UV Uncertainties (UV vs. iTunes vs. Blu-Ray)

[linuxhack3r]

A little backstory, I have 120+ iTunes HD movies from over the years. However, recently UV has caught my attention and I am nearly convinced that it is the better system.

I have typically been an "Apple Fanboy". Apple TV, AirPort Extreme, iPad's and iPhone's, MacBook's, you get the very expensive and exclusive picture.

However, recently I've been drawn back to Android (I started on that one with the original Motorola Droid). I tried a Nexus 5 when Kit Kat was just released, but I ended up iPhoning it up again because of my extensive movie collection in iTunes.

Yet, UV has some benefits that iTunes does not, notably:

• More "Codes"
• Better Cross-Platform Compatibility
• Potentially Higher Quality (I Think)

However, in reading reviews on the internet (admittedly, a lot of them were several years old), and I wanted them addressed here.

Something I read regarded that you don't own the movies, simply a license to view them. That is typical, but what I was reading hinted that some/all of the licenses would expire after a few years (not the codes, but the UV movie itself would expire from your library after a number of years).

Something I read regarded an extreme loss of privacy (particularly Warner Brothers). I assume it was talking about if you had some software installed on your computer (D2D or something?).

So it is great that you can use VUDU/Flixter/etc to watch your movies. Yet what exactly is "UV"? Apple is one of the biggest companies in the world and is not likely to "go anywhere". Who is behind "UV" and how likely is it to stay around for a very, very long time?

On quality. I've read that VUDU is supposed to offer the best streaming quality, calling it HDX. Yet, I was reading an article on the internet, and it speaks of:

As far as streaming goes, a minimum connection speed of 4.5Mbps is required to watch movies in "HDX," which is Walmart's name for its 1080p resolution content that streams at 24 frames per second. That's Blu-ray quality and the standard frame rate for film-based content. However, not all 1080p HDTVs can display 1080p/24; only those with a 120Hz or higher frame rate are capable. A TV with 1080p 60 fps will not display HDX. Moreover, PC, Mac, and iPad users can only access VUDU at the standard definition rate of 480p.

Surely that isn't true? If it is, please enlighten me. I only have 60hz because I didn't feel like 120hz or higher was worth it at the time (I thought it was a gimmick). Since then, I have retracted that now that I know how TV's work a bit more. But I figure 60hz>24fps, right? Something about a 2:3 pulldown? Also, it does suck that "mobile" devices can only do SD. Has that changed at all?

I currently use the Apple TV. I am considering getting rid of all Apple devices. As such, I'd have probably 50-100 movies I'd have to repurchase UV. That could get expensive, but I feel with D2D and more "codes" I could potentially grow my library quicker and cheaper than if I stick with iTunes in the long term.

It makes since, I use Amazon's Kindle library because it is cross-platform vs. Apple's "iBooks". So why didn't I start UV from the get-go instead of iTunes?

One of my biggest gripes about the whole UV scene is that the interfaces for most apps suck (VUDU on Xbox One, Vudu on iOS, etc). I don't think anyone could argue that iTunes is much more highly polished. Perhaps someday this will change.

Also, something I am concerned about is that I am shooting myself in the foot. I am attempting to "build" my favorite movie library, but then many will be re-released in the form of 4k eventually. I wonder which service offers the best track record of allowing some form of "upgrade structure" vs having to repurchase completely?

[Zu Nim]

Originally Posted by linuxhack3r

However, in reading reviews on the internet (admittedly, a lot of them were several years old), and I wanted them addressed here.

You might want to check out the UV Demystified FAQ.

Something I read regarded that you don't own the movies, simply a license to view them. That is typical, but what I was reading hinted that some/all of the licenses would expire after a few years (not the codes, but the UV movie itself would expire from your library after a number of years).

Your license is perpetual. Whether the retailer you're trying to view your movie through has negotiated a license for that movie is a different matter. That is, you may have a perpetual UV license for The Matrix. CinemaNow may not have negotiated a license with the studio for that movie, so you'd need to find another retailer to watch it through.

Something I read regarded an extreme loss of privacy (particularly Warner Brothers). I assume it was talking about if you had some software installed on your computer (D2D or something?).

Don't know anything about this.

Also, it does suck that "mobile" devices can only do SD. Has that changed at all?

Some WB content is in HD when using Flixster. I don't think VUDU does HD on mobile devices yet, but they did update their app recently...

Also, something I am concerned about is that I am shooting myself in the foot. I am attempting to "build" my favorite movie library, but then many will be re-released in the form of 4k eventually. I wonder which service offers the best track record of allowing some form of "upgrade structure" vs having to repurchase completely?

