"Club Penton" - Ask questions to Hollywood insider "Penton-Man"

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by 4K2K

The 55ZL2 (3840x2160) is supposed to be out in Europe in December this year, but from the web, some people say it's good but others not. Do you have any comments on it and are Sony and other manufacturers producing similar TVs?

55ZL2 - I presume that’s the Toshiba model? No, I haven’t seen it. On the other hand, Sony had a prototype 4k 3D (glass-free) 56 inch LCD panel on display at the last CES in Jan. All I can tell you is that this type of glasses-less solution is on the Sony R&D radar; otherwise, my lips are sealed.

After the last CES, I think that one of the magazines did some sort of visual comparison of all the glasses-free models/prototypes which were on the floor at the past CES, so, reading that may give you some idea of each brand/model’s relative strengths and weaknesses. Give me a moment and I’ll try to search for the article.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by RiseDarthVader

Hey Penton-Man,
Do you know for TRON: Legacy if the 2.35:1 scenes were shot with any sort of anamorphic lens or was the entire movie shot at 1.78:1 on the Sony F35 and the decision for the switching aspect ratios made entirely in post? Also were there any 2D>3D conversion shots in TRON: Legacy at all?

Seems like ages ago. Looking back, I find it ironic that prior to the worldwide premier, the first inside knowledge I gleaned on this Disney motion picture which contains a Light-cycle was during a Bi-cycle ride I did on Thanksgiving Day last year with fellow colleagues…..

https://forum.blu-ray.com/insider-di...ml#post4057329

To the best of my knowledge, the movie contains no 2D -> 3D converted material and all the 3D imagery is native 3D stereoscopy. The F35 camera has a native aspect ratio of 1.78:1 and Claudio used Arri Master Primes…..in essence, everything you’re seeing is the result of including or not including mattes on the top and bottom of the recorded image.

Let me first just say that I am an admirer of Claudio Miranda (the D.P. for Tron: Legacy)…..which I think is conspicuously evidenced by the fact that if you check out the music video in my signature, well, Claudio shot that; however, he’s probably best known to folks for his work on David Fincher’s The Curious Case of Benjamin Button.

Anyway, as an aside, Tron: Legacy is a nice example of thee rather unrecognized fact that the aesthetics of 3D imagery can be very subjective. Something of which I’ve alluded to in the past with this observation….https://forum.blu-ray.com/insider-di...ml#post4037788

It’s kind of similar to the way in which some people like their coffee strong and black, whereas others like a touch of cream and sugar and others like a chocolate milkshake masquerading as a cup of coffee. Anyway, the 3D in Tron: Legacy is subtle…very subtle because of the narrow depth budget. I can appreciate how this would appeal to many people….especially, newcomers to the format. Other viewers may feel that the 3D imagery is just too subtle (maybe 2.5 rather than 3D, as Jim Cameron likes to say), so why even bother viewing the 3D version at the theater or in your home on 3DBD if there’s hardly any perceived difference with that of the 2D incarnation. I can also appreciate their point of view.

Artistically, there is no right or wrong assessment for something as individually subjective as the aesthetics of 3D imagery, < of which I’m referring to the depth budget (within the limits of not inducing eye strain or headache, of course) because it based so much upon personal preference. So, people should not be too judgmental about that particular aspect of the 3D presentation. In other words, that 3D which doesn’t work for you, may indeed be the cat’s meow for another 3D film fan….and vice versa.

3D technical miscues related to uncorrected native stereo photography are an altogether different matter though which can result in needless artifacts such as alignment and polarization issues. Those things are objective errors and should be addressed by the filmmakers in post.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Scorxpion

Hello Penton and How are you?....For GOD sake do not do this for the Middle East Region because i know this does not exist outside this region.

Hi Scorxpion. Thanks for asking because I think I’ve turned a corner, health-wise.

James Brown - I Feel Good - YouTube

Anyway, as to your concern, it is duly noted and all I can do in this instance is to pass it on.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

...Give me a moment and I’ll try to search for the article.

^ Here - http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/art...deserves-shine

[Scorxpion]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

Hi Scorxpion. Thanks for asking because I think I’ve turned a corner, health-wise.

James Brown - I Feel Good - YouTube

Anyway, as to your concern, it is duly noted and all I can do in this instance is to pass it on.

