Why I might be going format neutral soon and might start buying HD DVD movies - Blu-ray Forum

HDTV1080P · 08-31-2007, 06:55 PM

Why I most likely will be going format neutral soon and might start buying HD-DVD movies

I have been a movie collector for many years. I have never collected analog NTSC VHS movies since BETA has a better picture quality. I no longer own BETA anymore. My current collection contains several Laserdiscs, standard DVD’s, 1080I HDTV D-VHS, and BLU-RAY. I have always upgraded my favorite movies to the best version regardless of format.
The reason I am currently 100% behind the BLU-RAY format owning only BLU-RAY discs and no HD-DVD discs is because the BLU-RAY format technically is the best format. When 1080P/24 movies with 7.1 PCM surround sound is mastered on a 50GB disc using high bit MPEG-4/AVC or high bit rate VC-1 the quality is outstanding. BLU-RAY technically has more capacity and supports higher bit rates compared to the HD-DVD format. The old 1080I D-VHS format uses 50GB tapes which is the same capacity of BLU-RAY. It is a shame that the HD-DVD format only has 30GB of storage for movies. Yes both the BLU-RAY and HD-DVD camps plan to offer higher capacity discs but the fact remains that no matter how many layers used the BLU-RAY format will always have more capacity for high bit rate movies. Each layer of BLU-RAY disc contains 25GB compared to each layer of a HD-DVD disc is only 15GB.
This summer I almost upgraded all my DVD players to BLU-RAY players. Since Universal Studios use to be the only exclusive movie studio which was supporting HD-DVD it made perfect sense to go BLU-RAY only and to boycott Universal Studios as long as they remained HD-DVD exclusive. I was very busy this summer and I ended up delaying my plans to upgrade all my DVD players I own with under $500 BLU-RAY players. Now I am very glad I did not upgrade all my DVD players to BLU-RAY players with the recent announcement of Paramount Pictures joining Universal Studios and going HD-DVD exclusive.
There is no way I am going to purchase both a HD-DVD and BLU-RAY player for every room in the house I have a TV set. Also 90% of the mainstream consumers are not going to upgrade all their DVD players with two separate HDTV players. The most logical solution in this format war is for consumers to upgrade all their standard DVD players to a working combo player. The studios make the finally decision on which HDTV format they want to support. If I could wave a magic wand yes I wish the HD-DVD format would die, but at the same time most people are not going to boycott Universal Studios and Paramount Pictures for two years. The HD-DVD format does not have as good of picture quality as BLU-RAY since it does not support super high bit rates up to 48MB per second for both audio and video. The HD-DVD format can still display some amazing HDTV quality even though it is second best when compared to BLU-RAY high bit movies.
I am strongly considering purchasing the Samsung BD-UP5000 which is suppose to be the worlds first true working Universal combo player that plays both BLU-RAY and HD-DVD discs. Yes the BD-UP5000 is going to cost around $400 more just for the added feature to play HD-DVD discs at 1080P/24 compared to Samsung’s BD-P2400 which is a BLU-RAY only player. The BD-UP5000 will be Samsung’s top of the line flagship product and I might wait for a professional review before purchasing it. So coming this November consumers will have a choice to purchase either a BLU-RAY, HD-DVD, or Universal dual format player. Since the Samsung BD-UP5000 is going to list for $999.99 (prior list price $1049) this is a good deal. Denon will be releasing a BLU-RAY only player for $2,000 list price and the Pioneer BLU-RAY player lists for $999.99. So for $1,000 cheaper then the Denon one can own a dual format Samsung player. Of course the Denon player in theory will be better quality compared to the Samsung.
In the 4th quarter of 2008 (perhaps sooner) we should start to see a flood of Universal dual format combo players on the market for under $500 that play both BLU-RAY and HD-DVD discs. One of these days I might be tempted to upgrade all my DVD players to working dual format players since the BLU-RAY camp does not have 100% studio support.

