4K Movies Releases

[Penton-Man]

Although I think I would kind of like to see (click on the blue box if it doesn't go thru) this one by the WB in HDR at home….

https://vimeo.com/127381179

[Adrian Wright]

Both San Andreas and Mad Max should look cool with HDR which brings me to a totally seperate purchasing dilemma and maybe one for another thread. When purchasing these movies in the future do I go for the 2D 4K HDR BD or the 3D 1080p BD release

I am hoping that these are seperate options, as including both in the same package could have a drastic effect on the over package price. I have noticed from one of the links which Penton kindly supplied that upcoming Disney/Pixar movie Inside Out is also getting a Dolby Vision release. Can CG animated cartoons benefit from HDR as I was under the impression that most CG animation was not finished at 4K. I maybe talking out of my backside here and prepare to stand corrected

Also, I am hoping that one HDR standard gets developed and pushed with UHDBD as confusion can be bad for any new format and early adoption.

[Geoff D]

You don't need 4K to have HDR, i.e. it's not dependent on spatial resolution, but as it turns out one is basically being pushed alongside the other so I can understand your confusion.

[jono3000]

Originally Posted by Adrian Wright

Both San Andreas and Mad Max should look cool with HDR which brings me to a totally seperate purchasing dilemma and maybe one for another thread. When purchasing these movies in the future do I go for the 2D 4K HDR BD or the 3D 1080p BD release

I am hoping that these are seperate options, as including both in the same package could have a drastic effect on the over package price. I have noticed from one of the links which Penton kindly supplied that upcoming Disney/Pixar movie Inside Out is also getting a Dolby Vision release. Can CG animated cartoons benefit from HDR as I was under the impression that most CG animation was not finished at 4K. I maybe talking out of my backside here and prepare to stand corrected

Also, I am hoping that one HDR standard gets developed and pushed with UHDBD as confusion can be bad for any new format and early adoption.

If the 1080p 3D release was not included with the 4K HDR release I would probably buy both

A CG rendered 1080p movie will still benefit from HDR as it is about providing a wider range of colours irrespective of resolution.

I wonder if we will see 1080p 3D HDR titles?

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Adrian Wright

that upcoming Disney/Pixar movie Inside Out is also getting a Dolby Vision release. Can CG animated cartoons benefit from HDR...

Yes.

The HDR version should aid with the shadow detail (of what there is in Inside Out) as well as the highlight rendition resulting in a wider contrast. Also, when the Ultra HD Blu-ray iteration becomes available to consumers, since its animation, the wider color gamut of UHD should help more with the colors than what you’d expect from live action (real life) content as a whole.

Kind of think of it as thee animated image at the top of p.31 from this download….https://raw.githubusercontent.com/je..._Color_VES.pdf becoming, to an extent, a little super-charged or *richer* in appearance by the HDR/WCG element of Ultra HD, regardless of the spatial resolution.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

Soooo, although by viewing that clip on your typical home display or perhaps someday mobile device (http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/beh...day-app-797968 ), you can’t really experience the ocular (that means ‘eye’) discomfort, I can tell you that while watching ~ 3PH from the 30” Canon HDR monitor which was showing that movie short at NAB, for example, at the very beginning where there’s the tracking shot of the mobster-type walking across the bar to hand the phone to his boss and immediately the setting switches to an exterior shot of a brightly lit scene with a desert backdrop and the father talking on the cell phone to the son….that abrupt transition made my eyes wince as they had no time to adapt to such a the large change in luminance.

Best not to have mastered that desert exterior so bright….

For completeness to the above ^ , I should add that the Canon display on which the short movie Trick Shot was being shown, was a 2,000 nit monitor.

[Penton-Man]

Sooo, there’s a big (might I add, not cheap) entertainment industry conference going on this weekend, the speakers being industry luminaries and, as a bonus, some being quite attractive to look at while they speak…. http://producedbyconference.com/la2015/speakers/

Being a 4K movie thread, rather than concentrating solely on the choice of an Arts career decision (as opposed to Dentistry, Nursing, Medicine, Law, Business, Teaching, Accounting) which Robert DeNiro so aptly already covered in a recent commencement address -

Robert De Niro gives amazing graduation speech to NYU grads - YouTube

I’ll offer some of my perspective(s) on comments made by panelists (http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/beh...gh-high-798991
in regards to 4K, HDR and Maintaining Creative Intent.