No way to know. Apple did a fine job going from 720p to 1080p - no cost. I don't think anyone could even pretend to know what will happen with 4k. It could be a free perk of "ownership" in order to keep consumers purchasing (versus streaming). It could be an additional cost.

[AZBrowncoat]

My family has a mixture of devices, both Android and iOS, and for my particular situation iTunes works "better" as one significant drawback for me (at least until or if CFF is launched) is the inability to download a movie or TV episode ONCE and then utilize that same download across all iOS devices - Apple TV, iPhones, iPads etc.

As of yet that is one functionality that UV lacks that is extremely important to me personally.

[VC2020]

I prefer Apple too & with the shift that's happening I would trust Apple at offering some kind of upgrade option over others (though it's possible no one will).

I do use Kindle for books over iBooks though. iBooks are too expensive and Kindle works with apps & dedicated ebook readers. If I could port my kindle books to iBooks, I would.

[linuxhack3r]

Originally Posted by VC2020

I prefer Apple too & with the shift that's happening I would trust Apple at offering some kind of upgrade option over others (though it's possible no one will).

I do use Kindle for books over iBooks though. iBooks are too expensive and Kindle works with apps & dedicated ebook readers. If I could port my kindle books to iBooks, I would.

But on the flip side if you purchase an SD version you only have the option of repurchasing it at full price of you want HD. That bugs me.

At least VUDU allows you to turn DVD's into HDX. $2.50 per disc if you do at least 10 at a time.

[VC2020]

Originally Posted by linuxhack3r

But on the flip side if you purchase an SD version you only have the option of repurchasing it at full price of you want HD. That bugs me.

At least VUDU allows you to turn DVD's into HDX. $2.50 per disc if you do at least 10 at a time.

Vudu does have D2D but they also have multiple versions of a single movie. SD, HD, HDX, Extras, etc. iTunes offers Extras on any HD movie as they become available and they did shift from 720p to 1080p and some TV shows have a complete my season option to upgrade to HD. I think the reason movies can't be upgraded from standard to HD has to do with studios. But I do still hope that option will be available. It's cool that Disney did that with old blu-ray digital copies.

So far Disney and Apple are doing it best IMO. If Keychest went beyond Disney and included everything available with UV I'd be very happy.

[linuxhack3r]

I am wondering if services like DMA will someday be the norm. Headed by the studios linking different services.

[VC2020]

Originally Posted by linuxhack3r

I am wondering if services like DMA will someday be the norm. Headed by the studios linking different services.

I'd imagine they'd have to be eventually. No one's winning this format war.

[huskerbear]

Unless your already all in, locked into Apple with lots of itunes purchases I don't think it would make any since to go that route to start a new digital collection. There are way to many advantages with UVs growing system to consider anything else IMO.

[VC2020]

Originally Posted by huskerbear

Unless your already all in, locked into Apple with lots of itunes purchases I don't think it would make any since to go that route to start a new digital collection. There are way to many advantages with UVs growing system to consider anything else IMO.

What are some of the advantages other than more copy codes?

[huskerbear]

Originally Posted by VC2020

What are some of the advantages other than more copy codes?

The biggest advantage in my opinion is the ability to use disc to digital to get a UV movie into your collection. I also like the "never lose your rights" guarantee, but I know that can be picked apart in the lawyer talk of course. Family sharing has been wonderful from the beginning and with UV you don't have to be very concerned about buying only from one company or losing access to your movies....top of my head....

[Cranston37]

I have Apple everything but I can't justify buying movies through iTunes over UV. I chose early on that my purchases would be made through the "official" means of UV and DMA only.

Right now there is only one worth service IMO in Vudu, as they are the only place to watch UV and DMA, not to mention D2D. Until every service offers that (including iTunes) I think the digital landscape will really start to sputter as far as growth.

[steve_dave]

There have been no reports of a loss of privacy, just the fact that you have to create a UV account that asks for an email address. Warner supports Flixster and signing up for Flixster is far easier by just linking it to your Facebook (if you have one).

The only problem with UV is that while the file is yours as long as you have your UV library, its still dependent on retailer support as mentioned earlier in this thread. Vudu offers the largest amount of support but even then issues can arise.

You see, you own the right to the film but the actual stream comes from the provider.

If Vudu carries the movie you own but it does not have the UV logo, you won't be able to enjoy it without paying again through Vudu. The same happens for other providers, Target Ticket may not have Bend It Like Beckham in their catalog at all so despite the fact that I own the UV right to the film, I can't play it there. Matter of fact, Vudu is the only provider who has this film. On the flipside, I bought the Silent Night, Deadly Night double bill from Target Ticket because the price was nice. Unfortunately, up until last month, I couldn't watch it in Vudu. Vudu had it but it was not UV compatible through them until last month. Then it showed up in my Vudu library.