This possible will be the next HDTV player I will own in November.
http://www.abtelectronics.com/images/products/PDF_Files/BD-UP5000_specs.pdf

jubaiweaponx · 08-31-2007, 07:23 PM

I understand your decision ,paramount was a big blow to me as well as alot of other blu-supporters ,I`m still going to see what kind of pressure the holidays puts on those "other studios". I do support blu -only but i have learned never to rush into anything so i`m in a holding pattern right now ,but i`m sure there are many others who feel the same way you do HD.
I have to say I love HD movies but i`m not gonna cave to a lesser format
because i`m impatient.....

pro-bassoonist · 08-31-2007, 07:31 PM

Since you have been a movie collector for many years then you more than perfectly understand that a niche market will not tolerate a broad library of product. Documentaries, foreign cinema, classics, will be unlikely to appear on multiple formats, let alone in mass numbers.

Becoming neutral is a vote of support for the current status quo: a squashed market of blockbusters and semi-blockbuster productions.

An informed and educated film lover, such as yourself, certainly understands whats at stake here. The opposite simply puts you in the "DVDCollector" category, a person who collects plastic discs, not a film-collector: a person who collects films on the best format currently available.

Sincerely,

Dr.A

buckshot · 08-31-2007, 07:56 PM

traitor. I take back what I said in the blu ray pledge of allegiance thread. we should shoot traitors. but I doubt we will.

GasCat · 08-31-2007, 08:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by buckshot

traitor. I take back what I said in the blu ray pledge of allegiance thread. we should shoot traitors. but I doubt we will.

Easy, easy! I think it's this damn humidity getting to both of you.

HDTV1080P · 08-31-2007, 08:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by buckshot

traitor. I take back what I said in the blu ray pledge of allegiance thread. we should shoot traitors. but I doubt we will.

I am not a traitor yet since I do not own any HD-DVD discs or products. Come November I will have to decide if I am going to buy the world’s first working combo player or if I will just continue boycotting Universal and Paramount HDTV movies.

glenn22 · 08-31-2007, 08:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HDTV1080P

I am not a traitor yet since I do not own any HD-DVD discs or products. Come November I will have to decide if I am going to buy the world’s first working combo player or if I will just continue boycotting Universal and Paramount HDTV movies.

You should just chill, all your favorites will be out on Blu-ray eventually. If you buy an HD-DVD player, then when it dies out you'll have to re-buy all those titles on Blu-ray.

Oh and your previous comment about all of us owning dual format players because they all play SD DVD? There is a big difference between backwards compatibility and dual format current generation players.

marzetta7 · 08-31-2007, 08:54 PM

I would save your $400 extra you are thinking of spending and simply use it on Universal and Paramount movies when they eventually cave after the holidays.

Why the rush? $400 is a lot of movies that you could spend on the Blu-ray format that is still supported by the majority of the Hollywood studios.

alain turgeon · 08-31-2007, 08:57 PM

IMO These players will be transition players for those who already have a collection of hddvds. Than they will be able to convert to blu-ray and still play their existing collection.

buckshot · 08-31-2007, 09:11 PM

come one petrolkitty and hd. i'm only kidding although this heat is getting to me. my (obscenity deleted) are so sweaty they are driving me (obscenity deleted) insane. can a man get some menthol gold bond powder for his (obscenity deleted) (obscenity deleted).

I love jay and silent bob. but to hdtv1080p's original statement. I can kind of understand your reasoning. but if you really wanted to get some hd dvds to collect i'd say wait until after the war when people start selling of their (already) obsolete hardware/software.

damnit downtown sd is humid as hell today.

KenThompson · 09-01-2007, 12:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by buckshot

traitor. I take back what I said in the blu ray pledge of allegiance thread. we should shoot traitors. but I doubt we will.

Ill second that. To buy a dud player just for a few movies is stupid. I love movies too, but there is no way in hell I'll give a dime of my money to Toshiba and Microsoft. They can both rot in hell along with their discs.

GasCat · 08-31-2007, 07:39 PM

That's a nice slick ad for the player. I love new electronics. Do whatever you want to do. It sounds like you are fairly torn and using the post as a way to get your thoughts out. Much of it was saying how superior Blu is to HD-DVD.

Their marketing campaign is obviously working. I am not going to be manipulated by them. Consider a rental service or borrowing them from friends, viewing them on a HD service such as Uni-HD.

I truly believe that any HD-DVD purchases are going to be worthless. The only question is when that will happen. You sound like you have the means to support your movie habit. You will be going to a company who has proved through their actions that they do not care about you as a customer.