Give me a moment to limber up thee ol’ fingers.

[Penton-Man]

Panelist Comment -
Producers Guild president Lori McCreary admitted that with an expanding number of formats — for instance with high dynamic range (HDR) and higher resolution gaining more attention — she’s concerned about what productions will look like when they are displayed in eight or 10 years.

My perspective – Lori, don’t be concerned, as they’ll look better when displayed in 8-10 years.

Panelist Comment -
Director of photography Oliver Bokelberg (Scandal) added that he worries even today, saying, “No theaters are the same. They are too dark or too bright.”

My perspective – That should be the least of your worries. I would be more concerned that Shonda Rhimes doesn’t have the actors speaking even faster in the next season of Scandal; otherwise, we’ll all have to pre-medicate with a couple cups of coffee or other caffeinated beverage in order to follow the dialogue while relaxing at home….where we’re supposed to be winding down from a hard day’s work.

Panelist Comment -
ARRI president and CEO Glenn Kennel related that studio and manufacturer coalition UHD Alliance, for instance, is working on establishing more standardization around the characteristics in developing TV displays. And he’s hopeful that this will result in more consistent reproduction of images.

My perspective – Interoperability, yes. Consistency? not especially, if a base and premium option as to HDR is included as previously outlined here < to which I’ll add that Samsung is quite influential within the UHD Alliance.

[Penton-Man]

Panelist Comment -
Gareth Cook, senior broadcast colorist at Technicolor (Scandal), acknowledged that
1. for now, “unfortunately, things will look different” on different displays, and said he has found that an Apple iPad can be among the most consistent displays for checking image reproduction.
2. (He also got a laugh when he confirmed, “the dress was white and gold, I checked [in the grading suite].”)

My perspective -
1. Dem clients can be a picky lot
2. My testing experience showed mixed results and included a sample larger than 1....Although it paled in comparison to Bevil Conway’s 1,400 observers…. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencete...ial-light.html.

Take home message – “‘But it has become clear that it is a probe for understanding how the brain works.’
The findings are published in the journal Current Biology“

[Penton-Man]

That’s all the time I have for now folks. If there’s anything to add to the other paragraphs in the THR article covering yesterday’s ‘Picture Clarity’ panel, I’ll try to do so at a later time. Meanwhile, the organizers say to tune in 4 P.M. PST for some interviews from the conference - http://producedbyconference.com/la2015/

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

...Meanwhile, the organizers say to tune in 4 P.M. PST for some interviews from the conference - http://producedbyconference.com/la2015/

First interview was about the history and evolution of the Conference, so along that line, and in order for folks to appreciate how far and fast we’ve come with higher resolution (4K and above) image capture…. a sentimental look-back to the Camera Assessment series done at Wisteria Lane (Desperate Housewives) as presented at the Produced By Conference back in ’09, which included only one ‘4K’ digital camera among all the 8 cameras assessed….run the YouTube clip in this past posting - https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...er#post2663343

[singhcr]

Thanks for all of those juicy tidbits, Penton.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by singhcr

Thanks for all of those juicy tidbits, Penton.

And for you, film acquisition has not been entirely forgotten. Scroll down to ‘Panavision presents’ on Saturday… http://www.cinegearexpo.com/77/

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

...since its animation, the wider color gamut of UHD should help more with the colors than what you’d expect from live action (real life) content as a whole.

I should address one notable exception. Heads-up to Adrian, don’t read the following in order to avoid any possible anxiety -

Personally, looking back, I really desired XYZ colorimetry (rather than BT. 2020) for Ultra HD Blu-ray as mentioned about
1½ years ago , following which for a few pages, Richard and I wrangled out the pluses and minuses of adopting it in an advanced discussion.

