HDR Discussion Thread

[LordoftheRings]

Originally Posted by BrownianMotion

It's fast enough. 200 Mbps. I think I saw a bit rate of around 70 Mbps at one point during the broadcast, and around 30-50 another time, but I only had the advanced stats up very briefly, so I couldn't give you an estimate for the actual average.

70 is a nice HDR picture, 30-50 many 4K HDR Blu-rays they go there too.
I know, it's all very relative but still a nice piece of information about the Super Bowl's presentation on HDR 4K TV (or/and front projector).

[BrownianMotion]

Originally Posted by LordoftheRings

70 is a nice HDR picture, 30-50 many 4K HDR Blu-rays they go there too.
I know, it's all very relative but still a nice piece of information about the Super Bowl's presentation on HDR 4K TV (or/and front projector).

Like I said, I only checked a couple of times and very briefly. It very well may have gone significantly below that at times. In fact, I would bet that it did, given the artifacts I was seeing.

However, it was much better in terms of compression than the regular TV broadcast.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Waboman

The Shining Mt Dew with Bryan Cranston was probably my fav.

admeter rankings full results (winners and losers) of all 62 Super Bowl 2020 commercials –
https://admeter.usatoday.com/results/2020

*just after the singing of the National Anthem and prior to the kickoff, the not listed Top Gun: Maverick Big Game Spot trailer technically was a pregame commercial

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

Details -
“The production will work in ACES, shooting in 4K, 6K and 8K, and shifting between SDR and HDR by switching the ACES ODTs. All the data will go into the Amazon Web Services Cloud and the Microsoft Cloud, which will distribute relevant footage to the various collaborators, including AVID, Colorfront, frame.io FCP and Blackmagic, for dailies processing. Zeiss lenses will provide metadata to speed up the VFX work. A colorist will use FilmLight’s Truelight for on-set color, Live Grade for on-set color in Hollywood and Blackmagic’s Resolve for the final color. The Skywalker sound team will create a 7.1, 5.1, Stereo and immersive sound Ambidio version.”.....

“The finished film will be screened for the HPA audience at the close of the event. A projected cinema version will be shown in the conference room while other 8K and HDR versions will be shown on the days after in the innovation zone.”
https://www.tvtechnology.com/the-wir...-makes-a-movie

Scanning the particulars, I think most experienced, longtime readers here will be at least somewhat familiar with many of the faces and devices to be used in the live production at the upcoming Tech Retreat; however, something folks may be unfamiliar with that is truly cutting edge and should gain traction even with major studio productions is Stargate Studios' new real-time VFX process, ThruView - https://nabshow.com/2020/news-releas...duction-world/

For example, using ThruView, this automobile never left the stage -

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O8fVsTeEe-c#t=3m42s

So, to be clear, although not necessarily with Top Gun: Maverick, keep an eye out for ThruView's future use in VFX laden motion pictures, commercials, etc.

A detail not covered by the ^ TVTechnology reporter is that the short movie will be created with - https://www.pixelworks.com/en/truecut , one interesting feature of which (their motion video tool) we discussed several months ago - https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...t#post16791208

[Penton-Man]

Patrick Mahomes is youngest Super Bowl MVP ever l ABC News - YouTube

Patrick Mahomes is youngest Super Bowl MVP ever l ABC News - YouTube

Originally Posted by LordoftheRings

Who's that guy in a blue suit behind the quarterback

Originally Posted by Waboman

It's Pele

nope, maybe Danilo? - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Danilo...born_July_1991)

[gkolb]

Thought it might be Owner Clark Hunt, but now I don’t think so.

[Staying Salty]

Someone Used Neural Networks To Upscale An 1895 Film To 4K 60 FPS

https://www.digg.com/2020/arrival-tr...iotat-upscaled

[kfbkfb]

HDR - Content Creator vs. TV

Setup:
(UHD)TV able to display HDR from disc or create fake HDR
Same title - 4K/UHD w/HDR and regular Blu-ray

Play 4K/UHD HDR on (UHD)TV
then
Play regular Blu-ray ((UHD)TV set to create fake HDR)
compare

Ignoring the 4K/HDTV issue, does the TV created HDR
look about the same as the Content Creator HDR
(if so, why bother with Content Creator HDR)?


Kirk Bayne

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by BrownianMotion

I didn't do a thorough comparison, but I did switch to the SDR feed briefly, and the HDR made a pretty significant difference. The contrast, luminance of the highlights, skin tones, and colors, were all much better on the HDR feed. It was instantly noticeable, and everyone I had over (none were videophiles) said the exact same thing....