I have been a movie junky for my entire life. There are so many hours of entertainment I could easily see again with Cagney, Stewart, Hepburn, Edward G. Robinson, etc. The bad part is I know the plots of almost every new movie. Still, that makes my decision not to purchase HD-DVD even easier.

I'm keeping my legs crossed and not bending over with my tail in the air. I don't need HD-DVD or Blu-Ray for that matter. Maybe what you need to do is reflect on your thoughts.

shug7272 · 08-31-2007, 07:40 PM

I say go for it man. I will not support it unless Blu Ray dies just out of principal. If they can take over the market fine Ill buy, if they cant then you are just helping prolong the ridiculous war.

jtconnolly · 08-31-2007, 07:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shug7272

I say go for it man. I will not support it unless Blu Ray dies just out of principal. If they can take over the market fine Ill buy, if they cant then you are just helping prolong the ridiculous war.

Thats right, you are helping prolong this war!

patrick99 · 08-31-2007, 07:45 PM

I too think that Blu-ray is clearly the technically superior format. For that reason, although I own an HD DVD player and formerly bought HD DVDs, I now refuse to do anything that helps the HD DVD format. I neither buy new HD DVDs nor even watch the ones I already own.

blujacket · 08-31-2007, 07:53 PM

You're exactly the person Micro$oft is banking on prolonging this war. Don't give in. HDdvd will die as long as we keep supporting Blu-ray. I can't see Universal staying exclusive that much longer either. Just say no to HDdvd.

BluBerry · 08-31-2007, 07:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HDTV1080P

The most logical solution in this format war is for consumers to upgrade all their standard DVD players to a working combo player.

This is the most rediculous statement I've seen on these boards. You could not be more wrong about this. How many more times does this have to be said? The home video market is not like the video game market. Consumers don't want combo players. They want one format to take home, knowing it will work on their player. That's why you are seeing places like Blockbuster begin to stock only Blu-Ray discs. Combo players at any price are not the answer.

HDTV1080P · 08-31-2007, 08:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BluBerry

This is the most rediculous statement I've seen on these boards. You could not be more wrong about this. How many more times does this have to be said? The home video market is not like the video game market. Consumers don't want combo players. They want one format to take home, knowing it will work on their player. That's why you are seeing places like Blockbuster begin to stock only Blu-Ray discs. Combo players at any price are not the answer.

Since the BLU-RAY format does not have 100% studio support then Universal HDTV dual format players is the only solution. In a way every BLU-RAY player is a dual format player since it plays standard DVD’s and BLU-RAY discs. So every BLU-RAY owner already owns a dual format player. Yes if I choose a dual format HDTV player the format war will be over for me and I can just start collecting movies again.

GasCat · 08-31-2007, 08:28 PM

I'd get a Blu-Ray recorder and get the movies I want off the air. Have you seen HD on cable? Is it that horrendous that it can't help your thirst for movies not on Blu-Ray for a few years?

DrinkMore · 08-31-2007, 08:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GasCat

I'd get a Blu-Ray recorder and get the movies I want off the air. Have you seen HD on cable? Is it that horrendous that it can't help your thirst for movies not on Blu-Ray for a few years?

Unless you have ComCrap where it blocks, de-syncs, or audio drops out for a few seconds. Other than that it's COMCASTIC!