Thank you very much Penton ,i know you will do it i appreciate your motivation towards Blu-ray fans and what you are doing for us in general.Again just would like to add one thing i feel good and happy from your answer.

[sharkshark]

Gearing up pre-TIFF, I just saw a film shot on a 50D MkII - true auteur film, credits are all the same guy:

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1922551/

review: http://filmfest.ca/2011/09/06/airirang/

[Anthony P]

Originally Posted by Scorxpion

Hello Penton and How are you? I know you are responsible for Columbia pictures or Sony Pictures and if you speak loudly your voice will be listened by others.In middle east region Sony Blu-ray 3D and FOX 3D are selling them as one disc edition no second disc for 2D playback one of the examples are RIO 3D and Priest 3D so if you don't have now 3D hardware compatibility just you collect for future viewing.My question is and very simple i like to collect 3D Blu-ray which does have another 2D disc for playback viewing at home. Like Tron Legacy done by Disney i bought it today i watch it as 2D and in future as 3D what is happening now is you have to buy them separately and pay too much money as if you are buying two different movies .For GOD sake do not do this for the Middle East Region because i know this does not exist outside this region.

I have the NA version of Priests, and even though it is a single disk and I don't think it says 2D anywhere it can be seen in 3D or 2D. Are you sure that they will only play in 3D where you are?

[PeterTHX]

Another 3D-TV "bombing":

http://www.nypost.com/p/entertainmen...ccfxYzpDLXx4iN

As you are privvy to actual TV sales, do you agree?

I really can't see 3D-TV taking off until they get rid of the glasses, that and a lot of software. Right now a few BD titles and a couple channels isn't going to cut it. Not for the pricing premium and the inconvenience of the glasses.

[raygendreau]

Originally Posted by Anthony P

I have the NA version of Priests, and even though it is a single disk and I don't think it says 2D anywhere it can be seen in 3D or 2D. Are you sure that they will only play in 3D where you are?

"The Blu-ray 3D specification is also designed to allow PS3 game consoles to playback Blu-ray 3D
content in 3D. Additionally, the specification supports playback of 2D discs in forthcoming 3D
players and can enable 2D playback of Blu-ray 3D discs on the large installed base of Blu-rayDisc players currently in homes around the world(excerpt from Blu-Ray Disk Association 3D Blu-ray specifications).

[4K2K]

Originally Posted by raygendreau

"Additionally, the specification supports playback of 2D discs in forthcoming 3D
players and can enable 2D playback of Blu-ray 3D discs on the large installed base of Blu-rayDisc players currently in homes around the world (excerpt from Blu-Ray Disk Association 3D Blu-ray specifications).

Yes, the specs allow for playback of 3D discs in 2D, but to play it back in 2D it has to have been authored in a way that allows it. Some 3D titles won't allow 2D playback of 3D discs because of how they are authored.

[Scorxpion]

Originally Posted by Anthony P

I have the NA version of Priests, and even though it is a single disk and I don't think it says 2D anywhere it can be seen in 3D or 2D. Are you sure that they will only play in 3D where you are?

Hi Anthony,

I read on back of the title to make sure it's also playable in 2D players but doesn't mentioning if its playable as 2D or 3D ,just only you have logo 3D.If you are saying it supposed to be like Resident evil after life playable in 2D or 3D at least this title mentioned 2D playback while Priest 3D NO.Are you telling me the single edition of Priest 3D you have it's also playable in 2D players,Are you sure?have you try it if it's supposed to be true why they don't mention on the back cover also playable in 2D Why!!!if you look for priest here in 3D the cover said it clearly one disc for 2D and 3D.
https://www.blu-ray.com/movies/Priest-3D-Blu-ray/25974/ whereas where i live in Lebanon on the cover no sign of 2D,the disc is made in Austria by Sony DADC.

I want to add RIO 3D also is single edition disc and not mentioning of 2D playback ,can Anyone confirm if i bought anyone of these can i play them at home through my PS3 or my panasonic player.RIO 3D you have does include another Blu-ray disc for 2D playback only.so i am lost here.

Thanks,

[ole geezer]

Originally Posted by PeterTHX

Another 3D-TV "bombing":

http://www.nypost.com/p/entertainmen...ccfxYzpDLXx4iN

As you are privvy to actual TV sales, do you agree?

