for a film that Furlong was =not= in? Yeah, that's a bit cryptic.

Here's a cool article about the history of the shot:
http://www.brokenprojector.com/wordpress/?p=21

K, I'm now guessing you were onset for 12 Monkeys, but you'll need to provide a wee bit more to have me guess who your friend is.

*****

Or, are you saying that Furlong was in American Heart, replacing your friend, and was himself replaced in T3/4 by Nick Stall and Christian Bale?

[sharkshark]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

Carry on gents.

You are a gracious host, as always...

I watched the House finale last night shot on the 5DMkII (here's the real Canon nerds going on about it: http://www.cinema5d.com/viewtopic.php?f=30&t=15246)

I swore that the episode -before- was the one shot on DSLR. The DOP shot two different styles, one the normal "cinematic" look, the other a heavily processed, lens-flarey, high contrast shot for extended flashback sequences.

Clearly this was a difference in DI, not capture method. Still, I found that far more interesting visually than the actual finale. Since continuing to watch that show is like suffering through a building collapse (Hugh Laurie being so excellent that it overcomes the hackneyed plot/characters), the ending was a fitting mess for a season where very little transpired.

[sharkshark]

amusingly, we might have found a good use for screenshots (shot with a dslr, no less... )

http://www.maximumpc.com/article/fea...red?page=0%2C2

Haven't read the article closely, but it seems to expose some of the issues discussed in this thread over the last year

[Doctorossi]

Originally Posted by sharkshark

If I'm still reading this correctly

You are not.

*Ahem*

The guy I was on set with was on set for a reason: he was still in the film, just no longer in the lead. He was once in the lead and he was also once in the lead of another film. He's the only one who was replaced, not any name actor.

It goes like this:

I was involved in the production of a film that featured a (noted at the time) dolly/zoom shot and was released in 1991. One of the people I hung out with on set is a guy who had been cast in the lead in that film. Before production began, he was bumped to a lesser role by the arrival of a name actor.

Later on, the same guy (the one who was bumped and you've never heard of) was cast in the lead in another movie. Then, he was bumped from that movie entirely by a different name actor- one who was in T2.

Originally Posted by sharkshark

I'm slightly annoyed that it's clear you're not going to tell me, even if I'm right...

Don't get cynical, shark; I'm not that cruel.

[sharkshark]

Good clarification.

Can you also confirm that you did not travel to be on set? If you were in Hollywood, or London, this makes it even more challenging.

Yes, I'm digging through the casting of every film from 1991. Sigh... What I don't do to procrastinate.

Originally Posted by Doctorossi

You are not.

*Ahem*

The guy I was on set with was on set for a reason: he was still in the film, just no longer in the lead. He was once in the lead and he was also once in the lead of another film. He's the only one who was replaced, not any name actor.

It goes like this:

I was involved in the production of a film that featured a (noted at the time) dolly/zoom shot and was released in 1991. One of the people I hung out with on set is a guy who had been cast in the lead in that film. Before production began, he was bumped to a lesser role by the arrival of a name actor.

Later on, the same guy (the one who was bumped and you've never heard of) was cast in the lead in another movie. Then, he was bumped from that movie entirely by a different name actor- one who was in T2.



Don't get cynical, shark; I'm not that cruel.

[sharkshark]

Oh, I found this little bit of goodness:

[sharkshark]

Huh:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/My_Own_Private_Idaho

Casting

Initially, no studio would finance the film because of its potentially controversial and off-beat subject matter. After Drugstore Cowboy received such favorable critical raves and awards, studios started to show some interest.[8] However, they all wanted their own versions made and not Van Sant's. This frustration prompted the filmmaker to attempt the feature on a shoestring budget with a cast of actual street kids filling out the roles and Michael Parker and actor Rodney Harvey, who was going to play Scott.[9]

Van Sant faced the problem of casting the two central roles. He decided to send the script to the agents of Keanu Reeves and River Phoenix, figuring that their agents would reject the script.[10] However, Reeves' agent was amenable to the project, but Phoenix's agent would not even show the screenplay to the young actor.[8] Not to be deterred, Van Sant got the idea for Reeves to personally deliver the film's treatment to Phoenix at his home in Florida.[10] Reeves did so over the Christmas holidays, riding his 1974 Norton Commando motorcycle from his family home in Canada to the Phoenix family ranch in Micanopy, Florida, outside Gainesville.[10] Reeves was no stranger to River Phoenix or members of his family, having worked previously with River on Lawrence Kasdan's I Love You to Death and with his brother Joaquin and girlfriend Martha Plimpton on Ron Howard's Parenthood. After reading the treatment, Phoenix agreed to play the role of Scott. However, since Van Sant had already cast Reeves in the role, they had to convince River to take on the edgier role of drug-addicted hustler Mike Waters. The director promised not to make either actor do anything embarrassing.[11] Van Sant got an offer of $2 million from an outside investor but when he put off production for nine months so that Phoenix could make Dogfight, the investor and his money disappeared.[12] Producer Laurie Parker shopped the script around and, at the time, New Line Cinema was in the process of branching out into producing arthouse films and decided to back Van Sant's vision with a USD$2.5 million budget.[8]

Look at what I'm learning here

[Doctorossi]

Originally Posted by sharkshark

Look at what I'm learning here

See- you thought you needed hints, but I knew you didn't.

[sharkshark]

Originally Posted by Doctorossi

See- you thought you needed hints, but I knew you didn't.

Oh, I'm not sure of that... I've never actually seen Idaho, weirdly. I wouldn't put it past Gus to use a dolly/zoom, mind you (well, I would now... having had the pleasure of watching the premiere of the desert schlepp that was Gerry)

This is like the worst contest ever...

[Doctorossi]

Originally Posted by sharkshark

This is like the worst contest ever...

You don't even know what you've won!

[sharkshark]

...oh, and if you were on the set of Point Break, well, that'd be awesome.

I request the answers to two questions:

- Is the film your friend was in out on Blu Ray?
- What was the year of the film that the actor from T2 replaced your friend?

Then I give up...

[Doctorossi]

Originally Posted by sharkshark

Then I give up...

Your threats to cease competition can no longer frighten me, being that you've already won.

[sharkshark]

Originally Posted by Doctorossi

Your threats to cease competition can no longer frighten me, being that you've already won.

ba ha!

OK, regale with tales of the set now...