08-31-2007, 06:55 PM	#1
HDTV1080P Blu-ray Champion Top contributor Member since:Jan 2007 Blu-ray reviews: 205	Why I might be going format neutral soon and might start buying HD DVD movies Why I most likely will be going format neutral soon and might start buying HD-DVD movies I have been a movie collector for many years. I have never collected analog NTSC VHS movies since BETA has a better picture quality. I no longer own BETA anymore. My current collection contains several Laserdiscs, standard DVD’s, 1080I HDTV D-VHS, and BLU-RAY. I have always upgraded my favorite movies to the best version regardless of format. The reason I am currently 100% behind the BLU-RAY format owning only BLU-RAY discs and no HD-DVD discs is because the BLU-RAY format technically is the best format. When 1080P/24 movies with 7.1 PCM surround sound is mastered on a 50GB disc using high bit MPEG-4/AVC or high bit rate VC-1 the quality is outstanding. BLU-RAY technically has more capacity and supports higher bit rates compared to the HD-DVD format. The old 1080I D-VHS format uses 50GB tapes which is the same capacity of BLU-RAY. It is a shame that the HD-DVD format only has 30GB of storage for movies. Yes both the BLU-RAY and HD-DVD camps plan to offer higher capacity discs but the fact remains that no matter how many layers used the BLU-RAY format will always have more capacity for high bit rate movies. Each layer of BLU-RAY disc contains 25GB compared to each layer of a HD-DVD disc is only 15GB. This summer I almost upgraded all my DVD players to BLU-RAY players. Since Universal Studios use to be the only exclusive movie studio which was supporting HD-DVD it made perfect sense to go BLU-RAY only and to boycott Universal Studios as long as they remained HD-DVD exclusive. I was very busy this summer and I ended up delaying my plans to upgrade all my DVD players I own with under $500 BLU-RAY players. Now I am very glad I did not upgrade all my DVD players to BLU-RAY players with the recent announcement of Paramount Pictures joining Universal Studios and going HD-DVD exclusive. There is no way I am going to purchase both a HD-DVD and BLU-RAY player for every room in the house I have a TV set. Also 90% of the mainstream consumers are not going to upgrade all their DVD players with two separate HDTV players. The most logical solution in this format war is for consumers to upgrade all their standard DVD players to a working combo player. The studios make the finally decision on which HDTV format they want to support. If I could wave a magic wand yes I wish the HD-DVD format would die, but at the same time most people are not going to boycott Universal Studios and Paramount Pictures for two years. The HD-DVD format does not have as good of picture quality as BLU-RAY since it does not support super high bit rates up to 48MB per second for both audio and video. The HD-DVD format can still display some amazing HDTV quality even though it is second best when compared to BLU-RAY high bit movies. I am strongly considering purchasing the Samsung BD-UP5000 which is suppose to be the worlds first true working Universal combo player that plays both BLU-RAY and HD-DVD discs. Yes the BD-UP5000 is going to cost around $400 more just for the added feature to play HD-DVD discs at 1080P/24 compared to Samsung’s BD-P2400 which is a BLU-RAY only player. The BD-UP5000 will be Samsung’s top of the line flagship product and I might wait for a professional review before purchasing it. So coming this November consumers will have a choice to purchase either a BLU-RAY, HD-DVD, or Universal dual format player. Since the Samsung BD-UP5000 is going to list for $999.99 (prior list price $1049) this is a good deal. Denon will be releasing a BLU-RAY only player for $2,000 list price and the Pioneer BLU-RAY player lists for $999.99. So for $1,000 cheaper then the Denon one can own a dual format Samsung player. Of course the Denon player in theory will be better quality compared to the Samsung. In the 4th quarter of 2008 (perhaps sooner) we should start to see a flood of Universal dual format combo players on the market for under $500 that play both BLU-RAY and HD-DVD discs. One of these days I might be tempted to upgrade all my DVD players to working dual format players since the BLU-RAY camp does not have 100% studio support. This possible will be the next HDTV player I will own in November. http://www.abtelectronics.com/images/products/PDF_Files/BD-UP5000_specs.pdf

08-31-2007, 07:23 PM	#2
jubaiweaponx Special Member Member since:Mar 2007 Location:collingdale,pa Blu-ray collection:304	indeed I understand your decision ,paramount was a big blow to me as well as alot of other blu-supporters ,I`m still going to see what kind of pressure the holidays puts on those "other studios". I do support blu -only but i have learned never to rush into anything so i`m in a holding pattern right now ,but i`m sure there are many others who feel the same way you do HD. I have to say I love HD movies but i`m not gonna cave to a lesser format because i`m impatient.....

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08-31-2007, 07:31 PM	#3
pro-bassoonist Blu-ray reviewer Top contributor Member since:Jul 2007 Location:X Home Theater Gallery:47 4K collection:- Blu-ray collection:- DVD collection:- Blu-ray reviews: 31 Trading Score:23	Since you have been a movie collector for many years then you more than perfectly understand that a niche market will not tolerate a broad library of product. Documentaries, foreign cinema, classics, will be unlikely to appear on multiple formats, let alone in mass numbers. Becoming neutral is a vote of support for the current status quo: a squashed market of blockbusters and semi-blockbuster productions. An informed and educated film lover, such as yourself, certainly understands whats at stake here. The opposite simply puts you in the "DVDCollector" category, a person who collects plastic discs, not a film-collector: a person who collects films on the best format currently available. Sincerely, Dr.A

08-31-2007, 07:56 PM	#4
buckshot Blu-ray Guru Member since:Feb 2007 Location:san die ego Blu-ray reviews:2 Trading Score:9	traitor. I take back what I said in the blu ray pledge of allegiance thread. we should shoot traitors. but I doubt we will.