I really can't see 3D-TV taking off until they get rid of the glasses, that and a lot of software. Right now a few BD titles and a couple channels isn't going to cut it. Not for the pricing premium and the inconvenience of the glasses.

If negotiations continue on their current course, it may be three and out for Panasonic's high-definition television deal with ABC's Monday Night Football. As it is, the negotiations provide a vivid example of the iffy status of HDTV today.

http://www.broadcastingcable.com/art...ks_heat_up.php

If history has taught us anything, it's that adoption of these wonderful technological advances takes time...

...Now in 56 percent of U.S. households, High Definition television is one of the most quickly adopted consumer entertainment technologies of the past 20 years, but true HD viewing is still far eclipsed by viewing of standard definition television...

http://blog.nielsen.com/nielsenwire/...g-lags-behind/

Note to Penton. Glad to see you're recovering.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by sharkshark

Gearing up pre-TIFF, I just saw a film shot on a 50D MkII - true auteur film, credits are all the same guy:

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1922551/

review: http://filmfest.ca/2011/09/06/airirang/

Well done. See if you can drag Dennis M with you to see one of those auteur films.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by PeterTHX

Another 3D-TV "bombing":

http://www.nypost.com/p/entertainmen...ccfxYzpDLXx4iN

As you are privvy to actual TV sales, do you agree?

I really can't see 3D-TV taking off until they get rid of the glasses, that and a lot of software. Right now a few BD titles and a couple channels isn't going to cut it. Not for the pricing premium and the inconvenience of the glasses.

Among other predictions, "tech analyst Phillip Swann” also said that Sony and Toshiba would reach an agreement to end the Blu-ray/HD DVD format war in ’07. For the record, it didn’t happen that way but, the war still ended.

Anyway, I gave out my personal pro-3D spiel very recently in a sea of 3D disparagement here…..https://forum.blu-ray.com/blu-ray-te...ml#post5157457

But, if you would like to do dueling 3D prognosticator online articles, then “Here's the trick, though”…http://www.pcworld.com/article/22736...it_or_not.html

[Anthony P]

Originally Posted by Scorxpion

Hi Anthony,

I read on back of the title to make sure it's also playable in 2D players but doesn't mentioning if its playable as 2D or 3D ,just only you have logo 3D.If you are saying it supposed to be like Resident evil after life playable in 2D or 3D at least this title mentioned 2D playback while Priest 3D NO.Are you telling me the single edition of Priest 3D you have it's also playable in 2D players,Are you sure?have you try it if it's supposed to be true why they don't mention on the back cover also playable in 2D Why!!!if you look for priest here in 3D the cover said it clearly one disc for 2D and 3D.
https://www.blu-ray.com/movies/Priest-3D-Blu-ray/25974/ whereas where i live in Lebanon on the cover no sign of 2D,the disc is made in Austria by Sony DADC.

I want to add RIO 3D also is single edition disc and not mentioning of 2D playback ,can Anyone confirm if i bought anyone of these can i play them at home through my PS3 or my panasonic player.RIO 3D you have does include another Blu-ray disc for 2D playback only.so i am lost here.

Thanks,

I have the Canadian version of priest 3D it is a single disk, and it did ask me 2D or 3D for playback and I used 2D since I don't have a 3D TV yet. I just went to look at it and there is a little sticker on the jacket that says you need glasses and a 3D TV to watch it in 3D but that it also contains 2D. So there is something there about 2D. As for the Lebanese version, I can't say what will happen. I was just pointing out that single disk does not necessarily mean it won't play in 2D. As for Rio, I don't have it.

[Anthony P]

Originally Posted by ole geezer

If history has taught us anything, it's that adoption of these wonderful technological advances takes time...

agree, and that is what makes articles like the one linked by Peter (no offence) so ridiculous.

You have ESPN saying 3D met and exceeded expectations for channel sales, but then you have a bunch of nobodies screaming "it is failing" and "not meeting expectations" because that is what they wish to be true (can't see any other reason to make comments that will make them look that dumb). Look at the survey guy he said 13% are planning to buy a TV in the next 12 months. First most people don't plan to buy a TV, theirs just brakes and they run out and replace it, second if we go with a TV having ~ 10 year life span (and let’s be honest many would say 20+) then 10% a year sounds like a very good number if evenly distributed. Does anyone in their right mind assume it will be 100% or even 50% or it should be much higher then 13%? No except these people that feal like saying 3D is not doing well.