That also means you're at the mercy of the provider's digitial library. My Underworld digital copy says Unrated in the description, art, and it said that when I did D2D. Lo and behold, it was the R rated version and unfortunately, I can't do a thing about this. Vudu doesn't carry the unrated version, no provider does.

Now, again, on the opposite end: I try to use Target Ticket now to redeem my UV codes and when I redeemed Anchorman 2, the only choice was the unrated version. So that's what I have in my UV library. The other providers only give you the R rated theatrical version when redeemed through them.

Now, here is the even more evil rub, some providers may have streams with the wrong aspect ratio or SD only. Vudu is notorious for this one, Demolition Man & Underworld are both 1.78:1 cropped. Cinemanow, Target Ticket, and Flixster have the proper 2.39:1 ratios. And Amelie is only avaialble through all providers in 1.78:1 cropped, no one has the proper 2.39:1 presentation.

Apple at least ensures that consistency happens because well, their the only provider. Sure, UV has more options for playback but until the UV consortium puts it foot down and forces the retailers to adhere to standards... its going to be messy transitioning to all digital.

Personally: I watch mostly through Vudu, redeem through Target Ticket, and use my PS3 to get the best audio from the experience.

[linuxhack3r]

Admittedly all of the different versions (unrated, extended, extended with bonus, etc) do seem a bit of a confusing but. I would love to see Amazon jump behind UV and take on Apple head on.

[linuxhack3r]

Originally Posted by linuxhack3r

Admittedly all of the different versions (unrated, extended, extended with bonus, etc) do seem a bit of a confusing but. I would love to see Amazon jump behind UV and take on Apple head on.

And resolutions.

[echopulse]

Also, each of the studios involved with UV had to pay hundreds of thousands of dollars in fees to set up UV, so its in their best interest to keep it going, and to stay with it. They are just not going to pull out and pay the millions it would probably take to develop their own system, that probably nobody would use.

[linuxhack3r]

So supposedly some movies redeem in SD or HD, up to the studio, regardless of whether the code is from a Blu-Ray.

So, what is considered the "best source" for looking that up freely? I found the two stickies in the Digital Movies section, but they seem less than complete.

Also, in reading the specs for UV, it seems to me that only SD/HD exist in HD. HDX is something of Vudu's obviously. Does that mean, typically speaking, that and "HD UV" movies will be HDX in Vudu?

Or is it possible to have a code redeem in HD but not HDX on Vudu if it is truly UV compatible?

I'm so close to "jumping in", I just need a push.

[squatting hen]

Originally Posted by linuxhack3r

So supposedly some movies redeem in SD or HD, up to the studio, regardless of whether the code is from a Blu-Ray.

So, what is considered the "best source" for looking that up freely? I found the two stickies in the Digital Movies section, but they seem less than complete.

Also, in reading the specs for UV, it seems to me that only SD/HD exist in HD. HDX is something of Vudu's obviously. Does that mean, typically speaking, that and "HD UV" movies will be HDX in Vudu?

Or is it possible to have a code redeem in HD but not HDX on Vudu if it is truly UV compatible?

I'm so close to "jumping in", I just need a push.

I would say 99.9% of the time now if the code is from a blu ray, it will give you a HD copy of the movie in your UV account. If it is from a DVD 98% of the time it will give you a SD movie in your UV account. You can link your UV account with Vudu. Vudu sees your HD movies and will play them in their HDX format. (it all depends on your bandwith. if you dont have enough, it might only play HD or SD) If it is SD, Vudu will play it in SD. HDX is Vudu's highest quality and name they created.

I have never (nearly 600 movies in my account) had a code redeem HD but not HDX.

Vudu just accesses your UV account, once you give it that right.

[Zu Nim]

Originally Posted by linuxhack3r

Also, in reading the specs for UV, it seems to me that only SD/HD exist in HD. HDX is something of Vudu's obviously. Does that mean, typically speaking, that and "HD UV" movies will be HDX in Vudu?

Or is it possible to have a code redeem in HD but not HDX on Vudu if it is truly UV compatible?

As you noted, UV has no notion of HDX. If you own the UV HD rights to a film, and VUDU has an HDX copy, you'll be able to view that film in HDX. There might be an edge case where that doesn't happen - maybe someone has a story - but I haven't heard it.

[Tok]

And I just can't see this model continuing indefinitely. The service owner wants to get paid. If the vast majority of users are using codes that were included with a disc then how is the service provider making money. I'm seeing a little cottage industry now where the disc buyers are recouping some of their cost by selling codes. The studios and service providers can't be happy about that.

I admit I use services in a crunch and to keep my Disney discs safe from little hands. But in the long term I really don't need a code for lesser quality streaming version.