08-31-2007, 08:54 PM	#8
marzetta7 Special Member Member since:Feb 2006	I would save your $400 extra you are thinking of spending and simply use it on Universal and Paramount movies when they eventually cave after the holidays. Why the rush? $400 is a lot of movies that you could spend on the Blu-ray format that is still supported by the majority of the Hollywood studios.

08-31-2007, 08:57 PM	#9
alain turgeon Active Member Member since:Aug 2007 Location:Trois-Rivieres Quebec Canada Blu-ray collection:670 Blu-ray reviews:5	IMO These players will be transition players for those who already have a collection of hddvds. Than they will be able to convert to blu-ray and still play their existing collection.

08-31-2007, 09:11 PM	#10
buckshot Blu-ray Guru Member since:Feb 2007 Location:san die ego Blu-ray reviews:2 Trading Score:9	come one petrolkitty and hd. i'm only kidding although this heat is getting to me. my (obscenity deleted) are so sweaty they are driving me (obscenity deleted) insane. can a man get some menthol gold bond powder for his (obscenity deleted) (obscenity deleted). I love jay and silent bob. but to hdtv1080p's original statement. I can kind of understand your reasoning. but if you really wanted to get some hd dvds to collect i'd say wait until after the war when people start selling of their (already) obsolete hardware/software. damnit downtown sd is humid as hell today.

08-31-2007, 07:39 PM	#12
GasCat Special Member Member since:Jan 2007 Blu-ray reviews:1	That's a nice slick ad for the player. I love new electronics. Do whatever you want to do. It sounds like you are fairly torn and using the post as a way to get your thoughts out. Much of it was saying how superior Blu is to HD-DVD. Their marketing campaign is obviously working. I am not going to be manipulated by them. Consider a rental service or borrowing them from friends, viewing them on a HD service such as Uni-HD. I truly believe that any HD-DVD purchases are going to be worthless. The only question is when that will happen. You sound like you have the means to support your movie habit. You will be going to a company who has proved through their actions that they do not care about you as a customer. I have been a movie junky for my entire life. There are so many hours of entertainment I could easily see again with Cagney, Stewart, Hepburn, Edward G. Robinson, etc. The bad part is I know the plots of almost every new movie. Still, that makes my decision not to purchase HD-DVD even easier. I'm keeping my legs crossed and not bending over with my tail in the air. I don't need HD-DVD or Blu-Ray for that matter. Maybe what you need to do is reflect on your thoughts.

08-31-2007, 07:40 PM	#13
shug7272 Active Member Member since:Jan 2007	I say go for it man. I will not support it unless Blu Ray dies just out of principal. If they can take over the market fine Ill buy, if they cant then you are just helping prolong the ridiculous war.

08-31-2007, 07:45 PM	#15
patrick99 Special Member Member since:Jun 2007	I too think that Blu-ray is clearly the technically superior format. For that reason, although I own an HD DVD player and formerly bought HD DVDs, I now refuse to do anything that helps the HD DVD format. I neither buy new HD DVDs nor even watch the ones I already own.

08-31-2007, 07:53 PM	#16
blujacket Blu-ray Guru Member since:Jun 2007 Location:Dayton,Ohio 4K collection:70 Blu-ray collection:658	You're exactly the person Micro$oft is banking on prolonging this war. Don't give in. HDdvd will die as long as we keep supporting Blu-ray. I can't see Universal staying exclusive that much longer either. Just say no to HDdvd.

08-31-2007, 08:28 PM	#19
GasCat Special Member Member since:Jan 2007 Blu-ray reviews:1	I'd get a Blu-Ray recorder and get the movies I want off the air. Have you seen HD on cable? Is it that horrendous that it can't help your thirst for movies not on Blu-Ray for a few years?

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