[RiseDarthVader]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

Anyway, as an aside, Tron: Legacy is a nice example of thee rather unrecognized fact that the aesthetics of 3D imagery can be very subjective. Something of which I’ve alluded to in the past with this observation….https://forum.blu-ray.com/insider-di...ml#post4037788

It’s kind of similar to the way in which some people like their coffee strong and black, whereas others like a touch of cream and sugar and others like a chocolate milkshake masquerading as a cup of coffee. Anyway, the 3D in Tron: Legacy is subtle…very subtle because of the narrow depth budget. I can appreciate how this would appeal to many people….especially, newcomers to the format. Other viewers may feel that the 3D imagery is just too subtle (maybe 2.5 rather than 3D, as Jim Cameron likes to say), so why even bother viewing the 3D version at the theater or in your home on 3DBD if there’s hardly any perceived difference with that of the 2D incarnation. I can also appreciate their point of view.

Artistically, there is no right or wrong assessment for something as individually subjective as the aesthetics of 3D imagery, < of which I’m referring to the depth budget (within the limits of not inducing eye strain or headache, of course) because it based so much upon personal preference. So, people should not be too judgmental about that particular aspect of the 3D presentation. In other words, that 3D which doesn’t work for you, may indeed be the cat’s meow for another 3D film fan….and vice versa.

I have also noticed that TRON: Legacy despite being completely shot in 3D as you say that about half the people I talk to feel the movie had bad 3D or didn't "look" 3D. I myself really like the 3D in the movie but the first time I watched it at an IMAX Sydney advance screening did feel it could of played with the depth a little more. And some mid-shots with just the characters I found odd that little depth of field was present.

[Steedeel]

Penton Man, do you think Red Ray 4k technology could be on the market in several years?

[Scorxpion]

Originally Posted by Anthony P

I have the Canadian version of priest 3D it is a single disk, and it did ask me 2D or 3D for playback and I used 2D since I don't have a 3D TV yet. I just went to look at it and there is a little sticker on the jacket that says you need glasses and a 3D TV to watch it in 3D but that it also contains 2D. So there is something there about 2D. As for the Lebanese version, I can't say what will happen. I was just pointing out that single disk does not necessarily mean it won't play in 2D. As for Rio, I don't have it.

Hi Anthony,

I agree with what you have said here and if you look at the link posted in my thread above and have a look on the back cover of the 3D you can read clearly its 2D and 3D playback,whereas, in my country the back cover of the 3D doesn't mentioned at all 2D and 3D playback..this is my problem afraid to buy it then cannot be played at home.But i am confident because this disk is manufactured by Sony DADC in Austria so it should be the same copy like Europe maybe except some additional subtitles in Arabic for example.Hopefully Mr.Penton can answer me back soon.

[Objectivity]

Originally Posted by Anthony P

agree, and that is what makes articles like the one linked by Peter (no offence) so ridiculous.

You have ESPN saying 3D met and exceeded expectations for channel sales, but then you have a bunch of nobodies screaming "it is failing" and "not meeting expectations" because that is what they wish to be true (can't see any other reason to make comments that will make them look that dumb). Look at the survey guy he said 13% are planning to buy a TV in the next 12 months. First most people don't plan to buy a TV, theirs just brakes and they run out and replace it, second if we go with a TV having ~ 10 year life span (and let’s be honest many would say 20+) then 10% a year sounds like a very good number if evenly distributed. Does anyone in their right mind assume it will be 100% or even 50% or it should be much higher then 13%? No except these people that feal like saying 3D is not doing well.

AT&T Uverse dropped ESPN 3D because the usage fees weren't worth it for the buy in rate they had to 3D content in general. They're not following the fans, they're following the money.

Think about how most people watch TV. They turn to their favorite channels to see what's on or they go to specific shows. For most people, none of those are in 3D yet. Until that happens, broadcast 3D is a tough sell. Movies aren't a big draw either because the group mentality can't exist. When people first bought HDTVs they told their friends, "Come over and see this amazing picture." They can't do that with 3D. At best they can say, "Come over and see a really blurry picture and I'll let you put on special glasses for a few minutes to make it look good. Unfortunately, I have two pairs of glasses and there are seven of you."