Did anyone notice better specular highlights off the players’ helmets than you normally see (or lack thereof) like with SDR shows? similar to the feature noted at about the 1 hour timestamp of this vimeo - https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...s#post15634694

[Penton-Man]

^ To be precise, here -> https://vimeo.com/203351189#t=1h10m36s

[BrownianMotion]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

Did anyone notice better specular highlights off the players’ helmets than you normally see (or lack thereof) like with SDR shows? similar to the feature noted at about the 1 hour timestamp of this vimeo - https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...s#post15634694

Yes. Specular highlights off the helmets was one of the areas of improvements, and the highlights in general looked great. The golden helmets of the 49ers were much more detailed and the color looked a lot more realistic compared to the SDR presentation.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

A detail not covered by the ^ TVTechnology reporter is that the short movie will be created with - https://www.pixelworks.com/en/truecut , one interesting feature of which (their motion video tool) we discussed several months ago - https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...t#post16791208

As a recently published tie-in to the ^ topic of motion artifacts with HDR - https://ieeexplore.ieee.org/document...ce=authoralert

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by PaulGo

The half time show was the exception where the HDR made a big impact.

Some viewers may be surprised to learn that the half time show was captured in SDR Rec 709 camera mode and then converted by which I assume (somewhat confidently) was BBC #6 and #12 LUTs – https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...e#post17317147
to produce the HDR HLG signal.

BBC R&D deserves a tip of the hat….or pole.

Originally Posted by PaulGo

From what I have read on other sites the 4K HDR reviews of the Super Bowel were a mixed bag where some said it was great and some had opinions similar to mine. I guess it was also influenced comparing the 4K HDR to the local OTA and cable picture quality.

At least it seems that the show didn’t look worse for the effort (for those who closely follow such live event offerings, some previous adventures in HDR/SDR productions arguably have suffered such a fate), so the discussion essentially comes down to how much better was it?.....incremental or quite significant. At the end of the day I just hope that this rather large scale HDR/SDR achievement by the Fox production crew wasn’t tainted or marginalized in viewers’ minds by any apparent mis-steps that happened by the various home devices/services (OTT, MVPDs, etc.) at the backend of the pipeline.

P.S.
Thanks for the feedback from BrownianMotion, PaulGo, PeterTHX and anyone else I missed. These next-gen live events haven't come around that often.

[Geoff D]

If the cameras were still operating in full-range 109% mode then that would ensure they captured an SDR image that played nicely in HLG, even if only converted quick and dirty like. (Heck, turning on HLG on mah teevee can actually have quite a nice effect with legacy SDR content, whereas applying PQ-based HDR usually looks putrid.)

[nws56]

Originally Posted by kfbkfb

HDR - Content Creator vs. TV

Setup:
(UHD)TV able to display HDR from disc or create fake HDR
Same title - 4K/UHD w/HDR and regular Blu-ray

Play 4K/UHD HDR on (UHD)TV
then
Play regular Blu-ray ((UHD)TV set to create fake HDR)
compare

Ignoring the 4K/HDTV issue, does the TV created HDR
look about the same as the Content Creator HDR
(if so, why bother with Content Creator HDR)?


Kirk Bayne

Its going to be very system dependent , and all I can tell you is that my Sony has this feature - they call it X- tended Dynamic range . It brightens everything up whilst preserving deep blacks , and is an obvious contrivance . Blow me if I haven't grown to actually like it. For stuff filmed in sunny climes it can feel like you are actually there.
I've never before experienced a TV that can recreate the feeling of being IN the Mediterranean sun. The av purist in me - and probably many others - recoils from the very idea of this fake hdr , but switching this feature off always leaves me unsatisfied now.
No, it is no substitute for a good 4k disc , but it does squeeze a bit more mileage from good ol' blu.
I subjected my wife to a session of switching this feature on and off... she always wanted it on.But you have to try it for yourself.

[Penton-Man]

exclusive behind the scenes setting up pic from October 2018 –


before this final composited scene as seen in the BIG GAME spot trailer of Top Gun: Maverick run just before the coin toss of the Super Bowl….

Top Gun: Maverick (2020) – Big Game Spot – Paramount Pictures - YouTube

Top Gun: Maverick (2020) – Big Game Spot – Paramount Pictures - YouTube

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

If the cameras were still operating in full-range 109% mode then that would ensure they captured an SDR image that played nicely in HLG, even if only converted quick and dirty like. (Heck, turning on HLG on mah teevee can actually have quite a nice effect with legacy SDR content, whereas applying PQ-based HDR usually looks putrid.)

In your own way I think you’re basically alluding to 5.1 in BT. 2048-20

Thee most futuristic camera at the event?
The new Sony 8K 3CMOS sensor camera with Canon lens which Fox Sports was using on a trial basis.

[LordoftheRings]

HDR Pro-Jektor anyone ...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_-yg...ature=youtu.be

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_-yg...ature=youtu.be

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AlOW...ature=youtu.be

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AlOW...ature=youtu.be

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by LordoftheRings

This show is taking place @ Dolby Theatre, Hollywood & Highland Center.

right across the street from where Jimmy Kimmel Live is taped….flashback - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2sAdIT4X-b8#t=34s

Originally Posted by LordoftheRings

....Blu-ray forum members should have their own Oscar's night...happening right here online...commercial-free, host-free, but with some good tunes (Opera music for example).
Then 'Parasite' can win all 6 nominated categories and almost everyone is happy.
And if 'The Irishman' doesn't win a single Oscar...that'll be the day.

Are you ready for the festivities LordoftheRings?

[LordoftheRings]

I sure ham Penton-Man...I even rented my tux.