Some might ask why….i.e. why so BIG (a color space)? Well, for one thing, I’m a fan of a pair of feet wearing these shoes (boots)… http://dot-color.com/2014/07/11/watc...whole-picture/ and if I could never get to see them in person, well, at least I wanted to see them someday on TV in their true bright blue glory. So, there you have it…

Truth be told, for one thing, I have a boot fetish.

[bailey1987]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

.

Some might ask why….i.e. why so BIG (a color space)? Well, for one thing, I’m a fan of a pair of feet wearing these shoes (boots)… http://dot-color.com/2014/07/11/watc...whole-picture/ and if I could never get to see them in person, well, at least I wanted to see them someday on TV in their true bright blue glory. So, there you have it…

Truth be told, for one thing, I have a boot fetish.

Wow fascinating read, I too would like to see the real colour of those boots on my TV.

[Penton-Man]

The march towards more real color continues. I’m not in San Jose, but when available, I would like to read the SID Display Week presentation paper ‘Closing in on Rec. 2020 – how close is close enough’? - http://www.businesswire.com/news/hom...k#.VW3d1M9Viko

For perspective, BT.2020 skeptical consumers probably don’t realize it, but when color grading monitors for the DCI P3 color space arrived on scene in post houses, they didn’t cover 100% of P3 either, nevertheless, they are/were damn good and only needed minor gamut mapping for more precision (professional use).

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

Personally, looking back, I really desired XYZ colorimetry (rather than BT. 2020) for Ultra HD Blu-ray as mentioned about
1½ years ago , following which for a few pages, Richard and I wrangled out the pluses and minuses of adopting it in an advanced discussion.

For the sake of completeness, I should add that Technicolor (not a studio) was also on-board for XYZ.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

Soooo, although by viewing that clip on your typical home display, you can’t really experience the ocular (that means ‘eye’) discomfort, I can tell you that while watching ~ 3PH from the 30” Canon HDR monitor which was showing that movie short at NAB, for example, at the very beginning where there’s the tracking shot of the mobster-type walking across the bar to hand the phone to his boss and immediately the setting switches to an exterior shot of a brightly lit scene with a desert backdrop and the father talking on the cell phone to the son….that abrupt transition made my eyes wince as they had no time to adapt to such a the large change in luminance.

Best not to have mastered that desert exterior so bright if that movie is intended to be seen with that monitor, or, as I posted more generically last April in regards to the HDR aspect of UHD, best….

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

subscribe to a philosophy of less = more in regards to abrupt changes in luminance between scenes, because even though the human visual system has great dynamic range, dark/light (and vice versa) adaptation is not instantaneous....Best not *overdo it* for the sake of making HDR images really *pop* and thusly get into a situation of viewer discomfort, like that of some early 3D releases which caused eye fatigue for yet another overly aggressive practice, namely….large, rapid changes in parallax.

The movie short, Trick Shot was just published last Thursday on Youtube. For easy reference to what I was describing above ^ regarding my sphincter muscle saying ‘OUCH’ (to clarify, that be the sphincter muscle in dee iris rather than dee anus), Anyway, the visually uncomfortable sequence of note (as was seen on Canon’s prototype 2,000 nit display at a 3PH viewing distance, runs from about 20 sec. to 26 sec.-

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UFAE...utu.be&t=0m20s

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

The movie short, Trick Shot was just published last Thursday on Youtube. For easy reference to what I was describing above ^ regarding my sphincter muscle saying ‘OUCH’ (to clarify, that be the sphincter muscle in dee iris rather than dee anus), Anyway, the visually uncomfortable sequence of note (as was seen on Canon’s prototype 2,000 nit display at a 3PH viewing distance, runs from about 20 sec. to 26 sec.-

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UFAE...utu.be&t=0m20s

And my irises are dark. I can just imagine how attendees with very light blue eyes responded to the sequence!....+OUCH.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

For the sake of completeness, I should add that Technicolor (not a studio) was also on-board for XYZ.

As was DTS and Dolby.